2022-2023 BK everything thread

[BKVP]

Mine seems to pop on and circulate even if it’s not throwing out heat. I keep it at 72 which is about where the princess keeps it without the heat pump. It works really good for the most part. It’s always been a little too warm if we’re in the upper 40’s/lower 50’s. I think there’s a completely better feeling of the wood heat for whatever reason. I notice it when I’m visiting friends and I feel like I need to leave my jacket on lol

My sis lives near Denver. Been to her house twice, both times house is thermostat is set at 66. I wind up sleeping in thermals. 66 feels great at home with low humidity but not where humidity is much higher.

 

[sprawlnstall]

If you search this forum, you'll find a post or two from me that are almost identical to yours, ca. 2019.

I've not seen it occur on a Princess, it's mostly been a thing for a few of us with BK 30's, which seem to have a more aggressive air wash aimed at the door. But it's likely your draft is above spec, serving to stir up more than the usual fly ash. The Steelcat also seems more prone to plug with fly ash than a ceramic cat. I can and have plugged one pretty well on a SINGLE LOAD of wood, running WOT with no key damper. Here's my flame shield after one such burn, although I couldn't find an associated photo of the cat itself:

View attachment 308020

Solutions:

1. If your pipe is tall, install a key damper. A magnehelic is a nice addition too, so you can tune the key damper to .05"WC on high, but plenty of people drive without a gauge.

View attachment 308019

2. Next cat replacement, swap back to ceramic. They seem to be less prone to plugging with fly ash, with their larger openings.

View attachment 308021

3. Obviously check your chimney cap, any time things are sluggish. But if the problem goes away in bypass, then it's likely at the cat.

The problem is definitely a clogged cat. The stove immediately roars to life when the bypass is opened. Is it worth attempting to clean the steel cat in a vinegar bath or simply put a new ceramic cat in?

 

[begreen]

10k for a gas furnace? Wow, I didn't know they were that expensive.

That must be for the whole installation.

 

[Nealm66]

My sis lives near Denver. Been to her house twice, both times house is thermostat is set at 66. I wind up sleeping in thermals. 66 feels great at home with low humidity but not where humidity is much higher.

66 = brrr

 

[Highbeam]

The problem is definitely a clogged cat. The stove immediately roars to life when the bypass is opened. Is it worth attempting to clean the steel cat in a vinegar bath or simply put a new ceramic cat in?

They can be unclogged and put right back in service. I thought you said it was pretty new so it wouldn’t benefit from an acid bath yet.

So how do you want to unclog it? Easiest if you remove it but then you need a new gasket. If the cloggage is light and partial then maybe you can blast it out with the BK prescribed canned air or a blow nozzle set to low pressure. I’ve used 25 psi.

Sometimes you have to remove it to unclog it. Ugh. That stinks.

 

[dafattkidd]

Is it ok to vacuum the cat with the brush attachment?

 

[dafattkidd]

My Ashford25 is scheduled for install in 2 weeks! Hope all goes well

I’ve had mine for about a year and I really love it. Make sure your wood supply is good and dry. It makes a huge difference.

 

[BKVP]

That must be for the whole installation.

New AC (upgraded to 4 ton compressor)/ bigger blower, new furnace. Duct work was already in place.

 

[Ashful]

The problem is definitely a clogged cat. The stove immediately roars to life when the bypass is opened. Is it worth attempting to clean the steel cat in a vinegar bath or simply put a new ceramic cat in?

Highbeam already nailed it. No vinegar needed, but a vacuum is.

On the BK30's, is just about impossible to get it clean in place. At least in my stoves, you need to pull the combustor out to get a vacuum nozzle squarely onto it, and pull the ash out. The Princess may be different, but given that both likely have some debris hiding in the chamber behind the combustor, you'd probably do better pulling yours too.

I buy 10 or 20 feet of gasket at a time, as my combustor takes about 2.5 feet, and I pull it every summer (x2 stoves) for my yearly cleaning... sometimes once mid-season, too. If you already have gasket, slide that bad boy out, and give it a good vacuum. If you don't have gasket on-hand, I'd get some on order today, and just vacuum in-place as well as you can with an angled nozzle for today. Just be careful not to damage those relatively fragile steel cells.

Pulling and re-installing the cat is very simple, only takes a few minutes. Use a slotted screwdriver to pry on one of the corner ears (not the shim!) on each side, until you get get a finger behind it. Then grab and wiggle it out. The old gasket will be crumbly, usually 60% will come out with the combustor, and 40% will be left in the hole. Sweep it all up with your hand and throw it in the trash, that stuff won't burn.

Use your shop vac or ash vac to vacuum the combustor clean. Then take some masking tape and tape the end of your gasket roll to the combustor, starting at one corner. Wrap the gasket around the combustor, and trim flush with scissors. Then wrap the entire gasket in 2" wide masking tape, to hold it tight to the combustor, the tape all burns off in the first use. Slide it back home in the hole, replace the flame shield, done. Total job time is under 10 minutes, including fetching and putting away the shop vac.

The proper gasket is 2" x 1/16" interam. Used to run about $2 per foot, but latest price check had it up near $5/ft. I get mine from Woodman's Parts Plus.

 

[Highbeam]

Highbeam already nailed it. No vinegar needed, but a vacuum is.

On the BK30's, is just about impossible to get it clean in place. At least in my stoves, you need to pull the combustor out to get a vacuum nozzle squarely onto it, and pull the ash out. The Princess may be different, but given that both likely have some debris hiding in the chamber behind the combustor, you'd probably do better pulling yours too.

I buy 10 or 20 feet of gasket at a time, as my combustor takes about 2.5 feet, and I pull it every summer (x2 stoves) for my yearly cleaning... sometimes once mid-season, too. If you already have gasket, slide that bad boy out, and give it a good vacuum. If you don't have gasket on-hand, I'd get some on order today, and just vacuum in-place as well as you can with an angled nozzle for today. Just be careful not to damage those relatively fragile steel cells.

Pulling and re-installing the cat is very simple, only takes a few minutes. Use a slotted screwdriver to pry on one of the corner ears (not the shim!) on each side, until you get get a finger behind it. Then grab and wiggle it out. The old gasket will be crumbly, usually 60% will come out with the combustor, and 40% will be left in the hole. Sweep it all up with your hand and throw it in the trash, that stuff won't burn.

Use your shop vac or ash vac to vacuum the combustor clean. Then take some masking tape and tape the end of your gasket roll to the combustor, starting at one corner. Wrap the gasket around the combustor, and trim flush with scissors. Then wrap the entire gasket in 2" wide masking tape, to hold it tight to the combustor, the tape all burns off in the first use. Slide it back home in the hole, replace the flame shield, done. Total job time is under 10 minutes, including fetching and putting away the shop vac.

The proper gasket is 2" x 1/16" interam. Used to run about $2 per foot, but latest price check had it up near $5/ft. I get mine from Woodman's Parts Plus.

If your shop vac hose is one of the smaller ones and more flexible I’ve actually had success using no attachments, just the hose and flex it near 90 degrees to press it flat against the cat face. Don’t scrub the cat face but put a good suck on all the cells.

Maybe the 30 box doesn’t even allow enough space for that or maybe you use need a cheaper shop vac with less manly hose!

 

[sprawlnstall]

I’ve pulled cats several times for cleaning and inspection. It is a hassle and usually not worth it in my opinion. I ordered a new ceramic cat. Since the steel cat is fairly new I will probably clean it up and keep as a spare.

 

[BKVP]

If your shop vac hose is one of the smaller ones and more flexible I’ve actually had success using no attachments, just the hose and flex it near 90 degrees to press it flat against the cat face. Don’t scrub the cat face but put a good suck on all the cells.

Maybe the 30 box doesn’t even allow enough space for that or maybe you use need a cheaper shop vac with less manly hose!

Ouch!

 

[Highbeam]

Ouch!

My shop vac hose may not be long but it sure is skinny!

I was totally talking about vacuuming a catalyst but I see what you’re saying.

 

[Ashful]

"Less manly hose"?

I've tried it with two different hoses, one on my smaller shop vac (Ø1-7/8") and my ash vac (Ø1-1/4"?), and neither can bend tight enough to get at the face of the cat mounted in an Ashford 30. Maybe it's mounted higher above the door, or closer to the door frame?

Putting the automotive attachment on the shop vac will let you get at it well enough to resolve an emergency situation. But the few times I've done that have always resulted in me eventually removing the thing a few days later to give it a proper cleaning.

 

[NHWS]

A question came up during a discussion with a stove installer. They claim that the idea of a stove with a thermostat is not unique. In some such stoves, the thermostat can fail after a small number of years, leaving the air intake stuck in one position. They are thinking about a manufacturer other than BK, but suggested looking into it for any stove with a thermostat.

Has anyone seen or heard of this happening on BK Princess, King, or other BK stoves? If so, can the thermostat can be replaced DiY? How available / expensive are the parts?

 

[Nealm66]

Welcome to the thread from Eatonville! I haven’t heard of that happening to a BK stove. Mine’s very forgiving actually. I see firewood for free on Craigslist all over up that way and always wondered if you guys just aren’t allowed to burn at all up there

 

[Highbeam]

A question came up during a discussion with a stove installer. They claim that the idea of a stove with a thermostat is not unique. In some such stoves, the thermostat can fail after a small number of years, leaving the air intake stuck in one position. They are thinking about a manufacturer other than BK, but suggested looking into it for any stove with a thermostat.

Has anyone seen or heard of this happening on BK Princess, King, or other BK stoves? If so, can the thermostat can be replaced DiY? How available / expensive are the parts?

It appears very easy to DIY replace the thermostat assembly if it were to need replacement. It’s right on top in back. Just how could it fail though? The throttle body is directly connected to the bimetallic coil. If that coil broke the butterfly is weighted to fall shut. I’ve never heard of that happening but maybe BKVP can share.

The insert thermostats have a chain type linkage that could cause more issues but the freestander stoves are most dependable.

Ive seen many other BK failures that are rare but the thermostat isn’t one of them.

Mine is still

 

[Highbeam]

"Less manly hose"?

I've tried it with two different hoses, one on my smaller shop vac (Ø1-7/8") and my ash vac (Ø1-1/4"?), and neither can bend tight enough to get at the face of the cat mounted in an Ashford 30. Maybe it's mounted higher above the door, or closer to the door frame?

Putting the automotive attachment on the shop vac will let you get at it well enough to resolve an emergency situation. But the few times I've done that have always resulted in me eventually removing the thing a few days later to give it a proper cleaning.

Less manly like my skinny 1.5” hose! It’s almost rubber like and flexible. I’ve had no problem getting a tight seal with it against the face of the cat.

If there was debris behind the cat in the dome you can suck that out through the bypass opening or suck it right through the cat.

 

[BKVP]

A few folks have purchased thermostats thinking it was responsible for a change in performance. Q. When did you last clean or inspect your combustor? A. About 10 years ago. R. Likely not the thermostat more likely your combustor. A. I'll get dealer to order both.

Oh well.....

 

[NHWS]

Welcome to the thread from Eatonville! I haven’t heard of that happening to a BK stove. Mine’s very forgiving actually. I see firewood for free on Craigslist all over up that way and always wondered if you guys just aren’t allowed to burn at all up there

Other than the occasional burn bans, wood heat is legal in King County, WA. If neighbors complain about smoke there can sometimes be issues.

 

[NHWS]

It appears very easy to DIY replace the thermostat assembly if it were to need replacement. It’s right on top in back. Just how could it fail though? The throttle body is directly connected to the bimetallic coil. If that coil broke the butterfly is weighted to fall shut.

Ive seen many other BK failures that are rare but the thermostat isn’t one of them.

The installer's comment was not about BK stoves. They had seen the problem on another brand in the past and didn't know much about BK. They suggested it would be worth checking on any stove with a thermostat.

The butterfly falling shut due to coil breakage is similar their somewhat vague description. Even if it were known to happen on current model BK stoves, it still would not be much of a problem if the assembly could be replaced DiY with parts that are available and not particularly expensive.

 

[NHWS]

Of course, I can't help thinking about hooking the butterfly valve up a servo and then to a PID control monitored by a Raspberry Pi, Arduino, or other single board computer, but that's a project for another day.

Might have an interesting conversation with Webfish if/when I have a stove.

 

[Ashful]

Of course, I can't help thinking about hooking the butterfly valve up a servo and then to a PID control monitored by a Raspberry Pi, Arduino, or other single board computer, but that's a project for another day.

Might have an interesting conversation with Webfish if/when I have a stove.

I'd think if you want to go PID, better off getting a stove without a mechanical thermostat. The extra time constant involving the native thermostat behavior will do nothing but frustrate any attempt to tune a PID, I suspect.

<-- not a controls engineer, but did get an "A" in both controls courses during BSEE studies

 

[Nealm66]

If I was anywhere near Seattle I wouldn’t hesitate to buy a wood burning stove if you have any place to store a decent amount of wood. I’ve seen were some of the tree services will dump firewood in your driveway! I burned a pre epa stove for about 25 years and really happy with this bk princess. Mine will smoke during reload for about 25-30 minutes guessing but then it’s impossible to tell if I’m burning or not. On super cold days in the teens there’s some steam. I can run 12-24 hours on a full load of Doug fir. In my opinion it’s the perfect pnw stove.

 

[NHWS]

I'd think if you want to go PID, better off getting a stove without a mechanical thermostat. The extra time constant involving the native thermostat behavior will do nothing but frustrate any attempt to tune a PID, I suspect.

<-- not a controls engineer, but did get an "A" in both controls courses during BSEE studies

It's more of a maker subculture "here's something that works - how could it work better". I'm not a controls engineer either, but I've done related work.

It'll go on the todo list, somewhere behind re-wiring and re-plumbing the house and garden, after clearing and leveling the rest of the garden, after replacing most of the flooring in the house, after installing the next gen secure mesh networking and wildlife cameras over a few acres, after...

I might get to it in a decade or so.

It'd be nice to have a mechanical thermostat to use in the meantime.