Flue temperatures.

[Swedishchef]

Hey guys

Well, I contacted my stove company regarding the smell from my stove when I light. I explained that I bring the temperature of the flue up to the recommended temperature based on a thermometer (450 F or so). The guy on the phone is like " you're using a probe thermometer?" I said "yeah!"

Well, come to find out that in order to properly burn in a stove and proper operating temps, you gotta have the flue gases up to 750-900! Then you can turn it down. LOL. The damn book didn't explain that the 450 F was for a magnetic thermometer on a single wall stove pipe!

Soooo..here's the question: what temperature should I be running (flue gases). I know these values are approximate but I simply wanna give myself an idea. Double wall stove pipe with a probe thermometer. BEcause this weekend I am going to fire it up 3-4 times and get the house glowing. If it still smells on light up after those fires, I am gonna use my stove as a boat anchor.

Andrew

 

[Todd]

Those Condar probe thermometers read a little on the high side imo, but with my stove in the bypass mode I can easily get it up over 1000, after I close the bypass and engage the cat she will settle down to 600 give or take 100 degrees. I think you need to bring that stove up to the max temps in both the bypass and not and let it cool completely down and see if that cures your smell problem.

 

[Highbeam]

I'm not going to say I told you so.

Seriously, I run my condar probe meter mounted 15" above the stove on a vertical section of double wall pipe up to 1200 each day at full throttle.

After the 1200 is reached then I back down the air and maintain 600-800 until the fire needs fuel and then I reload and bring it up to the 600-800 range as soon as possible.

When a good fire is rolling with a good load of fuel for the overnight I shut the air intake completely down and the secondary combustion pushes flue temps above 850 for a long time.

Monitoring flue temps is not the most important thing. More important is to monitor stove temps to be sure that you are getting the stove itself good and hot. Push that steel plate stove to 700, or 800 if you are feeling lucky, to burn off any paint.

 

[pen]

I'm not going to say I told you so.

I will!

Don't you believe us?!?

https://www.hearth.com/econtent/index.php/forums/viewthread/52683/

Probe temps of 450 to 550 are much lower than I experience. My probe is 28 inches up the pipe and during a good hot burn with a full load of wood, it’ll sit right at the 750-800 range for hours. When I load the stove this way, I still have hot coals to start the next fire up with 12 hours later. With that said, I don’t think I’m wasting too much heat up the flue.

I really think you need to run it a bit hotter.

pen

I look forward to hearing what happens Monday and Tuesday

Good luck

pen

 

[Swedishchef]

LOL.

++sticks a bucket on his head while whistling++

Ok ok. HiBeam and Pen, yes, I know you told me so. I am sorry for not listening but I was following the damn owners manual!!

I do not have a stove top thermometer. Can I use one of those simple magnetic ones to give me a bit of an idea (the ones used for single wall stove pipes?) It's not a Condar it's an SBI pipe but I am sure they are all off by 100 degrees or so.

F*ck. I am gonna have my fire extinguisher and my hose (connected to my water tank) just in case. I must admit that if one of you guys were here I would feel damn better about it! LOL. Can't say I am not nervous.

At what temperature does the ceramic window in my door melt?

Andrew

 

[Todd]

The steel will melt before your glass, get that puppy up to 800 to cure that stank. The cheapy mag thermometers will work fine for a rough guide. Oh and don't pay attention to the burn zones on the therm it will probably be calibrated for single wall pipe.

 

[pen]

As for the stove top thermometer, one of those cheep magnetic ones are fine. For my stove, I try to keep it under 700. I think for most stoves, 650 is a good average for a "redline" so to speak. Even though they can prolly handle more, it's best to keep it below there. The only ones I can think of that really recommend under 600 are the soapstone stoves.

I'd put the thermometer in the top center of your stovetop.

Here are a few drawings I did for another post for how I use my thermometers. I have 2 magnetics and 1 probe. The probe is 28 inches up my stove pipe in the 90 degree bend

I want to make note, that this is not gospel here. It is simply what I have found to work for my stove, hooked to my chimney, with my wood, in my basement, in my little dot on the globe that I call home.

 

[Highbeam]

Might seem weird but I get a kick out of your penmanship pen.

 

[pen]

Might seem weird but I get a kick out of your penmanship pen.

hehe, yea, my handwriting is terrible. I do try. It just doesn't work for me.

My mother told me at a young age, she didn't care which path I choose through high school, so long as I learned to type. I wasn't sure why she demanded this at the time :-/

Anyway, I took a year off from wood shop and I did so and can slam out 80+ words per minute no problem still today. She certainly gave me good, practical advice that has served me well.

pen

 

[grateful]

Thanks for the diagrams, I will take notes and see what temperatures are like on the stove. Just a bit reluctant to drill holes in the double wall pipe for a probe. I've heated with wood for 30 years and never thought of using a thermometer, if its smokin just open the air supply a bit. This thermometer approach may eliminate the monthly stove pipe and chimney cleaning project, that would be great!
So, we will know if the smelly stove problem is resolved by sunday? Will the stove shop take it back if the stove continues to smell?
Steve

 

[Swedishchef]

LOL ROFLMAO :lol: I absolutely love the drawings.

Thanks Pen. I knew where to put them. BUt with this drawing, there's no going wrong. I am serious, this should be posted in a new thread for noobs (I am only 50% noob). It's very neatly explained!

I actually love the fire in your stove. Man, you could make a T SHIRT with that stove as a logo..honnestly! It owns!

I am gonna get myself a magnetic stove thermometer for my stove top.
I will also get another probe thermometer. Mine fell tongight when I took it out and it broke. F!
I am also getting some damn welding gloves. I have about 10 burns on my wrists, hands and fingers. It is becoming unpleasant. The worse one is when I lost my balanced while crouched; I grabbed the door that was open. :sick:

Thanks once again Pen. I am gonna try and get this thread bumped so everyone can see your drawing It's great!

Andrew

 

[Swedishchef]

grateful: We will know by Sunday-Monday if the smell is gone.
I have not discussed it with the retailer yet. I will take things one step at a time. Because at this point, I may lash out which could be bad. I dont often (very very rare) lose my cool..and I have started to lose it over this damn stove. That and the fact my local lumber company delivered 250 2X4s of which 75 are useless since they're so twisted.

Andrew

 

[pen]

This may be my ultimate attempt at proving my place in the nerdery. My wife rolls her eyes at my artistic abilities and tells me to stick to splitting wood.

While my pictures may rate somewhat above what my 1.5yr old can produce, they tend to rank below a 2nd grade level I am told. This may explain why the 3rd grade was the best 4 years of my life.

Nevertheless, my simplistic pictures still turn out fairly effective it seems. I am glad it helped. We will see how well they work in a few days.

Again, I am anxious to see how things are next week.

pen

 

[Cluttermagnet]

Good pix, Pen. If I ever get an NC-30 or talk my neighbor into one, that's a good 4- page tutorial.

Heck, at least your writing is legible. Mine is worse at times. ;-)

 

[Troutchaser]

Loved the drawings.
Wanna talk burns? Try a top-load when it's sitting at 600 on a four inch bed of coals.

 

[firefighterjake]

Another fan of Pen's drawings . . . I keep expecting him to add in a cartoon character of himself in the drawings.

 

[ChillyNoMore]

Great drawings, Pen -- thanks for taking the time to do them. I have my Condar flue gas probe mounted 19" above the top my steel Scan 61. I have only burning for three days so I am really new to this, but trying to learn everything I can. So far the flue temps hover around 400 even with the primary air wide open the entire time. One burn got to 600, but then dropped down again when I partially closed the primary. By the time I have coals and am ready to reload, the flue temp has dropped to 300.

So I am wondering if it is operator error or my wood. The wood came from a friend who said it is pretty old and doesn't have much BTU value left in it. Would this account for my "cool" burns or is something else at play (like my kinda short chimney)? At the same time, I would actually prefer to have more heat coming off the stove than going up the chimney. (I still need to get a magnetic thermometer for the side of the stove.) So now I'm really confused...!

 

[Battenkiller]

This may explain why the 3rd grade was the best 4 years of my life.

LMAO!

They only let me stay in 3rd for three years and then I had to move on. The spelling was holding me back, but I guess they finally said, "Enuf is enuf."

 

[mhrischuk]

For the layman....


My insert manual states to not exceed 600F on the stove top. What advantage is it to monitor flue temp as well?

 

[firefighterjake]

For the layman....


My insert manual states to not exceed 600F on the stove top. What advantage is it to monitor flue temp as well?

1) Lets me know if my flue temp is too cool and may be causing creosote to form . . . or conversely is getting too hot to ignite any creosote or damage chimney.

2) I have also learned to run my woodstove based on the flue temp . . . and in fact rely on this temp more often than my woodstove temp when I'm opening or closing the air control.

 

[oldspark]

"I have also learned to run my woodstove based on the flue temp . . . and in fact rely on this temp more often than my woodstove temp when I’m opening or closing the air control."
Was not that long ago I was told I was an idiot for running my stove that way.

 

[Todd]

I like to keep an eye on everthing I can, flue temps, stove temps and most important, the fire itself. All these tools help operate your stove for max efficiency. Flue temps are most important for me because it's a cat soapstone stove, so the stove top temps lag way behind and I can get a quicker idea of cat light off from the flue temps on reloads and cold starts. Once cruising along the flue temps drop and I monitor the fire and stove top temps more than flue temps.

 

[shawneyboy]

I use a stove top and a flue probe temp. Flue gas runs usually between 900 and a grand, stove top at about 550. I have really stopped worrying about stove top temps and run it off of the flue temps for the most part,

Shawn

 

[Blue Vomit]

Good pix, Pen. If I ever get an NC-30 or talk my neighbor into one, that's a good 4- page tutorial.

Heck, at least your writing is legible. Mine is worse at times. ;-)

I know I'm getting into this thread late but I can't help but comment on Pen's pics. Picasso could not have done better.
Pen, any chance you would change this to your avatar?

 

[Swedishchef]

Isn't it a sweet pic? Pen is damn handy with his digital drawings!!

As everyone said, flue temps help monitor creosote formation/lack thereof.

However, I don't agree about flue temps with most people on this forum about the proper flue temps. I tend to run mine between 450-550. ANy higher than that and I feel that my heat is going up the chimney and not in the house. My probe thermometer could also be off, I will try another one this winter. And no, there is NO creosote whatsoever in my chimney. Just some flakey ashes.

Andrew