House fire from insert around the corner here...
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LLigetfa
Minister of Fire
Could be that the liner doesn't go all the way or they didn't clean it out well before putting in the liner. I hate seeing wood so close on the chimney breast. Mine is all metal studs, durock, and drywall. Same thing with the chase upstairs.
ckarotka
Minister of Fire
Is it possible that the piece that fell broke, tore or dislodged the liner?
Either way I hate to see thngs like this before the holidays or any for that matter.
Before I left the house today I triple checked everything, being Xmas eve and Mr. Murphy always loves to
show his face at the worst time.
Either way I hate to see thngs like this before the holidays or any for that matter.
Before I left the house today I triple checked everything, being Xmas eve and Mr. Murphy always loves to
show his face at the worst time.
Neighbor had been burning for years. Had ss installed by dealer and swept annually. Burned hard wood that was well seasoned.
Had a chimney fire several years ago.
How?
Ss liner only went partially up chimney.
They thought they had done everything correctly and, according to their dealer, they had.
They didn't know about this forum.
Didn't know the liner should have extended all the way up the chimney. They assumed the installer knew what he was doing and assumed that it did extent the entire length of chimney.
As new wood burners who can blame them.
The sweep is the one, IMHO, who should have said something.....
Stuff happens.
They now know about fully lined chimneys and are back on track. (The RIGHT track. ;-) )
Scary thing is that there are many stove dealers who do not know how to properly install their products. New wood burners don't know about this site. (I didn't with our first insert and was one of those ignorant consumers who did trust the sales person. Never again! ) They trust the dealers especially when the dealer supplies the installer.
Personally I am surprised there are not more chimney/ house fires as a result of improperly installed stoves/inserts. Also that most people really do not know how to burn with these newer stoves/inserts.
I consider myself very fortunate.
Happy and Safe Holidays to you all. :coolsmile:
Had a chimney fire several years ago.
How?
Ss liner only went partially up chimney.
They thought they had done everything correctly and, according to their dealer, they had.
They didn't know about this forum.
Didn't know the liner should have extended all the way up the chimney. They assumed the installer knew what he was doing and assumed that it did extent the entire length of chimney.
As new wood burners who can blame them.
The sweep is the one, IMHO, who should have said something.....
Stuff happens.
They now know about fully lined chimneys and are back on track. (The RIGHT track. ;-) )
Scary thing is that there are many stove dealers who do not know how to properly install their products. New wood burners don't know about this site. (I didn't with our first insert and was one of those ignorant consumers who did trust the sales person. Never again! ) They trust the dealers especially when the dealer supplies the installer.
Personally I am surprised there are not more chimney/ house fires as a result of improperly installed stoves/inserts. Also that most people really do not know how to burn with these newer stoves/inserts.
I consider myself very fortunate.
Happy and Safe Holidays to you all. :coolsmile:
iceman
Minister of Fire
I saw tht on the news the other day.... channel 22 is always up in noho! it looks like it may have been a full liner its just hanging there even after they ripped it out... but could be on run up halfway..... seems like heat was coming out the front and got behind the wood panel wall.... that was prolly the no-no must not have checkfor gaps before doing install
Another reason I'm happy my chimney is exposed on the interior wall.... and that the liner runs the length of course.
As bad as it is to have a fire it looks like they caught it before it spread. Good thing they had smoke detectors and a very fast response from the fire department. I'm glad everyone is alright. That must have been quite a frightening experience. This is why liners get three fasteners at every joint and insulated. A chimney may look fine when it's lined, but who knows what shape it will be in 3 or 5 years down the road.
"Nichols said firefighters suspect the stove insert caused the blaze. A piece of chimney lining had fallen out, exposing the flue to the wood, Nichols explained. Over time, the wood dried out and eventually ignited the day before Christmas."
http://www.gazettenet.com/2009/12/24/early-morning-blaze-damages-florence-road-home-northampton
"Nichols said firefighters suspect the stove insert caused the blaze. A piece of chimney lining had fallen out, exposing the flue to the wood, Nichols explained. Over time, the wood dried out and eventually ignited the day before Christmas."
http://www.gazettenet.com/2009/12/24/early-morning-blaze-damages-florence-road-home-northampton
savageactor7
Minister of Fire
tfdchief
Minister of Fire
As a firefighter for 31 yrs., I can tell you, the ones on Christmas always seem worse. I hate it for these people. Glad the FD got there and did a good job. I have seen this happen many times and most often the people never burn wood again. It scares them to much.
LLigetfa
Minister of Fire
Ja, those Christmas day fires are often due to the paper from the gift wrapping setting of the creosote.
I hate hearing about fires resulting from faulty installation or ignorance.
I think a lot of people new to wood burning tend to think that woodstoves are "safe" now. And while they are greatly improved the important thing to consider is how many OTHER variables there are in the whole safety equation. And just how important it is to pay attention to all of those variables before you "touch off the first fire". Some very smart person on this forum once pointed out that having a controlled fire INSIDE your home is inherently dangerous and the statement has stuck with me ever since I read it. It sounds so obvious but it's something too many tend to overlook. As the picture at the top of this thread attests.
I think a lot of people new to wood burning tend to think that woodstoves are "safe" now. And while they are greatly improved the important thing to consider is how many OTHER variables there are in the whole safety equation. And just how important it is to pay attention to all of those variables before you "touch off the first fire". Some very smart person on this forum once pointed out that having a controlled fire INSIDE your home is inherently dangerous and the statement has stuck with me ever since I read it. It sounds so obvious but it's something too many tend to overlook. As the picture at the top of this thread attests.
iceman
Minister of Fire
i wonder if stuff around the outer shell of an insert with ceramic wool would be another preventive measure...i am thinking as long as i dont get air intake blocked that would also keep the inside of the fireplace cooler therefore could possibly help something like tht from happening.... tht combined with my block off plae should dramatically reduce my chances of that happening....yes no?
Looks to me like the fireplace was not built to code. Somehow the heat escaped the firebox and migrated into the wood paneling above the firebox. The firebox (mantle area)seems to be excessively protuding into the room. There is a rectangular hole in the wall just above the mantle. Did the firemen do that? Where is the outlet on that stove? On top or back?
Flatbedford
Minister of Fire
Thirty years ago my neighbors put an insert in the fireplace of their older house. At about 5 am on January 4, 1980 they came pounding on our door telling us to call the FD. Due to various problems, extreme cold, no house numbers or 911, and the first firetruck showing up almost an hour after the first call, just about everything was lost. I was only 9 at the time, but my father is an architect and was involved in the reconstruction. It was determined that the extra heat from the insert caused the masonry chimney to get so hot that it eventually ignited the wood around it. I would be very careful about using an older chimney with a new insert or stove without thorough inspection. I remember that day very vividly even 30 years later.
A house just down the road from me burned nearly to the ground on 12/20. I know that he was a wood burner, but I don't know what caused the fire.
A house just down the road from me burned nearly to the ground on 12/20. I know that he was a wood burner, but I don't know what caused the fire.
cycloxer
Minister of Fire
It looks and reads to me like this was a full stainless liner that remained intact. The mortar section that broke free exposed some wood that was subjected to too much heat and eventually caught fire. This is why even with a full stainless liner your chimney needs to be in reasonably good shape to still be safe for the long term.
I like having a fully exposed brick chimney inside and out. This is one reason why. This is also why I inspected and cleaned my chimney before installing my stainless liner and block-off plates top and bottom.
If you look closely in the main picture right above the mantel you can see the stainless liner and a section of fully charred wood just to the right. It looks like that is the area that ignited. It matches the burn marks on the block. Why there is so much wood framing right there is beyond me. I really don't like to see that. I have seen houses built like that and even if it is to code (which I doubt) it is sketchy.
I guess the good news is that this could have been really bad and the damage looks fixable for not too much $$$. Actually they are lucky because they still have the house and now they can make that mantel and hearth setup safe. One other point, the mantel and trim (top & side) don't look like they meet clearances and there are no shields.
I like having a fully exposed brick chimney inside and out. This is one reason why. This is also why I inspected and cleaned my chimney before installing my stainless liner and block-off plates top and bottom.
If you look closely in the main picture right above the mantel you can see the stainless liner and a section of fully charred wood just to the right. It looks like that is the area that ignited. It matches the burn marks on the block. Why there is so much wood framing right there is beyond me. I really don't like to see that. I have seen houses built like that and even if it is to code (which I doubt) it is sketchy.
I guess the good news is that this could have been really bad and the damage looks fixable for not too much $$$. Actually they are lucky because they still have the house and now they can make that mantel and hearth setup safe. One other point, the mantel and trim (top & side) don't look like they meet clearances and there are no shields.
Yes, I see where Cycloxer is pointing out...top middle of mantle looks like a piece of cmu is missing and the liner is visible. Very odd.
Until I saw that, thought is might be the other typical fireplace problem: a gap behind steel lintel, between the lintel and metal damper/smoke chamber assembly. Often, if you look up behind the steel lintel that holds the veneer brick, there'll be a gap between it and the metal damper assembly. The gap shouldn't be there. If it is, it allows heat and smoke to travel up behind the veneer brick, outside of the smoke chamber and behind the mantel construction above.
Until I saw that, thought is might be the other typical fireplace problem: a gap behind steel lintel, between the lintel and metal damper/smoke chamber assembly. Often, if you look up behind the steel lintel that holds the veneer brick, there'll be a gap between it and the metal damper assembly. The gap shouldn't be there. If it is, it allows heat and smoke to travel up behind the veneer brick, outside of the smoke chamber and behind the mantel construction above.
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