Harman Invincible RS Advice

[Harman Lover 007]

I have had my Harman Invincible RS since 1996. When it was my primary burner here in Mass it was an absolute beast and gave me many many years of great service. In 16 years I've put in 2 control boards, 2 flame guides, and 1 combustion blower. When I bought the P61A, I retired the RS to my cottage in Maine. Prior to that install I took it to my shop on a pallet and gave it a COMPLETE tear down cleaning.
The install in Maine is a straight vertical run through the roof of 12 feet. My EVL was a little close using 3 inch pipe so I went with 4 inch. Here's the deal. The stove doesn't perform anything like it did when it was installed here. The flame is lazy and the distribution blower just doesn't seem to have the same "umph". I run it on stove temp. The distribution blower is completely clean...it just does blow as hard. Has anyone ever replaced theirs in an RS?
The door gasket is nice and soft but does NOT pass the dollar bill test. It is the original gasket so I know you guys are gonna tell me to replace it but I'm far from convinced that it the whole problem. I pulled out the combustion blower and it is clean. Is there a way to test it?
Again, the stove is completely clean and I've burned about 6 bags of SC since the install. I never burned SC in this stove so I'm going to try some GTs to see if that makes a difference.
Looking forward to everyone's advice and counsel. Thanks in advance.

 

[imacman]

.....The flame is lazy......The door gasket is nice and soft but does NOT pass the dollar bill test. It is the original gasket so I know you guys are gonna tell me to replace it .......I pulled out the combustion blower and it is clean. Is there a way to test it?......

I am by no means a Harman expert, but YES.....obviously, if the gasket is leaking, that will give you a lazy flame. And 16 years......way past due for a change even if it's NOT the whole problem.

As far as testing the comb. motor, make up a test power lead like many of us have done (see pic), and connect it direct to 120 v. Might try dripping some 3in1 oil into the bearings while you have it out.

 

[Harman Lover 007]

Wow....nobody else????

 

[DexterDay]

I will second what imacman said. I am by no means a Harman expert.

Door gasket, oil the bearings in both the convection blower and the combustion blower, and possibly change the pellet...

 

[SmokeyTheBear]

I go a bit further and add make certain that you actually got all of the crud out of the stove. Sometimes stuff sticks and a long distance move dislodges it and it drops into a bad place and really gums up the works.

Since it is now in a camp I'd also look at possible visitation by members of the rodent clan. I remember a stove that had a nest made of fiberglass and other stuff along with acorn shells.

ETA: BTW, Sebago never froze over this past winter.

 

[heat seeker]

Your voltage might be a tad low out in the boonies, it's easy enough to check.

Smokey has a good point about the move dislodging some crud.

 

[SmokeyTheBear]

Your voltage might be a tad low out in the boonies, it's easy enough to check.

Smokey has a good point about the move dislodging some crud.

Don't knock the boonies I've had much better stability with the 'tric juice out here in the boonies than in the big city of Portland.

 

[Harman Lover 007]

I go a bit further and add make certain that you actually got all of the crud out of the stove. Sometimes stuff sticks and a long distance move dislodges it and it drops into a bad place and really gums up the works.

Since it is now in a camp I'd also look at possible visitation by members of the rodent clan. I remember a stove that had a nest made of fiberglass and other stuff along with acorn shells.

ETA: BTW, Sebago never froze over this past winter.

Thanks, Smokey. This is a new install using the old stove. It hasn't worked quite right since I installed it in the Fall. The chimney and venting are all brand new, no rodents. I really tore it apart but I will double check when I get back there next weekend. Yes I am aware of the fact that Sebago didn't freeze. As a "local" you know that it is not all that uncommon for it not to freeze completely. I went over to the island several times by boat during the winter. (brrr) The ferry is now running for the island workers and the island officially opens on the 20th.

 

[Harman Lover 007]

Don't knock the boonies I've had much better stability with the 'tric juice out here in the boonies than in the big city of Portland.

Yeah, CMP is pretty good. Even on an island we get good service and response to problems....

 

[katman]

if the fan seems weak maybe it doesn't like pushing all the air in that 4 inch pipe. what did you have in your old install?

 

[Harman Lover 007]

if the fan seems weak maybe it doesn't like pushing all the air in that 4 inch pipe. what did you have in your old install?

Yeah, I thought about that but the original install that now runs my P61A is a 3" Tee to 6" stovepipe via an increaser to 8"X8" block chimney. The 4" chimney in Maine has great draft too.

 

[Delta-T]

have you noticed if the dist blower blows harder in test mode than in run mode? do you happen to own a magnahelix and/or multimeter? pretty easy to make sure you have good volts going in, and I'm sure I could find you the correct ohms for all the motors to make sure they are ok.

 

[Lousyweather]

maybe (probably), Im just stupid, but the distribution blower has nothing to do with the laziness of the flame...whats the chance its the combustion blower? I know of no good way to test it, but that fan is still available. Not likely to be the circuitboard, but is what about the ESP probe? Also, with the RS, dont forget those side tubes need to be clean, both the vertical and horizontal ones (tho its likely you know this, since youve successfully ran yours for so long). As for the gaskets, yea, time to replace them......but if they were REALLY bad, the vac switch would stop the unit from feeding, and of course, you couldnt keep it lit. Check the intake damper as well....if its in a camp, theres a slight possibility that its sticking due to corrosion. Dont even want to suggest a critter got past the damper and is sitting dead in the air box since he couldnt get out.......lol.....

 

[Harman Lover 007]

maybe (probably), Im just stupid, but the distribution blower has nothing to do with the laziness of the flame...whats the chance its the combustion blower? I know of no good way to test it, but that fan is still available. Not likely to be the circuitboard, but is what about the ESP probe? Also, with the RS, dont forget those side tubes need to be clean, both the vertical and horizontal ones (tho its likely you know this, since youve successfully ran yours for so long). As for the gaskets, yea, time to replace them......but if they were REALLY bad, the vac switch would stop the unit from feeding, and of course, you couldnt keep it lit. Check the intake damper as well....if its in a camp, theres a slight possibility that its sticking due to corrosion. Dont even want to suggest a critter got past the damper and is sitting dead in the air box since he couldnt get out.......lol.....

Thanks, All good stuff. My OP wasn't really clear. My distribution fan issue and lazy flame are in fact two separate issues and two different fans and I knew that. I'm pretty good at these Harman's but I was just reaching out in case I was missing something due to the fact that these are both "new" issues and started with the install of the stove in Maine.

 

[ironpony]

does not like the fresh Maine air???
I think everyone else covered most areas
one thing I found with the old Invincible is
the pots get dirty/bad spots
I will rotate the knobs from stop to stop several times
to clean the windings and contact arm
seems to help

 

[Harman Lover 007]

does not like the fresh Maine air???
I think everyone else covered most areas
one thing I found with the old Invincible is
the pots get dirty/bad spots
I will rotate the knobs from stop to stop several times
to clean the windings and contact arm
seems to help

I have a spare board with freshly cleaned pots so that is going to be one of the things I try. Thanks to everyone.

 

[SmokeyTheBear]

Corrosion from all those years in MA ruined it so once it good real air it expired .

 

[Harman Lover 007]

Corrosion from all those years in MA ruined it so once it good real air it expired .

 

[ironpony]

hey if you do not get it fixed I can swing buy and haul it away fro you

 

[SmokeyTheBear]

hey if you do not get it fixed I can swing buy and haul it away fro you

It might be a bit off your beaten path ironpony. However if you were to swing by OMV's place with a couple of tractor trailers and a fork lift the trip might be worth it .

 

[Harman Lover 007]

hey if you do not get it fixed I can swing buy and haul it away fro you

Thanks anyway IP. For all the reasons you like yours, I bet I could come up with more of them for mine.

 

[smwilliamson]

I have had my Harman Invincible RS since 1996. When it was my primary burner here in Mass it was an absolute beast and gave me many many years of great service. In 16 years I've put in 2 control boards, 2 flame guides, and 1 combustion blower. When I bought the P61A, I retired the RS to my cottage in Maine. Prior to that install I took it to my shop on a pallet and gave it a COMPLETE tear down cleaning.
The install in Maine is a straight vertical run through the roof of 12 feet. My EVL was a little close using 3 inch pipe so I went with 4 inch. Here's the deal. The stove doesn't perform anything like it did when it was installed here. The flame is lazy and the distribution blower just doesn't seem to have the same "umph". I run it on stove temp. The distribution blower is completely clean...it just does blow as hard. Has anyone ever replaced theirs in an RS?
The door gasket is nice and soft but does NOT pass the dollar bill test. It is the original gasket so I know you guys are gonna tell me to replace it but I'm far from convinced that it the whole problem. I pulled out the combustion blower and it is clean. Is there a way to test it?
Again, the stove is completely clean and I've burned about 6 bags of SC since the install. I never burned SC in this stove so I'm going to try some GTs to see if that makes a difference.
Looking forward to everyone's advice and counsel. Thanks in advance.

Your heat exchanger exhaust path is clogged. You need to remove the interior side panels and the bottom angle diverter then shoot 150psi of air up both sides of the exchangers. You'll find your problems there.

 

[Harman Lover 007]

Your heat exchanger exhaust path is clogged. You need to remove the interior side panels and the bottom angle diverter then shoot 150psi of air up both sides of the exchangers. You'll find your problems there.

Scott, I respect your opinion greatly here. I am definitely going to check it again. Having said that, I have cleaned this stove for 16 years without any issues and with all due respect I know this stove inside out, including the heat exchangers. I will check things next weekend and report back.

 

[Harman Lover 007]

Scott, I respect your opinion greatly here. I am definitely going to check it again. Having said that, I have cleaned this stove for 16 years without any issues and with all due respect I know this stove inside out, including the heat exchangers. I will check things next weekend and report back.

So I'm here at the cottage enjoying a nice weekend so far. Here are the things I've done so far. I installed the new door gasket, rechecked and brushed out the heat exchangers at Scott's suggestion, double checked the path from the combustion blower through the lower heat exchangers on both sides and cleaned the comb blower and fan blades really well. I operated the comb blower while it was out and it appears to work fine. Fired it up early this morning and it does appear to function better. Although I said otherwise in my OP, I think the door gasket was most of the problem. I have shut it down for now as it is supposed to get up to around 70 deg today. Anything new and I'll report back. Thanks for the advice.

 

[movemaine]

Do your lights dim when it's running?