Wood Cutting on Shares

[ddklahr]

I would like some input on this scenario:

We dozed out a tree line last Summer in order to rebuild about a 1/2 mile of fence. We had an individual approach us about cutting up some of the oak trees that were pushed over and layed out for easier cutting. While gone on vacation, his crew came in and took out 6 2-ton truck loads of oak logs and didn't leave us anything. He told us it was roughly 10-15 cords of wood that he re-sells for $300/cord. We had told him we would allow him to do it as long as he hauled us some of the logs since we had the expense of the dozer work. During the process, he also went in when it was extremely muddy and got suck 3 different times causing him to rut up our pasture pretty good. We told him he needed to bring back 2 truck loads of the logs for our share. Were we out of line?

 

[Backwoods Savage]

You absolutely are not out of line! Sounds like he knew when you were on vacation and took advantage. Also, where he got stuck, that ruins a field for a while. And cutting on 1/3-2/3 sounds like a good deal for this one.

 

[billb3]

Having had to do a cease and desist on someone for a similar situation, I really do hope they bring you back something .
I won't ever do it again without hiring someone to sit and count and watch.

 

[Thistle]

Nope you werent out of line in the least.He screwed you over & should remedy the situation to your satisfaction.

 

[ddklahr]

I appreciate the comments. No, they won't be allowed back in there. I hope we get a couple loads back. I was counting on it to finish up my supply for next year. I have to have small splits with my type of stove, so I am not too worried about seasoning at this point.

 

[rdust]

Yep, a 1/3, 2/3 deal is right in line. That's what I would expect if I cut on shares.

 

[smokinj]

I would like some input on this scenario:

We dozed out a tree line last Summer in order to rebuild about a 1/2 mile of fence. We had an individual approach us about cutting up some of the oak trees that were pushed over and layed out for easier cutting. While gone on vacation, his crew came in and took out 6 2-ton truck loads of oak logs and didn't leave us anything. He told us it was roughly 10-15 cords of wood that he re-sells for $300/cord. work. During the process, he also went in when it was extremely muddy and got suck 3 different times causing him to rut up our pasture pretty good. We told him he needed to We had told him we would allow him to do it as long as he hauled us some of the logs since we had the expense of the dozer bring back 2 truck loads of the logs for our share. Were we out of line?

Not sure what the question is? What deal was make how much should you get how much should he get? Where is the deal here? truck load here 2 truck loads there? What was the deal made? If I made this deal with you would get the brush and I would move the weight.................Just not sure on this one? Why would anyone share unless there is help in the labor?

 

[rdust]

Just not sure on this one? Why would anyone share unless there is help in the labor?

Pretty simple, if you want someones tree's you share. Good rule of thumb is person cutting gets 2/3, the person who provides the tree's gets a 1/3. Some of us get lucky enough where people give us tree's but if I needed wood I'd cut on shares without blinking an eye. I may actually next year with a neighbor who has 30 acres of woods across the road.

 

[smokinj]

Just not sure on this one? Why would anyone share unless there is help in the labor?

Pretty simple, if you want someones tree's you share. Good rule of thumb is person cutting gets 2/3, the person who provides the tree's gets a 1/3. Some of us get lucky enough where people give us tree's but if I needed wood I'd cut on shares without blinking an eye. I may actually next year with a neighbor who has 30 acres of woods across the road.

lol The rule of thumb is what the OP and this guy made! Nothing clear I under stand there, other than everyone's Opion...That means Nothing. I would never start my saws for such a deal....And I cut all the TIME! NOW OP WHAT DEAL DID YOU MAKE?

 

[ddklahr]

Here is what was verbally agreed to:

He was allowed to go in and log out the oak. His share 2/3 our share 1/3. We didn't have to allow him to go in. He was in a bind because he needed oak to provide to a BBQ joint that he contracts wood to.

He called while we were on vacation to see if he could see where the wood was. We told him to walk in because it was too muddy to take vehicles into the native pasture. We get back from vacation and discover 3 different places where the 2-ton truck had gotten stuck in the mud and tore up several parts of the pasture. We also discovered that he left us no wood for our 1/3 share. That is why we were upset about the situation.

He and his son did bring back 2 loads of wood today. They weren't any of the larger logs (15-24") but he did bring some back to us. He did own up to the mistake and made it right with us in our eyes. One thing is for sure, regardless of who it is, we probably won't be trying to help others out in a similar situation. We really hate to be that way because it is not our nature at all, but we don't like being taken advantage of either. A man's word should be a man's word.

 

[smokinj]

Here is what was verbally agreed to:

He was allowed to go in and log out the oak. His share 2/3 our share 1/3. We didn't have to allow him to go in. He was in a bind because he needed oak to provide to a BBQ joint that he contracts wood to.

He called while we were on vacation to see if he could see where the wood was. We told him to walk in because it was too muddy to take vehicles into the native pasture. We get back from vacation and discover 3 different places where the 2-ton truck had gotten stuck in the mud and tore up several parts of the pasture. We also discovered that he left us no wood for our 1/3 share. That is why we were upset about the situation.

He and his son did bring back 2 loads of wood today. They weren't any of the larger logs (15-24") but he did bring some back to us. He did own up to the mistake and made it right with us in our eyes. One thing is for sure, regardless of who it is, we probably won't be trying to help others out in a similar situation. We really hate to be that way because it is not our nature at all, but we don't like being taken advantage of either. A man's word should be a man's word.

If thats the agreement then thats what it is.....Your first post did not sound like that...I do this kinda of thing alot. Move heavy loads, Not a deal I would ever made but sounds like he made good....There is No rule of thumb on this kinda of stuff it really up to you two to get along! (be very clear on any deal you make) Keep it simple.

 

[rdust]

Glad the guy made it good, too bad about the pasture though. I know Dennis(BWS) has had similar issues with his property getting tore up in the past.

 

[shawneyboy]

Glad he got you some wood. I think the biggest mistake was allowing him on the property when you were out of town. You then lost control of the situation. It sucks that he tore up the pasture. I wouldn't ever work with him again since he did what he wanted to do regardless of what you said but, hind sight is 20/20.

Shawn

 

[smokinj]

Bull dozer where in this area and if a pick-up truck can damage or rut it......Thing is if your want heavy weight move the ruts really a non-issue. Heck Fire him! (bet the rest will rot) Lots of man hours cost money and he is paying the bill. For him to even have a chance of making a time he has to work them selfs to death. (even if he got 100 percent) Like to see anyone pull this off and make payroll!


I would like to see pic's.

 

[Backwoods Savage]

Here is what was verbally agreed to:

He was allowed to go in and log out the oak. His share 2/3 our share 1/3. We didn't have to allow him to go in. He was in a bind because he needed oak to provide to a BBQ joint that he contracts wood to.

He called while we were on vacation to see if he could see where the wood was. We told him to walk in because it was too muddy to take vehicles into the native pasture. We get back from vacation and discover 3 different places where the 2-ton truck had gotten stuck in the mud and tore up several parts of the pasture. We also discovered that he left us no wood for our 1/3 share. That is why we were upset about the situation.

He and his son did bring back 2 loads of wood today. They weren't any of the larger logs (15-24") but he did bring some back to us. He did own up to the mistake and made it right with us in our eyes. One thing is for sure, regardless of who it is, we probably won't be trying to help others out in a similar situation. We really hate to be that way because it is not our nature at all, but we don't like being taken advantage of either. A man's word should be a man's word.

Sounds like this worked out better than I expected it would so congratulations to you.

I really hate to see that you won't be trying to help others like that. We too have experienced some bad things and even this year we had a couple guys cutting that will no longer be welcome. However, I am not about to change my ways just because of one or two bad eggs. I'll remember those bad eggs but I'll also not hesitate to help others. Sure, now and then it doesn't work out but usually we can tell early on and many times you can tell just talking to people on what they are like or what they will do. But somehow it just is not in my nature to just stop.

btw, we had a fellow who we supplied an entire winter's worth of wood. We had all sorts of promises on what he was going to do for us the following summer and it just sounded so good. Somehow when he was telling about this though made me suspect and I told my wife we would not see him again until the next heating season when he would come looking. That did turn out to be the case. Yes, he was needy still but in this case we chose not to help. Some folks are just plain lazy and want hand-outs. Those are difficult folks to have good feelings for.

 

[smokinj]

Here is what was verbally agreed to:

He was allowed to go in and log out the oak. His share 2/3 our share 1/3. We didn't have to allow him to go in. He was in a bind because he needed oak to provide to a BBQ joint that he contracts wood to.

He called while we were on vacation to see if he could see where the wood was. We told him to walk in because it was too muddy to take vehicles into the native pasture. We get back from vacation and discover 3 different places where the 2-ton truck had gotten stuck in the mud and tore up several parts of the pasture. We also discovered that he left us no wood for our 1/3 share. That is why we were upset about the situation.

He and his son did bring back 2 loads of wood today. They weren't any of the larger logs (15-24") but he did bring some back to us. He did own up to the mistake and made it right with us in our eyes. One thing is for sure, regardless of who it is, we probably won't be trying to help others out in a similar situation. We really hate to be that way because it is not our nature at all, but we don't like being taken advantage of either. A man's word should be a man's word.

Sounds like this worked out better than I expected it would so congratulations to you.

I really hate to see that you won't be trying to help others like that. We too have experienced some bad things and even this year we had a couple guys cutting that will no longer be welcome. However, I am not about to change my ways just because of one or two bad eggs. I'll remember those bad eggs but I'll also not hesitate to help others. Sure, now and then it doesn't work out but usually we can tell early on and many times you can tell just talking to people on what they are like or what they will do. But somehow it just is not in my nature to just stop.

btw, we had a fellow who we supplied an entire winter's worth of wood. We had all sorts of promises on what he was going to do for us the following summer and it just sounded so good. Somehow when he was telling about this though made me suspect and I told my wife we would not see him again until the next heating season when he would come looking. That did turn out to be the case. Yes, he was needy still but in this case we chose not to help. Some folks are just plain lazy and want hand-outs. Those are difficult folks to have good feelings for.

I think the big thing is anyone who will make a deal like this has to have a little capitol to keep rolling....If the home owner does not understand then theres big issue. The cutter here is not making 300.00 a cord it 200.00 1/3 goes to the home owner. (nothing wrong with the deal) Just bet the cutter is dying a slow death on this. Just put a bullet in hes head much more humane imo. He is paying all expensives as well. He has very little chance of even breaking even.

 

[ddklahr]

I got to see the logs he brought back to us this evening, he was very fair with what he brought back. I will agree with you Backwoods, we won't try to let this example force our hand in the future regarding others. What upset us the most originally is that we have over $12,000 in the dozer work and fence and we are still planning on getting to the rest of the downed trees. Cooler heads have definately prevailed now. I have known the individual since I was little. Honestly, it was something that happened and we will move forward without hard feelings on both sides. He cuts wood as a hobby as he is retired. Trust me, he doesn't have to have a bankroll to do what he is doing. With what he brought back, we got roughly 2 cords and he got about 12. We are fine with that and now we have to get to cutting and splitting to get it processed. Just what I need after an 8 day vacation.

 

[smokinj]

I got to see the logs he brought back to us this evening, he was very fair with what he brought back. I will agree with you Backwoods, we won't try to let this example force our hand in the future regarding others. What upset us the most originally is that we have over $12,000 in the dozer work and fence and we are still planning on getting to the rest of the downed trees. Cooler heads have definately prevailed now. I have known the individual since I was little. Honestly, it was something that happened and we will move forward without hard feelings on both sides. He cuts wood as a hobby as he is retired. Trust me, he doesn't have to have a bankroll to do what he is doing. With what he brought back, we got roughly 2 cords and he got about 12. We are fine with that and now we have to get to cutting and splitting to get it processed. Just what I need after an 8 day vacation.

Now those are some good #'s Just hope to see guys like that make it! They seem to be the under dog around here and I know what it takes.

 

[Backwoods Savage]

Here is what was verbally agreed to:

He was allowed to go in and log out the oak. His share 2/3 our share 1/3. We didn't have to allow him to go in. He was in a bind because he needed oak to provide to a BBQ joint that he contracts wood to.

He called while we were on vacation to see if he could see where the wood was. We told him to walk in because it was too muddy to take vehicles into the native pasture. We get back from vacation and discover 3 different places where the 2-ton truck had gotten stuck in the mud and tore up several parts of the pasture. We also discovered that he left us no wood for our 1/3 share. That is why we were upset about the situation.

He and his son did bring back 2 loads of wood today. They weren't any of the larger logs (15-24") but he did bring some back to us. He did own up to the mistake and made it right with us in our eyes. One thing is for sure, regardless of who it is, we probably won't be trying to help others out in a similar situation. We really hate to be that way because it is not our nature at all, but we don't like being taken advantage of either. A man's word should be a man's word.

Sounds like this worked out better than I expected it would so congratulations to you.

I really hate to see that you won't be trying to help others like that. We too have experienced some bad things and even this year we had a couple guys cutting that will no longer be welcome. However, I am not about to change my ways just because of one or two bad eggs. I'll remember those bad eggs but I'll also not hesitate to help others. Sure, now and then it doesn't work out but usually we can tell early on and many times you can tell just talking to people on what they are like or what they will do. But somehow it just is not in my nature to just stop.

btw, we had a fellow who we supplied an entire winter's worth of wood. We had all sorts of promises on what he was going to do for us the following summer and it just sounded so good. Somehow when he was telling about this though made me suspect and I told my wife we would not see him again until the next heating season when he would come looking. That did turn out to be the case. Yes, he was needy still but in this case we chose not to help. Some folks are just plain lazy and want hand-outs. Those are difficult folks to have good feelings for.

I think the big thing is anyone who will make a deal like this has to have a little capitol to keep rolling....If the home owner does not understand then theres big issue. The cutter here is not making 300.00 a cord it 200.00 1/3 goes to the home owner. (nothing wrong with the deal) Just bet the cutter is dying a slow death on this. Just put a bullet in hes head much more humane imo. He is paying all expensives as well. He has very little chance of even breaking even.

Jay, you are very correct but I think you may be missing the point in this case. It was agreed ("His share 2/3 our share 1/3") before the cutting. It was also told the fellow ("We told him to walk in because it was too muddy to take vehicles into the native pasture."). Yet this guy went in when it was muddy and tore up the field. So he broke two things here. Agreed to share and didn't and also drove in when that was not in the agreement and by doing so, tore up the field. I can certainly understand being upset over this, just about to the point of needing an attitude adjustment.

 

[smokinj]

Here is what was verbally agreed to:

He was allowed to go in and log out the oak. His share 2/3 our share 1/3. We didn't have to allow him to go in. He was in a bind because he needed oak to provide to a BBQ joint that he contracts wood to.

He called while we were on vacation to see if he could see where the wood was. We told him to walk in because it was too muddy to take vehicles into the native pasture. We get back from vacation and discover 3 different places where the 2-ton truck had gotten stuck in the mud and tore up several parts of the pasture. We also discovered that he left us no wood for our 1/3 share. That is why we were upset about the situation.

He and his son did bring back 2 loads of wood today. They weren't any of the larger logs (15-24") but he did bring some back to us. He did own up to the mistake and made it right with us in our eyes. One thing is for sure, regardless of who it is, we probably won't be trying to help others out in a similar situation. We really hate to be that way because it is not our nature at all, but we don't like being taken advantage of either. A man's word should be a man's word.

Sounds like this worked out better than I expected it would so congratulations to you.

I really hate to see that you won't be trying to help others like that. We too have experienced some bad things and even this year we had a couple guys cutting that will no longer be welcome. However, I am not about to change my ways just because of one or two bad eggs. I'll remember those bad eggs but I'll also not hesitate to help others. Sure, now and then it doesn't work out but usually we can tell early on and many times you can tell just talking to people on what they are like or what they will do. But somehow it just is not in my nature to just stop.

btw, we had a fellow who we supplied an entire winter's worth of wood. We had all sorts of promises on what he was going to do for us the following summer and it just sounded so good. Somehow when he was telling about this though made me suspect and I told my wife we would not see him again until the next heating season when he would come looking. That did turn out to be the case. Yes, he was needy still but in this case we chose not to help. Some folks are just plain lazy and want hand-outs. Those are difficult folks to have good feelings for.

I think the big thing is anyone who will make a deal like this has to have a little capitol to keep rolling....If the home owner does not understand then theres big issue. The cutter here is not making 300.00 a cord it 200.00 1/3 goes to the home owner. (nothing wrong with the deal) Just bet the cutter is dying a slow death on this. Just put a bullet in hes head much more humane imo. He is paying all expensives as well. He has very little chance of even breaking even.

Jay, you are very correct but I think you may be missing the point in this case. It was agreed ("His share 2/3 our share 1/3") before the cutting. It was also told the fellow ("We told him to walk in because it was too muddy to take vehicles into the native pasture."). Yet this guy went in when it was muddy and tore up the field. So he broke two things here. Agreed to share and didn't and also drove in when that was not in the agreement and by doing so, tore up the field. I can certainly understand being upset over this, just about to the point of needing an attitude adjustment.

Yea I understand that perfect. If it was me there would be times I need to sell more for cash flow and make it up at a later time.(and he did) OP being on Vaccation would not be a factor just trying to float the boat would. Looking for some slack to the man doing the work...Thats all, most never think about the boots on the ground! I am the boot...lol

 

[Backwoods Savage]

Ya Jay, and some folks even get the boot. :lol:

 

[smokinj]

Ya Jay, and some folks even get the boot. :lol:

Not affarid of a boot but the gas man I am.....;-) I am very clear on what I say is going to happen before any works starts.
Rule 1# I take no brush.Rule 2# If they want even a stick of the wood they MUST PICK IT UP THEM SELFS! rule #3 you want Insurance Pay for it! Rule #4 If it's not listed in the first 3 rules read number 3 very slowly......We are there to move wood and where just saw guys not a head shrink! Now what the home owner get is Hudge savings costing in the 400-600 range per tree. So to recap I dont really think a guy will make it long making 200.00 a cord. I dont sale the firewood but I do the milling wood. Its not a lot of money there either but it pays the Gas man and I have firewood for myself. I also have this thing down full circle. Lots invested.