A visit to Woodstock

[branchburner]

Took a little drive up to West Leb for the Woodstock open house this morning. I had to drop my son at school, and since I was 10 miles in the right direction I figured why not do the other 80 miles. After all, Dennis drove 1000 miles! I met Dennis (aka Backwoods Savage) and his wife and chatted a bit (sorry I didn't say goodbye, Dennis, I had to head back and get ready for work).

First off, this is about the friendliest group of people you're likely to meet anywhere. It is a true open house, meaning they let you wander anywhere in the factory and chat with anyone. Everyone I spoke with was great, there was a real family atmosphere. And secondly, I hesitate to simply call this a factory staffed by workers making a product. I'd call it a large workshop where a team of craftsmen work together to make functional works of art, one by one. It was great couple of hours.

I arrived just in time to see a test fire started in the new stove. The only thing you can really see with the stripped-down, wired-up Frankenstove is the unique angled burn tube baffle, which I stupidly forgot to go back and look at to see if the secondaries were firing. Still a lot of features up in the air (ashpan, left vs. right door option?), and no prototype with stones yet. Only drawings, some just posted: http://woodstocksoapstoneco.blogspot.com/ . They are looking for feedback, not that anyone here has strong opinions on these things... ha ha.

Tom, the boss, is a great guy and we talked for quite a while. He mentioned that in their own testing facility they have researched stoves extensively and came to the conclusion that burn-tubes alone will not give the performance they want for burning at lower temps. So they decided on a hybrid rather than a straight non-cat. It would be easy to say, "oh, some people want a non-cat, let's make one" but they are committed to making the best stove they can, which is really impressive.

Tom has convinced me I need to bring my old hollowed-out Fireview (which has no baffle/cat assembly) up to the shop so they can pop in some new guts ("Only take an hour!"). Someday...

Anyway, I look forward to going back soon (tomorrow?) for another visit, and I urge anyone who's on the fence to make the drive. Being a weekday, today was a bit more subdued than I expect tomorrow will be. No pig roast or live music or Webmaster with free goodies today, but lots of good folks and good stoves!

 

[Todd]

Thanks for the update, sounds like a good time, wish I could go.

As far as the new stove sketches go, i'm not to sure I like it. That slanted baffle takes up too much room in the fire box and could get banged around during reloading. They need to keep the fire box square. I think they are more worried about a good looking flame show than real heating needs but I could be wrong.

 

[branchburner]

That slanted baffle takes up too much room in the fire box and could get banged around during reloading.

I can see how you'd get that impression from the sketch. But seeing the stove, there is plenty of room.

There may actually be an advantage to the slant. Since it's easier to see the tubes, it may be easier to keep them in mind when loading. I don't have real experience in that respect, burning in a top-loading downdraft and various non-EPA stoves. But every time I look into a small firebox with burn tubes, I feel like I'd beat them up pretty bad trying to max out a load.

How rugged are those tubes, in general?

 

[begreen]

Tubes, what tubes? Aren't those in old radios? No tubes here. We are solid state.

Actually I am curious as to whether the final product will have tubes, a cast or a stainless manifold. Anyone know?

 

[Todd]

Yeah, they would be better off with a manifold with holes, I just don't like the looks of the burn tubes, looks like a gas grill fire. If they didn't have the slant there there would be even more loading capacity. What about a thermostat like Blaze King?

 

[BrotherBart]

Burn tubes rule!

 

[BrowningBAR]

I would be happy with a stove that operates like the Fireview but larger and has reduced clearances.

 

[branchburner]

Tubes, what tubes? Aren't those in old radios? No tubes here. We are solid state.

Actually I am curious as to whether the final product will have tubes, a cast or a stainless manifold. Anyone know?

I always refer to that burn technology as "tubes" even if they really aren't. Didn't stick my nose in the stove, since there was a fire going, but best as I could tell it was a stainless manifold. But it kind of sounds like many details are not yet written in (soap)stone about the finality of the final product.

 

[HollowHill]

Would this be a front loader? It seems like the slanting ceiling of the fire box would obstruct loading from the side??? It would be cool if it were a front loader, then with the top vent it could be set further back into a fireplace and stick out less into the room.

 

[cycloxer]

I'd have two requests from Woodstock:

1.) A front door.

2.) A more contemporary New England style.

 

[BrowningBAR]

I'd have two requests from Woodstock:

1.) A front door.

2.) A more contemporary New England style.

I do not want either of those.

 

[branchburner]

Would this be a front loader? It seems like the slanting ceiling of the fire box would obstruct loading from the side??? It would be cool if it were a front loader, then with the top vent it could be set further back into a fireplace and stick out less into the room.

Side load, with rear or top vent. I think the slanting ceiling of the fire box would make front loading tough, because when you fill it, your top log may want to be up against the front of the stove.

Side-load is a tough feature for a stove set back into a hearth. Another thing about the Fireview is that the air control is in the back of the stove, with the bypass. I kinda like the air lever up front. But the air in the Fireview comes in the back and then over the top and down the front. I couldn't believe how clean the glass was on the one they were burning.

 

[Todd]

Another good thing about the Woodstock side loaders are the reduced front clearances. Now, if only they could cut down the back clearance a little more they would have a real winner.

I'm still not too sure about this hybrid stuff, have they mentioned burn times? Those burn tubes are going to suck a lot of extra air and reduce burn times. What about the fire box size? They said 50% larger than the Fireview but I'd like to know the actual dimensions.

 

[firefighterjake]

Hmmm . . . thanks for the link to the blog . . . based on the sketch I continue to say I would be interested in seeing more of this stove.

 

[begreen]

Another good thing about the Woodstock side loaders are the reduced front clearances. Now, if only they could cut down the back clearance a little more they would have a real winner.

Side-loaders often can't be used in corner installations. I'm happy with our front loader because of the north-south loading. I wouldn't mind if the new stove was a bit more classically styled like the Keystone and Palladian. The Fireview and Classic are a bit too Victorian in styling for our house.

I'm still not too sure about this hybrid stuff, have they mentioned burn times? Those burn tubes are going to suck a lot of extra air and reduce burn times. What about the fire box size? They said 50% larger than the Fireview but I'd like to know the actual dimensions.

Good questions. Have you asked Woodstock?

 

[Todd]

Another good thing about the Woodstock side loaders are the reduced front clearances. Now, if only they could cut down the back clearance a little more they would have a real winner.

Side-loaders often can't be used in corner installations. I'm happy with our front loader because of the north-south loading. I wouldn't mind if the new stove was a bit more classically styled like the Keystone and Palladian. The Fireview and Classic are a bit too Victorian in styling for our house.

I'm still not too sure about this hybrid stuff, have they mentioned burn times? Those burn tubes are going to suck a lot of extra air and reduce burn times. What about the fire box size? They said 50% larger than the Fireview but I'd like to know the actual dimensions.

Good questions. Have you asked Woodstock?

Yes I did, haven't received an answer yet.

 

[branchburner]

I'm still not too sure about this hybrid stuff, have they mentioned burn times? Those burn tubes are going to suck a lot of extra air and reduce burn times.

I think there will be some user control over secondary air. Perhaps the burn tubes will help pump the output when heating a very large/cold area, then if you throttle it down, the cat will take over and extend the burn. If they can pull it off, I think this will be a best-of-all-worlds stove: big enough for serious cold-weather work, but with some real burn control, ala Blaze King.

I suggested they post a bigger, cleaner, whole-stove sketch on the blog. In the meantime, in honor of the Frankenstove... fire... good! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XfQ-3IMJ_uw

 

[Adios Pantalones]

I went up with Vic and we had a look around. It wasn't open house, but the guy walked us all over- gave a full tour, and we saw some stove designs being tested as well. I had the same impressions as you about the people and operation. We went back a few weeks later to pick up Vic's stove.

Go to the 7 barrel brewery in town for lunch and brewskis on the way home. Fun trip all around.

 

[fire_man]

Tubes, what tubes? Aren't those in old radios? No tubes here. We are solid state.

Actually I am curious as to whether the final product will have tubes, a cast or a stainless manifold. Anyone know?

Yup I saw it. It's a stainless manifold. Looked pretty solid.

 

[Backwoods Savage]

Yes, I thought it looked solid too. The firebox also looked bigger than described but I did no measuring.

As for the final design, nothing is set in stone there and it could change a lot between now and marketing time. I'm not sure if the stove has to be in final design or not when sending it to the independent lab for testing and EPA rating. That lab I believe is in Oregon or somewhere out in that area.

Yes, we had a grand time at Woodstock and I'd like to go back. Now if they were just a little closer it might help. Maybe the next time I'll ride the bike instead of taking the car.