Harman P68 shutdown----NOT!

[jcataba]

Hi Folks, Please forgive any mistakes as this is my first post. I have been a lurker on this site since I bought my stove in March of 08. I slayed the propane beast the minute the P68 was fired up for the first time. Other then having my igniter replaced last year I have had no real issues with my stove. The stove will burn anything I feed it. I've burned Newp, Country Boy (my hands down favorite), Hamer's hot ones, Dry Creek and just recently Barefoot. I bought a dozen bags of Barefoot last week to test and the first thing I noticed was the stove would not shut down when it reached temp (Room mode). It would just stay on that low maintenance flame mode for hours. The only way I could get it to go off was to turn it off. At this point the last thing I was thinking was pellet issue. I looked up the old posts on here and put a call in to my dealer and all signs pointed to a possible ESP problem. I removed and cleaned the ESP probe. Still wouldn't shutoff by itself. My dealer came out yesterday and put it through all it's paces testing the ESP etc. Everything checked out so he suggested I clean my vent pipe that I was only cleaning once a season(I vent to an existing triple wall pipe I had for my wood stove). Last night I cleaned the vent pipe.That didn't help, still would not shut down. This morning I did my weekly cleaning of the stove. (I have been accused of cleaning my stove to much). I removed the last of the Barefoot pellets and put in some Newp. I am in the middle of seeing if this makes a difference.

I guess after all this long post I'm asking, has anyone heard of a bad ESP probe, or room sensor wire or circuit board even if these components passed a diagnostic test? I am a technician with a public utility and I am still thinking the ESP probe is faulty. And the last bit of info is the Barefoot pellets(batch 09-10) although burning pretty hot I did notice they are longer then I've seen before some as long as 2+ inches. I will post later if the Barefoots were the issue.

Sorry for the long post.

 

[Lousyweather]

since there is no real good way to test the ESP other than hooking the DDM to it and seeing what it's currently reading, I would tend to agree with you. One would have to monitor the probe tempt while starting the unit, and then watch it as it shut down, all the while watching the ESP temps indicated on the DDM. If not the ESP, then the circuitboard. Red wire ESP probe?

 

[jcataba]

ESP is white wire.

 

[Lousyweather]

ESP is white wire.

AFTER the white wire, it will change over to a wire of a different color

 

[jcataba]

Forgot to say it turns over to black wire.

 

[AVIVIII]

I'm gonna go with the obvious, and not to be a jerk, but did the ignition switch happen to get flipped to manual instead of auto?

 

[jcataba]

I appreciate the reply and don't mind covering all the bases, it is in auto. And as an update, I have been running the stove all day and it is operating normally. As much as I wouldn't think it, it is looking like the barefoot pellets were the culprit. I am surmising that perhaps the barefoot pellets being longer (more mass) was keeping the stove temp hotter in the pre-shutdown phase never letting the temp drop enough in the stove to eventually shut down. That's just my thought, I am far from being an experienced pellet burner like a lot of you folks are.

 

[MSmith66]

ESP is white wire.

I have replaced more than a few ESP probes this year because of this issue. Talk to your dealer about the replacement ESP probe.It maybe still under warrenty.

 

[jcataba]

I will check with the dealer. How many ESP probes did you go through?

 

[Lousyweather]

after the ignitor, the most common culprit is the ESP probe......frankly, its usually NOT the epllets, unless they have the rep for being awful, which Barefoot doesnt. BUT, any company can produce a bad batch or two......

 

[pfmaloney]

I've only had my Accentra Insert since Feb so i am still in a learning mode. My insert never shuts down when the temperature is reached in Room temp mode. I am heating a 3200 sq ft two story well insulated home. I have the ESP probe located twenty feet from the insert, extending off of a half wall between our family room and kitchen. The room with the insert has a ceiling fan on medium in reverse to help move the warm air. I bought a digital thermometer and placed it near the ESP to monitor the insert. It will reach and maintain the temperature that I set on the Harman. With the colder outside temps, i have been averaging around two bags of pellets a day. This seemed accpetable to me, but now after reading this thread, I'm curious if this sounds normal since it never shuts down. I have the igniter set to Auto.
What do you guys think?

...Pat

 

[SmokeyTheBear]

I will check with the dealer. How many ESP probes did you go through?

Just so you know msmith66 services stoves.

 

[SmokeyTheBear]

I've only had my Accentra Insert since Feb so i am still in a learning mode. My insert never shuts down when the temperature is reached in Room temp mode. I am heating a 3200 sq ft two story well insulated home. I have the ESP probe located twenty feet from the insert, extending off of a half wall between our family room and kitchen. The room with the insert has a ceiling fan on medium in reverse to help move the warm air. I bought a digital thermometer and placed it near the ESP to monitor the insert. It will reach and maintain the temperature that I set on the Harman. With the colder outside temps, i have been averaging around two bags of pellets a day. This seemed accpetable to me, but now after reading this thread, I'm curious if this sounds normal since it never shuts down. I have the igniter set to Auto.
What do you guys think?

...Pat

It has to be at set point for a certain period of time for shutdown to complete IIRC from several of the Harman techs on here.

In order for the system to operate correctly however the ESP and control board have to be setup to work together as there is more than one version of the ESP. The system has one endpoint goal that of maintaining set point so if your stove is doing that it is working correctly.

 

[Harman Lover 007]

I've only had my Accentra Insert since Feb so i am still in a learning mode. My insert never shuts down when the temperature is reached in Room temp mode. I am heating a 3200 sq ft two story well insulated home. I have the ESP probe located twenty feet from the insert, extending off of a half wall between our family room and kitchen. The room with the insert has a ceiling fan on medium in reverse to help move the warm air. I bought a digital thermometer and placed it near the ESP to monitor the insert. It will reach and maintain the temperature that I set on the Harman. With the colder outside temps, i have been averaging around two bags of pellets a day. This seemed accpetable to me, but now after reading this thread, I'm curious if this sounds normal since it never shuts down. I have the igniter set to Auto.
What do you guys think?

...Pat

First of all, your ESP is internal in the stove. It senses the exhaust temp and adjusts the stove accordingly to give you optimal burn. Your temp probe is what you have 20 feet away. Being that far from the stove, I'm not surprised to hear you say the stove never shuts down. If it was closer to the stove, I'd bet it would shut down.

 

[slls]

I could never figure out why Harman made his stove so complicated, after all it just burns wood.
He must be German, they are noted for over engineering.

 

[MSmith66]

I've only had my Accentra Insert since Feb so i am still in a learning mode. My insert never shuts down when the temperature is reached in Room temp mode. I am heating a 3200 sq ft two story well insulated home. I have the ESP probe located twenty feet from the insert, extending off of a half wall between our family room and kitchen. The room with the insert has a ceiling fan on medium in reverse to help move the warm air. I bought a digital thermometer and placed it near the ESP to monitor the insert. It will reach and maintain the temperature that I set on the Harman. With the colder outside temps, i have been averaging around two bags of pellets a day. This seemed accpetable to me, but now after reading this thread, I'm curious if this sounds normal since it never shuts down. I have the igniter set to Auto.
What do you guys think?

...Pat

First of all, your ESP is internal in the stove. It senses the exhaust temp and adjusts the stove accordingly to give you optimal burn. Your temp probe is what you have 20 feet away. Being that far from the stove, I'm not surprised to hear you say the stove never shuts down. If it was closer to the stove, I'd bet it would shut down.

Your probe maybe to far away from the stove. You should be keeping it some where in the same room. That far away, your stove may never shut down until mid summer.

 

[MSmith66]

I will check with the dealer. How many ESP probes did you go through?

I service alot of pellet,coal,and corn stoves in my area.

 

[pfmaloney]

Your probe maybe to far away from the stove. You should be keeping it some where in the same room. That far away, your stove may never shut down until mid summer.

It is in the same room, just the opposite side. I moved it closer and there's a smaller flame now. Unfortunately, I think the rest of the house will be cooler, so I may end up moving it back. I've been using the insert to heat the whole house (3200 sq ft 2 story). For tonight, I'll keep it closer to the insert and see how it goes.

 

[jcataba]

Just an update on my stove trouble, it turns out the stove wouldn't shut down when I loaded up and started burning Hamers. So my assumption of Barefoot pellets being responsible was wrong. 30 minutes ago I put in a new ESP probe and am now burning Hamer's. I'm keeping my fingers crossed that the ESP is the problem. I will know in a few hours.

 

[Delta-T]

I could never figure out why Harman made his stove so complicated, after all it just burns wood.
He must be German, they are noted for over engineering.

Its really not that complicated, so long as you're willing to learn it. Its just not like other stoves.

 

[jcataba]

Update to my update. This stove will not shut down. I ran the stove for about an hour then turned the temp down to 55 degrees. It is coming up on the five hour mark and it is still in the real low mode but won't completely shut off. I guess I will call the dealer up tomorrow and see what's next. I am now thinking control board. On march 8 this stoves warranty was up on the electronics. I'm hoping he can do something for me in that regard.

 

[dryttri]

Had the same problem on my P68 when it was new (3 yr ago).
They replaced the ESP (In the exhaust duct) and the PC board.
It fixed it and has worked fine since.
I am running in stove temp mode and auto ignite.
To shut down, I just move the "Mode" knob to off and it is out within 1 hour.
I would push them for a new PC board.
Just make sure that they set the "dip switches" correctly.
My tech neglected to set them right on the first go.
Did not hurt anything just ran stupid for a while till I set them correctly.

 

[jcataba]

Thanks Sasquatch, I did just that and it is purring like a kitten. In fact the dealer that came out to put in the new board said he has had to replace several circuit boards for this problem. I guess the snag in this problem is when they trouble shoot it with the DDM? nothing shows as a problem. But like I said I'm running great now. And yes the tech knew about the dp switch settings. They took care of it under warranty. However the 3 year warranty was up March the 8th so going forward it's on me. I'm not complaining one bit, this stove heats my Cape Cod home just fine. I have burned somewhere in the neighborhood of 2 1/2 +/- tons so far this year and 50 gallons of propane. (I run my furnace once a week just to keep it exercised just in case). And going forward I scored 3 tons of Hamers a few months ago from Lowes for $168.00 a ton. I've got almost 2 tons of Newp left from this season also. So with 5 tons laid in I guess I'm approaching the coveted pellet pig status.

 

[dryttri]

Good News Bogey -

Glad it did the trick.
I run 5-6 ton a year of pellets. Real low end stuff that I get local for less than $200 for 60 bags out the door.
The stove loves them. Propane company is sending me "Don't you love us anymore" letters.
If you do not already have one. Get yourself a large lab type nylon cylinder brush (2 1/2" dia X 24" OAL) to clean out the exhaust duct (ESP probe).
Works great and saves a lot of headaches.

 

[jcataba]

Thanks for the brush tip Sasquatch. I had been cleaning the exhaust duct with an oval pellet vent brush on the flex fiberglass rod. Had been working OK except it can snag the ESP. I was looking for a better brush just for this.The lab type cylinder brush sounds like a winner. I will look on line for it.