Welder Q's

[Dune]

Ya, for me I mostly just buy 6013's and drag them. I test the heck out of my settings on scrap, and live with whatever they look like. I often say "I'm no welder, but I can stick metal together"

I have been a professional welder for 30 years and I have no use for 6013 whatsoever, especialy for the work you are doing with the machine you have. Buy some 6011.

 

[madrone]

When I teach welding, I require my students to weld a perfect Oxy/acetylene weld before I let them touch the MIG. Proper prep and HEAT CONTROL. After that, process is pretty much irrelevant. I think the MIG is great for general purpose use, but only if you really have a handle on welding. An inverter with a tig/stick setup would be my perfect one welder scenario, but mig/flux core is probably more practical for most people. I love the stick welder for bang for the buck, but mig is just nicer to use.

 

[oldspark]

When I teach welding, I require my students to weld a perfect Oxy/acetylene weld before I let them touch the MIG. Proper prep and HEAT CONTROL. After that, process is pretty much irrelevant. I think the MIG is great for general purpose use, but only if you really have a handle on welding. An inverter with a tig/stick setup would be my perfect one welder scenario, but mig/flux core is probably more practical for most people. I love the stick welder for bang for the buck, but mig is just nicer to use.

Don't you think for general all around welding dirty, rusty, thick, thin, vertical, hortizonal, ect, ect, that a arc welder is the best option. Mig welders are a little more fussy but can be super for some things but give me a stickwelder for "gettin it done".

 

[madrone]

The stick welder is pretty versatile. I like tig best for that very same reason, grab the right rod and go to work. Mig is somewhat limited by your wire, gas, and the size of the machine, but if you know what you're doing you can lay down a great weld in nothing flat. Mig welds in all positions, too. Stick probably is the best choice on the farm, but if I had to choose, I'd take the mig just based on ease of use and control.

 

[oldspark]

I used to weld some in a packing plant and it seemed like the lite work (fabrication) was mig and tig but the heavy stuff we arc welded and as the plant became all stainless steel the tig welder was used a lot. But as you said (madrone) on the farm I think the arc is the best all around choice.

 

[kenny chaos]

Ya, for me I mostly just buy 6013's and drag them. I test the heck out of my settings on scrap, and live with whatever they look like. I often say "I'm no welder, but I can stick metal together"

I have been a professional welder for 30 years and I have no use for 6013 whatsoever, especialy for the work you are doing with the machine you have. Buy some 6011.

I like to use 6011 for dirty and thin metal and 7018 for clean and thick.
6013 is a good all around, general purpose but I like it mostly for overhead work
because it fast freezes.
But, I'll mix and match them any day.
(6021 for overhead too)

 

[ikessky]

I used to weld some in a packing plant and it seemed like the lite work (fabrication) was mig and tig but the heavy stuff we arc welded and as the plant became all stainless steel the tig welder was used a lot. But as you said (madrone) on the farm I think the arc is the best all around choice.

We weld heavy plate all day where I work and our guys use nothing but mig. Mig, sub-arc mig, and robotic mig.

 

[oldspark]

Ya, for me I mostly just buy 6013's and drag them. I test the heck out of my settings on scrap, and live with whatever they look like. I often say "I'm no welder, but I can stick metal together"

I have been a professional welder for 30 years and I have no use for 6013 whatsoever, especialy for the work you are doing with the machine you have. Buy some 6011.

I like to use 6011 for dirty and thin metal and 7018 for clean and thick.
6013 is a good all around, general purpose but I like it mostly for overhead work
because it fast freezes.
But, I'll mix and match them any day.
(6021 for overhead too)

6011 is a faster freeze rod than 6013, it has a much smoother looking bead than 6011, 6011 is great for dirty stuff like you said, for real crappy metal you can use 6010 but I do not like it very well.

 

[oldspark]

I used to weld some in a packing plant and it seemed like the lite work (fabrication) was mig and tig but the heavy stuff we arc welded and as the plant became all stainless steel the tig welder was used a lot. But as you said (madrone) on the farm I think the arc is the best all around choice.

We weld heavy plate all day where I work and our guys use nothing but mig. Mig, sub-arc mig, and robotic mig.

We were rather crude in what we did compared to your usage, but I do no one thing, when you go into a rendering building and you cant clean the surface you are welding on your going to like the arc welder with the 6011 or 6010 rod.

 

[burntime]

I still can not be convinced that a mig welder is not the way to go for a homeowner. I own arc and mig and use the mig much more often and results show its holding. Arc only comes out for the big thick stuff!

 

[oldspark]

I still can not be convinced that a mig welder is the way to go for a homeowner. I own arc and mig and use the mig much more often and results show its holding. Arc only comes out for the big thick stuff!

If I understand your post correctly I assume you are for the mig (?) welder, for a person who only uses one once in a while to build a simple device or a quick repair I think the arc just makes more sense, I would never consider a mig for what I do.

 

[burntime]

I like to play with tractor stuff... The arc is nice, but if it gets thin, mig is the way to go for me. If your welding big stuff, then I agree with you. Most of my stuff is smaller gauge and rarely goes over 1/4

 

[kenny chaos]

Wire welders are referred to as glue guns for a reason, they can make metal stick together.
But it ain't welded.

 

[burntime]

Kenny, you are just argumentative. I have 3 buddies that are iron workers that can weld with all machines, arc, mig, tig... Thats who taught me. Any welder in the wrong hands is useless. The more practice you get, the better you get at it. The glue gun analogy came from the gun with a trigger. Not from the strength.

 

[oldspark]

I like to play with tractor stuff... The arc is nice, but if it gets thin, mig is the way to go for me. If your welding big stuff, then I agree with you. Most of my stuff is smaller gauge and rarely goes over 1/4

1/4 is beefy, even with my limited skills I can weld some fairly thin material with the correct rod.

 

[kenny chaos]

Kenny, you are just argumentative. I have 3 buddies that are iron workers that can weld with all machines, arc, mig, tig... Thats who taught me. Any welder in the wrong hands is useless. The more practice you get, the better you get at it.

?

 

[ikessky]

Wire welders are referred to as glue guns for a reason, they can make metal stick together.
But it ain't welded.

Again, our guys at work are welding 1" and up all day every day with MIG welders. If someone doesn't know what they are doing, any welder is going to just gob metal together. You need some form of welding knowledge regardless of the equipment you use.

Also, our shop used to use arc welders back in the day. If arc was really that much stronger than MIG, they would have never switched. Our welders are all certified and our quality department is very strict on structural welding.

 

[kenny chaos]

Listen up knuckleheads.
Mig is great.
It is NOT for the beginner garage, hobby, yuppie, person.
Cheese o' pete already.
Get off my back.
"Kenny is argumentative." [flame bait deleted by Mo. Carry on.]

 

[burntime]

You just proved me right. Thanks.

 

[ikessky]

Kenny, I will agree with you that MIG looks easy (turn the dial and pull the trigger) and that is why most beginners are drawn to it. In essence, I think that is what you are trying to say. However, to say that it's not for beginners, homeowners, etc. is like saying that everyone should learn to drive with an automatic because a manual is more difficult.

 

[oldspark]

I am going to eat crow I guess, went to a couple of welding sites and the mig is a lot more recomended than I would have guessed, an arc welder compared to a mig welder is like a old wood burner compared to a EPA stove, I stand corrected.

 

[kenny chaos]

to say that it's not for beginners, homeowners, etc. is like saying that everyone should learn to drive with an automatic because a manual is more difficult.

Think man. It's just the opposite. Learn to drive the manual first.
Learn to arc first.
You guys all on crack or what?

 

[Gooserider]

This thread is getting a bit out of hand, so it's getting closed... Lets try being a bit nicer to each other next time around...

Gooserider (in Mod mode...)

 

[madrone]

I've seen some piss-poor stick welds, and I've seen some beginners who make great mig welds with no previous experience. I personally believe the mig is easier to learn if you've never welded at all before. I believe you can do anything with a mig that you can do with a stick welder. Like I said, I teach my students gas welding first, so I'm sure they understand the basic premise: heat control. Then they can use whatever process they choose and be sure of a good weld.

The issue with mig vs. stick for a homeowner is in what you get for the price. You can get a 220v buzz box for less than the price of a 110v mig. If you need to weld over 1/4", you probably want a stick welder. If you're welding smaller stuff, you'll be happier with a wire-feed. If you have the money, buy a 220v mig and you'll be happier than you would with either of those.

Look, you can do everything those machines do with an oxy/acetylene rig, plus cutting and bending, but few do these days. Give me a 220v mig, a plasma cutter, and an inverter tig. I really love gas welding, but only for fun. The new technology is better.

Edit: HAHA! I win.

Just kidding.

 

[fossil]

OK, so much for quibbling about welding. I hope the OP got at least some useful information out of this thread. Time to find something else to irritate each other about. Rick