King 40 Install

[Quirke]

We're adding on to our house and getting a King 40 with ultra base installed in the new space.

Our contractor has experience installing/building stoves and fireplaces, but isn't familiar with Blaze King. I purchased the stove a few months ago, but haven't ordered any pipe as we only had a rough idea of where it was going to be situated.

Now plans are beginning to firm up and more specifics can be made for the installation.

The stove will be kitty cornered in the new space and we've roughly worked out where the pipe will go straight up through the roof - between the first and second joist (first joist is 2ft from the wall). The roof is a 12/6 pitch and metal.


We're looking for it to look similar to this, with cultured stone on the walls, but also a mantle partway up the wall.

While I haven't ordered blowers for the stove (I don't think they'll be necessary) there will be an outlet just in case. I'll also be purchasing the air intake kit with which I'm planning to draw air from down below the floor in the crawlspace. We'll have a heat exchanger working with a forced air furnace and a radon fan down there so I don't believe there should be any pressure issues drawing from there.

What pipe considerations I should be aware of for cleaning and performance? Obviously all insulated pipe to maintain heat and draft. Would a telescoping piece be advisable? Or keep everything as fixed as possible and clean with a sooteater up through the stove.
While the 12/6 roof isn't overly steep, the location near the edge means there will be a good height of exterior pipe that I'd rather not try to get up above every year.

The pipe will be on the windward side of the roof, which faces the lake and sits on top of a slope (30ft above water level). Prevailing winds are from the northwest, and the house/roof faces northest, so some wind will be climbing the up the hill and up the roof, presumably causing some increased pressure. There are some trees and hills to the north and west so we're out of the line of fire for the worst of the wind. Approximately how much added height should be added, or would that be negligible?

Any other things I should be cognizant of?

Thanks for sharing your expertise and experience!

 

[BKVP]

Use black double wall pipe inside. Yes to telescoping section. Makes it tidy to sweep and everything goes into the bucket.
Use a well ventilated cap. Make certain you use minimum of 15' total.

BKVP

 

[Quirke]

Use black double wall pipe inside. Yes to telescoping section. Makes it tidy to sweep and everything goes into the bucket.
Use a well ventilated cap. Make certain you use minimum of 15' total.

BKVP

Great! That sounds straightforward.

We're at 310m above sea level, just into the recommended 15.5ft minimum, and I'm aiming for a couple extra feet to steer clear of 'just enough'.

Should I be safe from overdraft if I keep it under 20ft?

Thanks!

 

[BKVP]

Great! That sounds straightforward.

We're at 310m above sea level, just into the recommended 15.5ft minimum, and I'm aiming for a couple extra feet to steer clear of 'just enough'.

Should I be safe from overdraft if I keep it under 20ft?

Thanks!

Yes.

BKVP

 

[Dieselhead]

Even with sweeping bottom up pipe removal is needed to clean the cat chamber each time, unless you pull the cat and want to replace the gasket each time. Telescope is the way to go.

 

[Tron]

Even with sweeping bottom up pipe removal is needed to clean the cat chamber each time, unless you pull the cat and want to replace the gasket each time. Telescope is the way to go.

Definitively. One issue with that is that it gets scratched. The sections are usually fastened to each other with sheet metal screws, which bend the outer pipe a bit inward at the screw hole and create a sharp point. So when you slide the telescoping part up, it scratches on the outside of the lower part. I don't really see a way to prevent that.
But that's just an aesthetic issue.

 

[Murray01]

If you don’t have an attic space access for inspection or your chimney is in a corner consider leaving some of the ceiling open for the WETT inspector. He will be happier.

 

[BKVP]

Definitively. One issue with that is that it gets scratched. The sections are usually fastened to each other with sheet metal screws, which bend the outer pipe a bit inward at the screw hole and create a sharp point. So when you slide the telescoping part up, it scratches on the outside of the lower part. I don't really see a way to prevent that.
But that's just an aesthetic issue.

I never put the screws in.

BKVP

 

[Highbeam]

I like those raised heel trusses. It is not fun trying to work in the super tight tapered part of the attic above the walls with standard trusses. More insulation thickness too.

Everybody should have a telescoping section for working on a BK. You will need access from above annually to lube the mechanism and super clean the swept debris.

I have a similar install and dont go up on the roof anymore. The sooteater works so well.

Oh and if you are not required by law to have a bird screen then I would recommend that you skip it. They clog and will be a nightmare to clean if you have such a tall stack above the 6:12 roof.

Lastly, don't forget that you need roof braces at every 5' above the roof deck.

 

[Highbeam]

I never put the screws in.

BKVP

I often wonder if these slip joints are meant to slip with heat. If locking them in with screws creates a stress on the stove or other parts.

For whatever reason, my current slip joint slips smoothly with no scratching and I do use the screws but not too tight since frequent removal might strip them.

 

[Murray01]

Screws must be in to be compliant with Canadian code. See item #29.

 

[Tron]

I never put the screws in.

Yeah, well, the guys that installed our chimney did. But I agree that probably wasn't necessary. But the damage is done.

 

[Dieselhead]

Definitively. One issue with that is that it gets scratched. The sections are usually fastened to each other with sheet metal screws, which bend the outer pipe a bit inward at the screw hole and create a sharp point. So when you slide the telescoping part up, it scratches on the outside of the lower part. I don't really see a way to prevent that.
But that's just an aesthetic issue.

I used to get those scratches. What I did was disassemble the pipe while off for cleaning then used my grinder with a flap wheel to smooth out the inside where the screw penetrated. That removed the burr that was causing the scratches.

 

[Quirke]

Our addition is finally moving along. I sent the list of pipe parts to my Blaze King dealer - they use Olympia Chimney of Canada.

What are people's thoughts on this rain cap with regards to creosote buildup? Should I trim some of the bands to reduce places for creosote to deposit?
Part CVA-C08

Obviously the wide gaps are much better than a wire screen, but it's a lot more material than just a raised plate to stop rain from entering the pipe. But with a 13" diameter it shouldn't cause much resistance to exhaust flow, even with some buildup.
Obviously it'll stop birds from nesting, but could it also provide some downdraft protection from wind? Any other potential benefits?

Thanks!

 

[BKVP]

Olympia Chimney manufacturing is based in Pennsylvania. ICC is based in Canada. Both are great companies to work with.

As for the cap, the fewer the bands the better.

BKVP

 

[Murray01]

Personally I’d leave them on until you have a reason to remove them. The biggest reason to leave the bands on would be the WETT Inspection, by altering the cap you have modified the OEM design and possibly giving the inspector a reason to fail the inspection or at the very least question you on why you altered the cap from the original design.

If you’re running the stove as per BK instructions with good dry wood you shouldn’t have issues with creosote buildup, where you might have issues will be in the dead of winter with ice buildup, then you could consider climbing up on the roof with a pair of tin snips. When I get ice buildup I open the thermostat to high for 20 minutes or so and that takes care of the ice.

 

[Quirke]

Personally I’d leave them on until you have a reason to remove them. The biggest reason to leave the bands on would be the WETT Inspection, by altering the cap you have modified the OEM design and possibly giving the inspector a reason to fail the inspection or at the very least question you on why you altered the cap from the original design.

If you’re running the stove as per BK instructions with good dry wood you shouldn’t have issues with creosote buildup, where you might have issues will be in the dead of winter with ice buildup, then you could consider climbing up on the roof with a pair of tin snips. When I get ice buildup I open the thermostat to high for 20 minutes or so and that takes care of the ice.

Good points. I'm definitely not going to do anything until the WETT certification is done. I can't wait to get this stove running and don't want to risk delaying that unnecessarily.

I've always run the existing stove nice and hot after a reload to help avoid creosote issues, but it has a cap with no bands or screens to worry about.

We are getting a propane furnace with this addition, and need to use enough propane to keep the supplier happy, so I can't heat exclusively with the BK. I'm planning to use the furnace primarily in the shoulder seasons and the BK in the coldest months. I know that I'll be missing out on the BK's legendary ability to run ultra efficient at ultra low burn rates, but this should avoid the potential low temperature/draft conditions that risk creosote/ice, and the possibility of the cat falling out of the active range from setting the thermostat too low.

This stove will no doubt be overkill for our situation 99% of the time, but we live at the bottom of a long steep driveway that prevents propane delivery in the winter and power outages make a secondary heat source essential.

 

[Murray01]

We run our Princess during the shoulder season because I’m too cheap to pay SaskPower. I just cleaned the brand new chimney and stove after 5 weeks of shoulder season burning and got about a cup of soot with a bit of creosote. Not even enough soot to spill into the firebox, it was sitting on top of the bypass frame. The old stove(BK Princess 1990) with single wall stovepipe would have produced about 3X the soot/creosote, needless to say I was impressed. Being a new install I wanted to do a dry run sweep to see how much soot was building up plus a practice run when the weather was favourable. Trying to gauge how often this setup will be to be swept during the winter. I’d suggest you do the same until you have a feel for the soot/creosote buildup over time.

Burning Jack Pine at 15% moisture content.

Follow the instruction manual and you’ll have no issues with shoulder season or the CAT falling out of the active zone.

I’d let the propane company get their “pound of flesh” elsewhere but that’s just me. Kids used to call me a cheapskate until they had to start paying their own bills, now I’m only frugal.

Good luck with the new stove.

 

[Quirke]

We have a 1000g tank because our steep driveway prohibits them from filling during the winter.
If we don't use enough propane we'll get charged more for the rental or they'll replace it with a smaller tank that won't be enough for a winter in the event something happens with the stove.

 

[Highbeam]

We have a 1000g tank because our steep driveway prohibits them from filling during the winter.
If we don't use enough propane we'll get charged more for the rental or they'll replace it with a smaller tank that won't be enough for a winter in the event something happens with the stove.

Why not just buy your own tank? They even have some that you bury so it won't float away or get holes shot in it.

 

[Quirke]

The rental and installation costs were so low that it comes out cheaper for many, many years over buying our own. We'll definitely use enough propane between leaving the house for vacations, the water heater, propane generator (future purchase), and times that I'll be too busy and tired to stay on top of the stove. Yes, the BK will be a lot less work than my current stove, but I know there will be days where I'll appreciate letting the furnace do its thing.

I love making firewood and heating with a stove, but I don't want to be a slave to the task and thankfully don't need to penny pinch to that extent to keep the house warm.