How healthy is the pellet industry in your area?

[smwilliamson]

I cannot speak to the business of others but I can relate this info:

This year we had about 213 individual copy right infringements against my website. That is to say, about 213 people decided to go into business servicing stoves and rather than make their own copy, they copied mine. Many were craigslist ads so they could have been the same people over and over but interestingly enough, we did see an ad for pellet service as far south as Georgia.

I do not like to think of the industry as healthy or not...but rather a timeline toward adulthood. I think we are still in our adolescence and we just do not want to grow up, not yet anyway.

The problem as I see it is that Americans simply do not like to cooperate. We are all in it for ourselves. Because we do not work together, we waste resources. Creating an industry that can sustain itself such as ours take cooperation from everyone...or we need a common motivator. Instability in world governments shouldn't dictate your heating bill, but it does...yet you cannot look anywhere in New England more than 10 feet and not see a tree....yet we buy pellets from BC and somehow that's cheaper?
Any typical culdisac has 12 homes within 800 feet of one another and they ALL have their own $12k heating system...4 pellet boilers could run in series to generate enough heat for all of them at a fraction of the cost....but it doesn't happen.

So Americans will continue on....one crisis at a time.

 

[midfielder]

hmmm. looking at pictures of torrefied wood pellets. similar size as the pellets we buy in bags...

burns 30% hotter than coal. with less ash. (similar to wood pellets)
anyone have any idea of if these could be safely burned in a pellet stove/regular pellet stove venting?
just asking because they will be making these about a mile or so from me soon.
for the european market (coal plants) from what i've read.
not even sure they'd sell them to the public even if they were safe and possible to use in a residential application.

but i'm still curious as hell.
guessing the ignition point of these is sky high compared to regular wood pellets.

*edit to add- this article seems to hint that burning these in a regular pellet stove is possible/practical/safe
http://www.biomasspelletmill.com/Torrefaction_Will_Change_The_Wood_Pellets_Fuel_Market.html

Very interesting - but double the density of current pellets? So 80 lbs almost in a 5 gal. sheet rock compound bucket. Wow. I wonder what the btu content runs (30% more?) and if existing stoves' fuel trims could be set back enough to compensate. Is the ash content "similar" by weight or volume? Shame to ship them all that way (like so much of the current NA production of wood pellets) - takes a lot of diesel and reduces the carbon savings over fossil fuels. Best consumed locally... oink, oink.

 

[PeteB]

Having stoked a coal boiler off and on since 1985, I can attest that coal is dirty, unhealthy to be around and moreover is very inconsistent in quality. Quality wise you are at the mercy of the coal dealer who may buy inferior coal to sell to you which can have a very low heat value. This is my second year with an England pellet stove and it is proving a very good choice.

 

[Thaddius Wenderoth]

Here in Idaho we have a decent eco system for pellets. Many places to buy a stove (10 within 20 miles of me) and an ok pellet supply. There are quite a few mills in the area but until I get the oppurtunity to try a few bags first I can't attest to the quality. We have HD and Lowes @ $209/ton for Lignetics Orange Labe and Prestos. The biggest dealer of pellets close to me seems kind of spendy: American Eagle (Local) $4.99/bag $200/ton,Natural Glow Premium $5.89/bag $259/ton, Bear Mountain $6.29/bag $279/ton, Lignetics Orange Lable $6.29/bag $249.50/ton.

 

[bonesy]

Here is a comparison chart of many different fuels from a local (to me) coal company, you can input the fuel prices for changes:

http://jeddocoal.com/calc.php

Screenshot attached as well

 

[nate379]

Having stoked a coal boiler off and on since 1985, I can attest that coal is dirty, unhealthy to be around and moreover is very inconsistent in quality. Quality wise you are at the mercy of the coal dealer who may buy inferior coal to sell to you which can have a very low heat value. This is my second year with an England pellet stove and it is proving a very good choice.

At the mercy of dealers with pellets too.

Why is coal unhealthy to be around? I seriously doubt a few tons a year would give someone the black lung!
My Mom said Big difference in dust going from wood to coal. The coal ash doesn't float around I guess??

I'm not saying pellets are bad, coal is good. The thread was about pellet sales and I threw in the info about many folks going to coal.

 

[rwthomas1]

Question here. Isnt your states all so small that you can travel thru them in just a short amount of time? unlike the western states that any one is equal to say 3 or more? Dont get me wrong, thats cool, but from shipping that would be even greater bonus. no problem out here to truck pellets 1200 miles, for cheap rates, and so many production plants in BC , Wa , Or, ID. that I have never had a problem getting pellets on my way home in the fall for very reasonable rate. Your pellet prices are cheaper than out here normaly for Lignetics, Bear overpriced Mountians, even prestos

Take one of those long bed, duallie, crew cab pickups that you guys in the West love so much and bring it here to RI. You'd have to leave the state to turn the thing around..... Yep, its small, just a speedbump between NY and Boston.

 

[SwineFlue]

hmmm. looking at pictures of torrefied wood pellets. similar size as the pellets we buy in bags...

burns 30% hotter than coal. with less ash. (similar to wood pellets)
anyone have any idea of if these could be safely burned in a pellet stove/regular pellet stove venting?
just asking because they will be making these about a mile or so from me soon.
for the european market (coal plants) from what i've read.

Coal plants can burn up to 10% pellets with the coal. It's part of the greenhouse gas requirements over there. From what I've read, they use 'utility' grade pellets... 6% ash. Make sure you check before buying any!

 

[nate379]

I talked to my Dad for a while today about it.

Said it's about 15-20% ash. Out of a ton which was 5 55gal drums he got 1 drum of ash.
He gets rid of it by giving it to a guy that uses it to put on dirt roads, I guess it keeps the dust down? Said if that guy didn't take it he'd just dump it in a pile out back or even truck it to my brother's place to fill in a hole or two (has 100+ acres)

BTU wise he said they burned 3-3.5 cords of wood every winter for almost 30 years. With the coal they burn 2.75-3 tons. Coal runs $280 a ton. Wood bought c/s/d is $200/cord, or in tree length about $100/cord. Fuel oil was at 3.70$ gal as of a few days ago.

If you figure pellets at about 1.5 tons to a cord, pellets would need to be $190/ton to be at the same cost of coal.

As far as availability, there's a ton of places that sell it. He said most of the local gas stations/convenience stores sell it as well as Wal-Mart, Lowe's and the several local lumber yards. Said pellets can be found pretty easy as well but more places sell coal.

Said he only knows of one guy with a pellet furnace while coal just on their street of 5-6 houses there's 3 houses.

 

[save$]

I talked to my Dad for a while today about it.

Said it's about 15-20% ash. Of of a ton which was 5 55gal drums he got 1 drum of ash.
He gets rid of it by giving it to a guy that uses it to put on dirt roads, I guess it keeps the dust down? Said if that guy didn't take it he'd just dump it in a pile out back or even truck it to my brother's place to fill in a hole or two (has 100+ acres)

BTU wise he said they burned 3-3.5 cords of wood every winter for almost 30 years. With the coal they burn 2.75-3 tons. Coal runs $280 a ton. Coal bought c/s/d is $200/cord, or in tree length about $100/cord. Fuel oil was at 3.70$ gal as of a few days ago.

If you figure pellets at about 1.5 tons to a cord, pellets would need to be $190/ton to be at the same cost of coal.

As far as availability, there's a ton of places that sell it. He said most of the local gas stations/convenience stores sell it as well as Wal-Mart, Lowe's and the several local lumber yards. Said pellets can be found pretty easy as well but more places sell coal.

Said he only knows of one guy with a pellet furnace while coal just on their street of 5-6 houses there's 3 houses.

I could be way off, but I have been going on a ton of pellets to a cord of wood. I used to burn 5 cord of wood, now burn 5 tons of pellets. As for coal. I don't know anyone who burns it in the capital area, nor do I know of anyone who sells it. Nor have I seen any coal burning stoves for sale. Must be a regional thing. I have a nice littel ceramic clad frensh coal stove that I took out years ago because we can't get coall for it. It can burn small wood. I have kept it in the garage for that day that things might turn around. Things shift around so much. Now there are two natural gas lines coming to this area, but it is said they only want commercial customers. I live on a dead end road up over a rock hill so I don't that I'll ever see a line get in here. We were luck to get electricity, yet I am only 5 miles from the capital. Can't even get internet throug the phone here. We do get Direct tv and cable. Cell phone reception is good.

 

[SmokeyTheBear]

save$ a good number of places sell coal by the bag I can easily get it, I heated a large house with it for years in the early 80's.

Visit a feed store or one of the smaller chain hardware stores.

http://search.hardwarestore.com/Search.aspx?query=coal

http://www.parisfarmersunion.net/onlinestore.html enter coal in the search form.

 

[nate379]

It will vary with what pellets and what wood.

I was using "average" numbers to get a rough comparsion.

Pellets 16 million BTU per ton
Firewood 23 million BTU per cord
Coal 26 million BTU per ton


Here is a good chart to compare coal vs other heat sources.

Coal 26,000,000 1 ton
Hard Wood 26,000,000 1.3 cords
Oil 26,000,000 188 gallons
Wood Pellets 26,000,000 1.6 tons
Waste Oil 26,000,000 208 gallons
Propane 26,000,000 284 gallons
Natural Gas 26,000,000 260 terms
Electricity 26,000,000 7618 KwH

I could be way off, but I have been going on a ton of pellets to a cord of wood. I used to burn 5 cord of wood, now burn 5 tons of pellets. As for coal. I don't know anyone who burns it in the capital area, nor do I know of anyone who sells it. Nor have I seen any coal burning stoves for sale. Must be a regional thing. I have a nice littel ceramic clad frensh coal stove that I took out years ago because we can't get coall for it. It can burn small wood. I have kept it in the garage for that day that things might turn around. Things shift around so much. Now there are two natural gas lines coming to this area, but it is said they only want commercial customers. I live on a dead end road up over a rock hill so I don't that I'll ever see a line get in here. We were luck to get electricity, yet I am only 5 miles from the capital. Can't even get internet throug the phone here. We do get Direct tv and cable. Cell phone reception is good.

 

[outdoorsgriz]

I think the market has dropped off this year in Montana and surrounding states. In the 18 years we've been producing and selling pellets, we've sent more to Alberta and B.C. this year then we have in the states. I think market saturation has played a role, too, but seeing a lot of stoves for sale on craigslist.

Western Bee Premium Pellets - still $165/ton and $3.75/bag. No bark, no clinkers, no dirt - made from kiln-dried #3 COM PP.

 

[tlc1976]

Well they recently built a wood pellet factory in the industrial park 10 miles away so I'd say the demand is there. The stuck up tourist town is trying their best to shut them down but that's another story.

She burns those same Kirtland pellets in the 5500M and they seem to be great. No burn problems whatsoever, no screwing with trying to get the stove to burn cleanly and correctly like other US stove owners seem to have needed to do. And HR1 cooks us out most of the time so I'd say they are good. $3.50/bag if you buy by the ton, $3.70 individually.