Vent and OAK crammed together?

[mrjohneel]

I just had my licensed chimney sweep in to do a final cleaning before I install a pellet insert -- I've decided on a Harman P35I. But he noted that I have an unusually small flue -- a bit less than 8" square. Now, I'm set on installing an OAK even though my installer (really, all installers I've talked to) suggested I don't need one. Quick question: it appears the 4" vent and the 3" oak will just fit in my flue. Is it OK for them to be butting against each other all the way to the top? I'll run it by the installer but I thought I'd throw it out there. Thanks in advance.

 

[smoke show]

Selkirik Direct Temp pipe uses the outer jacket of the pipe for OAK.

http://www.selkirkcorp.com/metalbest/Product.aspx?id=7390

So yes I think its ok, but its not my decision.

 

[superchips]

I've seen it installed in new construction. Mostly for gas. Some jurisdictions won't allow it or seriously limit it's max length. Not because of it's durability, but due to it's inability to being inspected and serviceability. If the outer shell or inner shell fails it may leak into the living space.
In your case it is probably in a single chamber clay chimney.
Not what I would want to do, but in your case it maybe the best. If there is another route to run the OAK, I would recommend looking into it.
Good luck and welcme to the word of pellet heat.

 

[John97]

My insert is getting installed Thursday. OAK is going out through the back wall of the masonry fireplace. They are going to chisel out two bricks in the center to get outside. It might be something for you to consider.

 

[mrjohneel]

Thanks John97, but my chimney is located internally. In other posts I've discussed going down through the ash dump, then out a basement window. But I guess my question is this: Is the OAK vent made of some material that makes it unable to be placed next to -- in effect, connected to, side-by-side -- the hot vent pipe?

 

[John97]

Didn't even think about an internal chimney. Doh! I remember your other thread now.

OAK is supposed to be made of metal because under certain conditions it can discharge smoke and hot air (i.e. a power outage while the stove is burning away).

 

[superchips]

It depends wether the exhaust pipe is double walled pellet vent or single wall (flex) pellet vent. If it is single wall then the heat would melt normal OAK vent pipe. You would have to upgrade the OAK to SS vent $$$
Simpson pellet pipe's website has all the info you could need.
http://www.duravent.com/Index.aspx

I originally bought 30` of pellet vent flex, then because of the heat on the old brick in my chimney decided to go all the way up with double wall 4" simpson pellet vent. Now I know I'm good for several more years.

 

[fmsm]

My P35i was installed about 3 weeks ago without OAK, I simply took off the cover to the ash dump (as advised by the stove companies installer) so the stove can draw from there. I did have my Englander OAK run into the ash dump with no problems and my P35i is working great like this.

 

[mrjohneel]

FMSM, putting the OAK issue aside for a moment, I'd be interested to hear about the P35I -- noise? how's it heating your space? something you didn't expect? any other issues? Thank you in advance.

 

[fmsm]

I am very satisfied, I have found the stove burns better for me with a 100% hardwood pellet. Softwoods or even NEWP leave a sticky residue. I have not tried corn yet but have 100 lbs in the shed to try this week.

My only complaint is that he glass gets dirty very fast. That may be due to burnin some softwood and will hopefully get better as I burn off the residue. By getting dirty fast I am talking about being able to see the air marks on the bottom of he glass after 10 minutes! While the glass gets a grayish brown tint from the top down the bottom gets a black sooty triangle in between the air wash vents. I can post a picture tomorrow if you would like. Other than that I am VERY happy!

If you want to talk pm me and I will shoot you my number, I am in Whitman.

 

[Aries412]

Not a question on venting, but rather one on the insert itself. Briefly our situation: Installed p35i early Dec only to have it smoke us out of the house almost instantly. Called dealer, who came right out next day, turns our the insert was missing some welds. It was replaced, and we just had the new one installed yesterday. We still smell smoke. Not like before where you could visibly see smoke, but you can smell it when the fire dies down. Called dealer, they once again came right out. They even threw a smoke bomb in the stove looking for leaks and nothing. So we ignited the stove again. The installer who was here also said he thought he could smell smoke, but it was a brief whiff, which I agreed. The dealer Said he didn't smell smoke, but rather the curing process. OK, its been almost 24hrs (we did hot burn for total of 6-8 hrs). Still smoke smell on low fire. Just curious if you have experienced this at all? Our stove vents out the chimney as well as the OAK.

 

[superchips]

A lot of pellets stoves can smell for a little bit on a COLD start. It should go away in ~5 min or so and you shouldn't see smoke ever.

 

[fmsm]

Not a question on venting, but rather one on the insert itself. Briefly our situation: Installed p35i early Dec only to have it smoke us out of the house almost instantly. Called dealer, who came right out next day, turns our the insert was missing some welds. It was replaced, and we just had the new one installed yesterday. We still smell smoke. Not like before where you could visibly see smoke, but you can smell it when the fire dies down. Called dealer, they once again came right out. They even threw a smoke bomb in the stove looking for leaks and nothing. So we ignited the stove again. The installer who was here also said he thought he could smell smoke, but it was a brief whiff, which I agreed. The dealer Said he didn't smell smoke, but rather the curing process. OK, its been almost 24hrs (we did hot burn for total of 6-8 hrs). Still smoke smell on low fire. Just curious if you have experienced this at all? Our stove vents out the chimney as well as the OAK.

I caught a wiff of smoke smell for about the first 2 weeks after my P35i was installed, it lasted about 3-5 minutes after the stove would start up from cold and was not visible. I have a digital CO2 sensor placed about 12 feet from the stove and that never changed from a reading of 0 nor did the smoke detector in the room ever go off (unlike sometimes when my wife cooks) at all. Mine was only a wiff and now is completely gone after a little over 3 weeks.

I would make sure there is a CO2 and smoke sensor in the room and not worry about it if they do not go off.

 

[Aries412]

Thanks for your fast replies: I could understand a smell after a cold start, but this also happens when the fire gets low. We didn't notice it when it was going through the 'cure' process, as that smell was def paint/oil smell. This is smoke. It's almost a blessing to hear that someone else has similar issues. However, I hate to think we have to wait for weeks.... lets just say the dealer and installer are on our speed dial.

Meanwhile I think I'll send my spouse out for a CO2 sensor. ;-)

 

[badabing]

I am very satisfied, I have found the stove burns better for me with a 100% hardwood pellet. Softwoods or even NEWP leave a sticky residue. I have not tried corn yet but have 100 lbs in the shed to try this week.

My only complaint is that he glass gets dirty very fast. That may be due to burnin some softwood and will hopefully get better as I burn off the residue. By getting dirty fast I am talking about being able to see the air marks on the bottom of he glass after 10 minutes! While the glass gets a grayish brown tint from the top down the bottom gets a black sooty triangle in between the air wash vents. I can post a picture tomorrow if you would like. Other than that I am VERY happy!

If you want to talk pm me and I will shoot you my number, I am in Whitman.

I have the P35i insert also and for the most part I'm very happy with my choice. I agree with you about the glass becoming dirty quickly, starting at the bottom right side of the glass. I have addressed this problem and some paint flaking on the handle and one hinge with the dealer. If you don't mind posting a picture I would like to compare the "dirty glass".

Thanks, David

 

[mrjohneel]

Just made a downpayment. Harman P35I set to be installed Jan. 18. Now I have to find pellets at the peak of the market.

 

[fmsm]

I am very satisfied, I have found the stove burns better for me with a 100% hardwood pellet. Softwoods or even NEWP leave a sticky residue. I have not tried corn yet but have 100 lbs in the shed to try this week.

My only complaint is that he glass gets dirty very fast. That may be due to burnin some softwood and will hopefully get better as I burn off the residue. By getting dirty fast I am talking about being able to see the air marks on the bottom of he glass after 10 minutes! While the glass gets a grayish brown tint from the top down the bottom gets a black sooty triangle in between the air wash vents. I can post a picture tomorrow if you would like. Other than that I am VERY happy!

If you want to talk pm me and I will shoot you my number, I am in Whitman.

I have the P35i insert also and for the most part I'm very happy with my choice. I agree with you about the glass becoming dirty quickly, starting at the bottom right side of the glass. I have addressed this problem and some paint flaking on the handle and one hinge with the dealer. If you don't mind posting a picture I would like to compare the "dirty glass".

Thanks, David

I just took a picture today This is after less than a day burning and a good cleaning with a proper glass cleaner made for wood/pellet glass.

 

[fmsm]

Just made a downpayment. Harman P35I set to be installed Jan. 18. Now I have to find pellets at the peak of the market.

I'm not sure what town your in but the folks at South Shore Woodpellets in Holbrook are very nice! I picked up 15 bags of Logik-e's (I really like this pellet) and 15 bags of Barefoots (I have not had a chance to try them yet) last week.

If I may ask where did you buy your stove and how much did it cost you?

 

[mrjohneel]

I got the p35i insert with 35' vent, special vent cap to allow air into chimney where my OAK terminates --$4200 installed. Buchanan in Medford, MA.
Your thoughts? And thanks for the pellet recommendations.

 

[badabing]

I am very satisfied, I have found the stove burns better for me with a 100% hardwood pellet. Softwoods or even NEWP leave a sticky residue. I have not tried corn yet but have 100 lbs in the shed to try this week.

My only complaint is that he glass gets dirty very fast. That may be due to burnin some softwood and will hopefully get better as I burn off the residue. By getting dirty fast I am talking about being able to see the air marks on the bottom of he glass after 10 minutes! While the glass gets a grayish brown tint from the top down the bottom gets a black sooty triangle in between the air wash vents. I can post a picture tomorrow if you would like. Other than that I am VERY happy!

If you want to talk pm me and I will shoot you my number, I am in Whitman.

I have the P35i insert also and for the most part I'm very happy with my choice. I agree with you about the glass becoming dirty quickly, starting at the bottom right side of the glass. I have addressed this problem and some paint flaking on the handle and one hinge with the dealer. If you don't mind posting a picture I would like to compare the "dirty glass".

Thanks, David

I just took a picture today This is after less than a day burning and a good cleaning with a proper glass cleaner made for wood/pellet glass.

Interesting, very similar to my glass except the air marks on the bottom only go half way, right to left. The other difference is they only go up about 1/2" from bottom. The dealer suggested lowering the air intake, which I tried, but the stove did not burn as well.

 

[fmsm]

I got the p35i insert with 35' vent, special vent cap to allow air into chimney where my OAK terminates --$4200 installed. Buchanan in Medford, MA.
Your thoughts? And thanks for the pellet recommendations.

I paid $3400 complete after tax and delivery from a dealer down the cape. This included a $100 deduction from the installation price as I already had a 4" flexible liner and chimney cap from my Englander and of course there was no charge for pipe. It also included a "free" ton of NEWP that were valued by the dealer at $200 if I didn't want them. I probably should have saved the $200 as they will be going on Craigs List in the spring for $4.50-$5.00 a bag. I would dump them now but I have stacked my good stuff on top of them and I'm just slightly worried about pellet availability come Febuary/March and may need to burn a few bags. Even though I hate them I hate Depot pellets more!

 

[Aries412]

We've had issues with our insert smoking, but am happy to report it's all been taken care of now. Just wanted to post a pict of the glass for comparison after a day and half (36hrs give or take) of continuous burning. Both on room temp and stove temp. Low and high fires. We have the log set, which isn't in this pict, as I forgot to put it back in. Corny, but the 'log' makes my spouse feels more like a real fire and less like a stove.
Aries

 

[fmsm]

We've had issues with our insert smoking, but am happy to report it's all been taken care of now. Just wanted to post a pict of the glass for comparison after a day and half (36hrs give or take) of continuous burning. Both on room temp and stove temp. Low and high fires. We have the log set, which isn't in this pict, as I forgot to put it back in. Corny, but the 'log' makes my spouse feels more like a real fire and less like a stove.
Aries

You're glass is much cleaner than mine after a day, what are you burning for pellets? Room or stove temp? Settings? Was this with the log set in?

 

[RKS130]

Somewhere on here there is a thread in which it is stated that according to a manufacturere (I think Harman but I am not ceertain) the OAK need not run all the way to the top of the chimney, but only needs about 4' - if I am remembering that part correctly. You might want to run that one down.