Fireplace heat drain

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Blondesense

Member
Feb 8, 2011
21
south central Missouri
Wow! Am I glad to finally find you guys! I've been looking for a site like this for a while.

We have a home that was built in the early 70's. The fireplace is what I believe is a Heatform box (or something similar)in
a masonry setting. It has a metal box and the backside of the fireplace is cinder block going into an attached garage. It also has a thermostat and blower. I'd
take a pic inside but it is currently covered by shrink wrap and I hate to tear it up at this point unless you think a pic is
necessary.

It does heat the house comfortably when burning, but it burns so fast that it's not worth it to us to use as
primary heat so this winter we just covered it up.

Consequently, the main function of it at the moment is as a drain in our heating bill.

I'm just beginning my research on replacing it with an insert and was wondering, once the insert is in place, what is
usually done to weatherproof or seal the old vent/blower areas?

I'd also appreciate any ideas to seal this temporarily for the rest of this winter. This is the coldest area of the house
and I suspect the fireplace is the reason why.
 

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Love the stone! Looks nice.

I do not have an insert. I think I have heard others say that a block off plate at the bottom and top with an insulated liner hooked up to the insert is one way to keep out the cold. Keeping a fire going 24/7 also helps!

Yours looks like it has a blower inlet to the bottom right and then heat comes out the sideways rocks above? Does it have a damper to close to keep cold air from coming down the chimney when not in use? You may have to close in the intake and output vents with mortar and stone? once an insert is installed?

You may need to have someone look it over and make recommendations. Most stove shops will come out and take a look for free.
 
Welcome, it's a nice looking setting. Those pups are looking for heat!

If we can get the actual fireplace opening dimensions and the depth of the box, we may be able to suggest some stoves for there. There was a recent thread on this topic and the Lopi Endeavor looked like a good fit in that case. The might be a good place to start if you have a Lopi or Avalon dealer nearby.
 
That looks very similar to the setup my father in law has. He stocks it maybe every 3-5 hours and it heats his entire house day and night. It's a pretty large house, maybe 2,500 sq with 2 stories and a pretty closed floorplan. If you could get it operating like his I would not trade that setup for ANYTHING.
 
Blondesense:

Could be that you've got a Superior Heatform fireplace. If it is, it's made of 1/4 inch boilerplate steel with cold air intakes either on the sides or back or both. If it's a Heatform, this fireplace will require some serious modification prior to using it to house an installed insert or stove. Have someone come in to check the condition of the steel. The Superior Heatform can rust badly, making it imperative that if it is rusted, it be removed prior to using it as a "shell" for an insert install.

One option is to entirely remove the Heatform, and refinish the opening as a masonry fireplace - then install a hearthstove or insert in the opening.

On the other hand, if the steel is in good shape - as mine was before I modified my Heatform - the steel can function as a heat shield for an installed insert - assuming the masonry that was built around it is in good shape. That said, the issue will be dealing with the heat tubes that block connection of the SS Flex Pipe to your insert or heathstove. You likely will need to install new pipe inside your existing chimney flue to exhaust your new insert/hearthstove. One or two of the heat tubes will have to be cut away to allow passage of the Flex pipe. This is doable, but it is a PITA.
 
Thanks everyone for the quick replies.
After taking a closer look, it may not be a heatform. It is heavy steel and has a slanted back. There is a rectangular opening at the top of the box and I see a round metal flue above it with the damper in the flue. I'd take some pics, but unfortunately I loaned my camera to a friend for the weekend. The one I posted is an old one off my computer.

basswidow said:
Yours looks like it has a blower inlet to the bottom right and then heat comes out the sideways rocks above? Does it have a damper to close to keep cold air from coming down the chimney when not in use?

Yes, this is correct. Actually there is an inlet on each side. There is a damper, but there still is a cold draft when it is closed.

BeGreen said:
Welcome, it's a nice looking setting. Those pups are looking for heat!

If we can get the actual fireplace opening dimensions and the depth of the box, we may be able to suggest some stoves for there. There was a recent thread on this topic and the Lopi Endeavor looked like a good fit in that case. The might be a good place to start if you have a Lopi or Avalon dealer nearby.

The box measures 36" wide and 24" tall. It has a slanted back and measures about 28' from the bottom back to the glass. The brick hearth is about 14" deep.
I know there are a couple of fireplace places in the area, but I haven't talked to anyone yet at all, let alone what they carry.
And don't worry about the pups. They're good at looking pitiful. There's hot water pipes embedded in the slab underneath that carpet.

Thanks again for the great response. I may wait until next week and return when I can get some relevant pics.
 
Might be able to squeak a PE Summit in there. How large an area will you be heating?
 
It's about 1800 ft with a very open floor plan. Downstairs, the living room, dining area, and kitchen are one open area. Upstairs are three bedrooms. All three doorways look down to the fireplace. When burning, the current fireplace and blower does the job nicely.
 
Sounds like you have several options then. Pick your fave.
 
I sealed off my unused fireplace by laying strips of an old towel over all 4 sides of the top of my chimney and laying a piece of sheet metal over that with a large flat rock to hold i place. I know its redneck but there was a ot of heat rolling out of there even with the fireplace covered.
 
Okay... To recap: I'm looking for a wood burning insert for 1800sf home with a close to ideal floorplan. Along with a blower and outside air adapter, I would really like a cooktop.
The Lopi Freedom is the current front runner with the Regency Hearth Heater a distant second.
I would appreciate any other suggestions with a cooktop.
 
Blondesense said:
Okay... To recap: I'm looking for a wood burning insert for 1800sf home with a close to ideal floorplan. Along with a blower and outside air adapter, I would really like a cooktop.
The Lopi Freedom is the current front runner with the Regency Hearth Heater a distant second.
Any other suggestions that would fit?

Ok,

see if you like this one

http://www.buckstove.com/wood/model91.html

Model 91
 
Dave_1 said:
Blondesense said:
Okay... To recap: I'm looking for a wood burning insert for 1800sf home with a close to ideal floorplan. Along with a blower and outside air adapter, I would really like a cooktop.
The Lopi Freedom is the current front runner with the Regency Hearth Heater a distant second.
Any other suggestions that would fit?

Ok,

see if you like this one

http://www.buckstove.com/wood/model91.html

Model 91

Oooooh, I like it.
I had not really considered a catalytic. I better do a bit more research.

It doesn't mention being a cooktop. I found a few in my research that extended out but didn't mention being a cooktop. Can any that extend be used as such or not?

It also looks like it might be a snug fit height wise.

Thanks.
 
Blondesense said:
Dave_1 said:
Blondesense said:
Okay... To recap: I'm looking for a wood burning insert for 1800sf home with a close to ideal floorplan. Along with a blower and outside air adapter, I would really like a cooktop.
The Lopi Freedom is the current front runner with the Regency Hearth Heater a distant second.
Any other suggestions that would fit?

Ok,

see if you like this one

http://www.buckstove.com/wood/model91.html

Model 91

Oooooh, I like it.
I had not really considered a catalytic. I better do a bit more research.

It doesn't mention being a cooktop. I found a few in my research that extended out but didn't mention being a cooktop. Can any that extend be used as such or not?

It also looks like it might be a snug fit height wise.

Thanks.

Ok,

Contact Buck & Napoleon to determine the extended surface area out of the fireplace. ;-)

Meanwhile ... Napoleon EPI-1402 Deluxe painted - $1,838, Porcelain - $2,588

Both stoves require a Fireplace Opening of: 26"W x 22"H x 14"D

that is 1-1/2 smaller than the Buck - 31-3/4" W x 23-1/2" H x 15-1/2" D

http://www.woodlanddirect.com/Firep...oleon-EPI-1402-Deluxe-EPA-Wood-Burning-Insert
 
Next question:

We are not going to install this ourselves. We will have someone certified do it, but I'm still researching the insert and installer.

Our grate is welded to the box. I assume its gonna have to go. Is this common? Would it be something normally handled by the installer or will we have to deal with it? Can we just take an angle grinder to it or will it have to be repaired/welded?
 

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I can't provide any more advice on most of your questions, but it sounds like you need to put insulation on the back side of the wall. If I read your post right, it sounds like you might have an un-insulated masonry wall. That will suck heat right out of your house. You could put up 2" blue foam in the garage and cover it with sheetrock. That would add R-11 or 12 to your wall (10 for the foam, plus a little more) without losing much garage space. There are foam panels with slots for 1x3 furring strips. You just put them in with a powder actuated nail gun (a really inexpensive tool).
 
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