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would this work as a battery backup ?

Post in 'The Pellet Mill - Pellet and Multifuel Stoves' started by francis.g, Sep 12, 2011.

  1. francis.g

    francis.g Member

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    where I live the power goes out somewhat often, but usually for less than an hour or so. I am having an M55 installed next month and I am concerned about the power going out while I am at work then the house filling with smoke causing the alarm company to call the fire dept. Do you guys think this would work well as a backup power supply ? Or is there a better solution ?

    http://www.northerntool.com/shop/tools/product_200465190_200465190

    great site by the way, all the info here really helped guide me when I was buying the stove.

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  2. imacman

    imacman Guest

    Francis, welcome to the forum.

    Although the unit you're looking at seems to have plenty of power to run the stove, upon reading the owners manual it seems that the unit uses a "modified sine wave" DC to AC inverter. Pellet stove motors need "pure sine wave" power (like the power company produces), otherwise the motors running the fans start to hum and overheat, and possibly fail eventually.
  3. francis.g

    francis.g Member

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    man you fellas know your stuff. I guess I have the right idea, I just need to find something with the correct specs.

    thank you imacman
  4. imacman

    imacman Guest

    If you do a search on this forum the topic has been discussed in length, and there were some good units listed by members.
  5. francis.g

    francis.g Member

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    how embarrising, found what i was looking for with a google advanced search of hearth.com

    sorry guys
  6. fossil

    fossil Accidental Moderator Staff Member

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    You have no reason in the world to apologize. Keep bringing your questions and experience here...that's what we're all about. Rick
  7. krooser

    krooser Minister of Fire

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    WE know everything.... (cue the theme from The Twilight Zone)...
  8. DBCOOPER

    DBCOOPER Feeling the Heat

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    I ordered one of these yesterday. http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00429N192
    While I know it won't run the stove (CB1200i) very long, my plan is to use a 120 volt normally open relay in the thermostat circuit so if the power fails the relay will open and the battery back up will only have to power the stove thru shut down. Not totally perfect but it will provide surge protection and stop the smoke issue. Just not sure what will happen with multiple short power interuptions. May need a time delay relay or a manual reset in the circuit.
  9. Hitch

    Hitch Member

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    As it appears that the OP has now answered his question, I am going to go out on a bit of a limb here and ask a question about these UPS's. My apologies to the OP if I am derailing your thread, but this information might help.

    After we bought our pellet stove, based on the advice on this site, I looked for a UPS. I ended up buying a CyberPower UPS. We used it for the winter and once the stove was cleaned-out for the season, I unplugged the stove from the UPS but left the UPS plugged in.

    When Irene hit and the electricity went out, I unplugged the UPS from the wall outlet and plugged my notebook into it. I was very surprised with how quickly it lost its remaining battery power. When it got down to less than an hour remaining, I unplugged the computer so the UPS just sat there - only using power for the LCD display. Much to my surprise, the remaining battery power continued to drop quickly. I think it said there was around 45 minutes of power left before I unplugged my notebook and it ran out of power less than 45 minutes thereafter.

    I am guessing that I have a bad battery. This thing should have not died that quickly.

    Has anyone else had a similar experience with one of these things?
  10. DBCOOPER

    DBCOOPER Feeling the Heat

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    What model cyberpower?
  11. Hitch

    Hitch Member

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    I need to confirm, but I think it is the CP1000PFCLCD.
  12. DBCOOPER

    DBCOOPER Feeling the Heat

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  13. Hitch

    Hitch Member

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    Well, that would certainly explain why it died so quickly. :)

    The reason for the confusion is that the "runtime estimate" was around 43 minutes when I unplugged my notebook. That was the number that I watched drop rather quickly without anything attached. Maybe it was 4.3 minutes? Who knows? I swear I wasn't drinking. :)
  14. DBCOOPER

    DBCOOPER Feeling the Heat

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    Charge it back up, put a known load ( couple of lamps with 100 watt bulbs) on it and time it. That will tell you the battery health.
  15. IHATEPROPANE

    IHATEPROPANE Minister of Fire

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    I also bought a cyber power UPS, the next size up(see sig). I am very interested to see how long it will run my pellet stove. It looks like it should be good for 15 minutes or so. If it can shut it down or give me time to set up the generator I will be happy.

    I will try to post my results come first burn.
  16. tjnamtiw

    tjnamtiw Minister of Fire

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    I would imagine that the device has a step up transformer in it that will still be running current through the primary windings even with nothing plugged in so I would expect the estimated 'life time' to still decrease. Make sense?
  17. DBCOOPER

    DBCOOPER Feeling the Heat

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    I wonder what it does when the battery get low. If it starts putting out wierd voltages I wouldn't want to subject my stove to that. I'll experiment with a drill or a fan or something before I see how long it will run the stove.
  18. tjnamtiw

    tjnamtiw Minister of Fire

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    The one I have on my desktop computer and stuff will start to beep and then shut down, hopefully, before the voltage drops. You make a good point. I think I will hook up my voltmeter to it when I get my new battery for the UPS.
  19. francis.g

    francis.g Member

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  20. WoodPorn

    WoodPorn Minister of Fire

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    These Back up UPS' are designed only to give time to shut down or ride through minor outages (as previously stated). they are not designed to be a substitute for a generator or utility.

    They are also designed to run at full voltage, untill the battery gets too weak to support said voltage, at which point the unit will protect the load and shut down. There should be no drop in voltage from power loss to dead battery.
  21. Hitch

    Hitch Member

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    For what its worth, that is the correct model. It currently states that it is at 100% charge and that, without anything plugged in, it has 200 mins. of runtime remaining.

    I'll have to give the 100 watt lamp suggestion at try.
  22. imacman

    imacman Guest

  23. DBCOOPER

    DBCOOPER Feeling the Heat

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    I know its still pretty warm out but did you give it a try?
  24. DBCOOPER

    DBCOOPER Feeling the Heat

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    Well I found the relay I want to use. About 60 bucks but it looks like it will do what I want it to do. If the power is off for 10 seconds it will open the thermostat circuit and the ups will cool the stove down and get rid of the smoke. If the power is restored the control circuit will close base on a user programable time up to 720 seconds. Should be a good solution.

    http://www.pexsupply.com/ICM-Controls-ICM492-ICM492-Single-Phase-Motor-Protection-80-300-VAC
  25. madge69

    madge69 Member

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    Cool idea on the relay. I checked it out and there is a cheaper model that would also work, ICM491. Just integrate into t-stat control circuit...

    Keep in mind that this will only work properly if the stove is in auto/off mode.

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