EPA rated vs EPA II rated for high-efficiency fireplaces

[yurij]

Hi - Some High Efficiency fireplaces are advertised with an EPA II rating and usualy have a high efficiency ratting and low gr/hr. The VS Sequoia Catalytic (EWF36-A) claims 73% efficiency and < 2.5 gr/hr. But other fireplaces just say EPA approved and have lower efficiency and higher gr/hr ratings. The BIS Tradition / Lennox Montecito Estate is an example of the latter with 63% efficiency and 7.4 gr/hr. Are there different EPA rattings here?
Also I posted questions about those 2 fireplaces earlier. If anyone could comment that would be most appreciated. Thx again. -yurij

 

[hearthtools]

some manufactures that are not EPA phase II July 1 1990 Rating like to cornfuse us with words like
EPA rated Exempted. I know the Large Napolian Fireplace has kind of wording.

I had a contractor that wanted a LARGER box than the Kozy 42 had and I told him I dont have any stove with a larger firebox that is EPA rated.
If you want larger you are going to have to spend 3x's as much and get a FPX.

He said another dealer told him the Large Napolian is. I looked online and if you dont read close you would think it was EPA rated but it is just rated exempted.

 

[webbie]

The efficiencies might be "default" and not actual. Most stoves are not tested for efficiency.

If is gives a GPM, chances are that it was EPA tested, not exempt. But as Rod mentions, be careful of the exact wording!

 

[yurij]

Confusion does benefit the manufacturer. That's why this forum is so great to get real information.
The following link has a good explanation of the "EPA Exempt" classification (it describes the Napoleon High Country), (broken link removed to http://www.chimneysweeponline.com/hoexempt.htm)
But the BIS Tradition/Lennox Montecito Estate state the units are "EPA approved" and the statistics seems a little weak for EPA II certification (not as efficient and pollutes more, which evidently goes hand in hand).
Other fireplace vendors tout the secondary burn areas which allow them to achieve EPA II certification, but nothing of the sort is mentioned in their literature, so I am getting suspicious that this could be another case of confusion.

 

[hearthtools]

Some of the RSF fireplace show Efficiancy # and burn rates and say "as clean as EPA certified"
but the units are EPA exempt. the only way to make them EPA approved is to Add a $500 Cat kit.
I have to note that SOME of the smaller RSF fireplace ARE EPA rated.

 

[yurij]

I called and spoke with with the Lennox people about the Montecito Estate. They said it is EPA Phase II certified and the stats on the unit agree with the definitions I found on the web for certification, namely < 7.5 gr/hr of smoke for non-catalytic units (though its not clear how much wood needs to be burned for this).
I asked about the seemingly lower efficiency, they said that the efficiency tests are conducted with a standard amount of wood for all stoves and since this is a large unit, it was not enough to get the efficiency high. Sounds a bit weird
The lesson for me is to call the manufacturer directly. It seems to me that there are 3 categories of EPA "approval"
1) EPA Phase II certified (< 7.5 gr/hr smoke, but no efficiency rating?)
2) EPA certified exempt (anything goes)
3) unknown
-yurij

 

[elkimmeg]

Let me try to clear up the confusion there are actually tow types of wood fireplaces One is called decorative the other high efficiency
the decorative fireplaces are just that fireplaces that have not been tested for efficiencies of gph These types are about the same as masonry fireplaces in a metal BOX
where more heat goes up your chimney than heat gained to the living space

HIGH EFFICIENCY FIREPLACES are the ones tested and passed the EPA requirements listed and labeled passed. Not tested to without the approval labeling.

At one point The EPA did test for efficiency percentages but in recent years only listed default percentages the GPH are tested certified and recorded.
Again there are two standards tested for two type of stoves All non cat stoves must be at least 63% (Default efficiency) and emit less that 7.63 gph
all Cat models have to be tested to 72% efficiency and a Gph around 4.62. The reason for requiring a cat stove to a higher standard is the cat will degrade over a period of time and not be as efficient near its cycle end. Cats do require cleaning to opperate correctly I clean mine at the start of the season and at mid point takes less that 10 minutes with a vacuum cleaner

really replacement factors to be about $25 per year for replacement. To me a small price for cleaner burning. The companies listing efficiencies in percentages are using old listings info

meaning that was tested prior before EPA instuted using defaults. All stoves are required to be re-certified every 5 years so that older stoves may have been certified 3 or so years back.

A newly certified stove is listed at the default but may actually burn cleaner that one listed at xx 5 from past testing The only thing one might use is the GPH and there has been plenty discussion about that here. More important than any GPH , is dealer support after the sale and that goes for price or model selection. Many efficient fireplaces are of Cat technology
Even Jotuls still employ cats. Today's cat technology has had many years of refinement and improvements I find that many dealers falsely degrade cat technology probably because they do not carry them in their model line up or are not educated in the recent advancements or plain find it easier aviod them then really learn the pros and cons.