Norwegian Style Efficiency

The main difference between a well run traditional stove and a well run modern one is emissions. A pre-EPA model, even though it seems to be burning cleanly is much dirtier. I like our little 602. It's a willing little heater, but it's not a clean burning stove.

Jordan said:

If you get a Jotul 118 pre-epa its a true cigar burner. I use a Jotul 380 in my shop and its a cigar burner but not as long as the 118.

I dont consider Vermont Castings or any other stove a classic looking stove just because its cast iron. You wont find early stoves to look like the stoves we see today that jotul, morso, or vermont castings make. Only exceptions being the Jotul 118, 602, and morso 2b since those are modified versions of the same stoves from long ago.

Now I'm a purist and don't like things that appear new or second rate in quality. Even the new Morso 2B's make me angry. There's grooves imitating removable cooking rings. Why add something to appear functional but then be fake? Like I said I'm a bit of a purist.

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That depends entirly upon the time period you are talking about and the region. There are plenty of classic stoves that don't resemble ose scandinan stoves at all.

SpaceBus said:

This is true. Technically stuff from the 70's is now being considered classic. Maybe we should refer to stoves 100 years + to be antique and stoves 20-100 to be classic. Really the original Vermont Castings stuff is Victorian Revival, but not the same as actual Victorian. I wouldn't even call it classic or antique styling since it is different. Really any stove that has the wide front with arched glass/door openings with rectangles and triangles cast in would be Victorian revival. This would include stoves like the Jotul F400 or the "classic" styled napolean stoves.

It's all about what you consider classic vs contemporary styling.

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I agree and i started off as an industrial designer so i understand all of the design cues. To me the victorian and gothic revival looks of those stoves are the classic stoves. The older stuff would be antique.

Jordan said:

I don't prefer contemporary interpretations of traditional designs. They are more a bastardization than anything else. Adding an ogee doesn't make it greek revival or Acanthus leaf Victorian, etc. I'm not saying all versions are ugly or don't have there place but its something entirely different. Contemporary is probably the only real signifier.

My profession is in woodworking and run my own shop. This failure in design is prevalent in most homes and its a real shame. Thats why I like the original stoves so much. The effort and care in castings and designs is un-matched today.

I also dont' think time of production has anything to do with design. I can think of many stoves that are of traditional design that were produced in the 70's and 80's. The "energy harvester" is a good example as well as everything "L.Lange co." produced.

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Yes of course a couple details don't make the style. I have a design degree worked in corporate design and then moved on to custom furniture and cabinetry. Before selling that business and going into chimneys. So yes I know design. But I also know about stoves and modern stoves put your "classics" to shame. Yes there are some design comprimises made in the name of function. But for the gains in performance I am ok with that. Regardless I prefer modern Scandinavian design over the look of the classic stuff but that is simply a matter of taste. But I agree there is bad design everywhere it is way more common than good design. But I would argue there was also plenty of bad design through all time periods. Infact some of those antique stoves you posted are pretty poor designs.

And for the record the energy harvester while the overall form is pretty interesting the castings really are not very good at all. Llange did make some fantastic designs in a variety of styles. And very good quality.

Jordan said:

Thats true but you wont find a stove like that in 1915.

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So what it is a good stove way better than anything from 1915 and it fits well in a vintage home or a modern one for that matter. It is a good designf unctionally and cosmetically.

Jordan said:

@bholler you seem really knowledgable. What modern stove do you know of that will put a "classic" stove to shame that will heat 1500sq.ft, do all the cooking, baking, and produce all the hot water on less then 2 cords a year in Vermont?

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Kitchen queens esses aga's DS makes a decent cook stove.

Jordan said:

The effort and care in castings and designs is un-matched today.

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I have to disagree with that. There are still excellent castings being done by Vermont Castings, Jotul, Dovre, etc..

Jordan said:

Seems like you got your mind set. I will just post these sub-par stoves for the record. View attachment 235973 View attachment 235975 View attachment 235974

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Not knocking the old stoves. Just that the casting of some modern stoves is of equal quality. The design varies of course. Some of those stoves are ornate and for the wealthiest of their time. Others shown there are fairly simple stoves. Whether one likes a funeral urn on top or not if a matter of taste.

Jordan said:

Seems like you got your mind set. I will just post these sub-par stoves for the record. View attachment 235973 View attachment 235975 View attachment 235974

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We get it you like these old stoves. And if their style fits with your house that's great. But I don't like the style and would not want one in my house. They also will not heat my house for the 8 to 10 hours I am at work while keeping my chimney clean so functionally they would not work for me. That doesn't mean there is anything wrong with them but they don't fit with my life.