Living With an Obsolete Pellet Stove

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wilbilt

New Member
Hearth Supporter
Oct 13, 2007
243
Nor Cal
So, I have been using this old Trail Blazer stove for a month or two now. The model is a "1600 Classic PS" or something similar.

The stove is vintage 1994 or so, and the manufacturer is long out of business. It was a freebie. I have been looking for a manual or any other literature, but so far have come up empty-handed. Most of the pellet stove information I have found relates to modern units festooned with bells and whistles.

This thing is quite primitive by today's standards. No auto-ignition, no thermostat. It does have all of the basic safety features, though.

I have been experiencing an issue for the past week or so related to excessive augur feed rates in relation to the burn. If run on anything but "low", the pellets would quickly fill and overflow the burn pot, choking the combustion. There are two trimpots accessible by small screwdriver for the augur feed rate. One is marked "H" and one is marked "L". The "L" trim was responsive to adjustment, but the "H" screw seemed to do nothing.

The augur cycles once about every ten seconds. The pots control the length of the augur cycle, thus controlling the amount of fuel dumped into the burn pot. Try as I might to fine tune these adjustments, it would overfill and nearly kill the fire if the output control was set anywhere but "Low".

As the nights have been getting colder, This has become more of a concern. The "Low" setting just doesn't cut it when the outside temps are in the 30s.

This morning, my wife shut it down around 10:30 in preparation to leave for work. I had left about 6:00, after putting the stove into "shutdown" mode for several minutes to burn out some of the unburned fuel. I set it to "Low" before leaving, and it feebly attempted to heat the house until she shut it down.

Arriving home this afternoon, I got a wild hair and decided to investigate the beast a little bit. I pulled off the cover attached to the control board and poked around with a flashlight. The board is very simple, no Pentium processors here. A couple of chips, a few capacitors and resistors pretty much sum it up. I looked at the solder joints, but didn't see anything obviously wrong.

I blew out the trimpots, hoping that maybe they were just dirty. Looking around inside the stove, I could see the ONE blower fan. The same fan is used for combustion and convection. There does not appear to be an exhaust fan on the vent pipe.

One fan does it all. It is mounted in the stove base, and essentially pressurizes the the entire stove. It pushes air into the heat exchangers, and under the burn pot as well (!). After my visual perusings, I put it back together and lit it.

I have noticed in the past that I could feel a fair amount of air escaping the left side panel at the front. I never thought much about it, but today after lighting the stove, I gave the panel a whack and it popped back in. The air leak is now nearly gone.

The effect on the combustion was immediate. The feed rate is no longer excessive, and the stove is burning very well right now.

I guess sometimes, you just need to kick it. :)
 
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wilbilt said:
I have noticed in the past that I could feel a fair amount of air escaping the left side panel at the front. I never thought much about it, but today after lighting the stove, I gave the panel a whack and it popped back in. The air leak is now nearly gone.

The effect on the combustion was immediate. The feed rate is no longer excessive, and the stove is burning very well right now.

I guess sometimes, you just need to kick it. :)


Errr, do I understand correctly that combustion chamber air is escaping into your home (instead of being vented outside)?

That does not sound very safe. You may want to get that looked at by a pro.
 
Kenny said:
Errr, do I understand correctly that combustion chamber air is escaping into your home (instead of being vented outside)?

That does not sound very safe. You may want to get that looked at by a pro.

No, it would actually be pre-combustion air. The fan draws air from beneath the stove and pressurizes the entire stove housing beneath the hopper and burn pot. Some of this air is pushed out into the room through the heat exchanger tubes and some of it enters the combustion chamber via holes in a baffle under the burn pot.

Combustion gases are pushed out the vent pipe by the same air pressure. It's a pretty big fan (5"-6" diameter). It's definitely not the most modern design, but the price was right and it is EPA-certified.

The "leak" I spoke of was due to a loose side panel that was venting air pressure before it reached the burn chamber.
 
wilbilt said:
I guess sometimes, you just need to kick it. :)

Hmmm.......mines a 91' so it couldn't hurt......now where did I put those steel toe boots? lol

Glad you found a fix!

Peg
 
pegdot said:
Hmmm.......mines a 91' so it couldn't hurt......now where did I put those steel toe boots? lol

Glad you found a fix!

Peg

Is yours a Trailblazer? I would really like to find a manual and/or schematic for this thing.
 
Sorry, for the confusion. No, I have an old Breckwell that I'm trying to figure out. I have the manual but since I have NO experience with pellet stoves it's not a lot of help. I don't know what "normal" is! lol

Peg
 
pegdot said:
I don't know what "normal" is! lol

Welcome to my world...;)
 
Most of the time problems with a pellet stove is just Neglect and need a good cleaning.

I would start with taking the stove apart and cleaning every nook and cranny.
Take the blower(s) out and clean
Clean any ash traps you might find.

A easy way to do this is to take it out side and take it apart and blast it with a Leaf blower or air compressor.

then after you get it back together make sure all seals are good on the door and ash pan if any.
make sure your seal on the combustion blower is good too.

Clean out all the pipe and any bends in the pipe
Make sure the cap is clear.

Connect the stove and test it out.

If you
 
hearthtools said:
Most of the time problems with a pellet stove is just Neglect and need a good cleaning.

I would start with taking the stove apart and cleaning every nook and cranny.
Take the blower(s) out and clean
Clean any ash traps you might find.

A easy way to do this is to take it out side and take it apart and blast it with a Leaf blower or air compressor.

then after you get it back together make sure all seals are good on the door and ash pan if any.
make sure your seal on the combustion blower is good too.

Clean out all the pipe and any bends in the pipe
Make sure the cap is clear.

Connect the stove and test it out.

I'll pull it out and disassemble it in the spring. It doesn't have an ash pan or drawer, and I do vacuum everything accessible once a week or so. It's a primitive design compared to current models.

Somewhere out there, are some guys who worked on these things.
 
wilbilt said:
Kenny said:
Errr, do I understand correctly that combustion chamber air is escaping into your home (instead of being vented outside)?

That does not sound very safe. You may want to get that looked at by a pro.

No, it would actually be pre-combustion air. The fan draws air from beneath the stove and pressurizes the entire stove housing beneath the hopper and burn pot. Some of this air is pushed out into the room through the heat exchanger tubes and some of it enters the combustion chamber via holes in a baffle under the burn pot.

Combustion gases are pushed out the vent pipe by the same air pressure. It's a pretty big fan (5"-6" diameter). It's definitely not the most modern design, but the price was right and it is EPA-certified.

The "leak" I spoke of was due to a loose side panel that was venting air pressure before it reached the burn chamber.




Oh, OK, I think I get it now.

Well, its good that you have it under control.

Cheers

Kenny
 
If you vacuum every accessable spot & the stove is running ok, then, the take it outside and use a leaf blower thing is excessive work for little or no reward. Dumb & dumber.

Good vacuuming should be more than enough, unelse you miss a important spot you dont know about.

How easy is it to move a 400 lb pellet stove down a flight of stairs????

real tough for two guys ,impossible for 1 guy.

Before I do that, if I REALLY had to, as a last resort,first i,d vac up everyting I could find inside the stove, then i'd leaf blow it in the living room and vac up the room afterwards.

of course, i got hardwood floors,no carpets. It would ruin a carpet, forever.

Hardest way to repair stove. It work , but really hard to do.
Need take a shower & wash cloths afterwards, not to mention a lung full of soot.
Wear dirty old clothes & a resperator.

Good luck breathing afterwards. Just a little soot dust make me cough and leave the room, hacking.
 
eernest4 said:
If you vacuum every accessable spot & the stove is running ok, then, the take it outside and use a leaf blower thing is excessive work for little or no reward. Dumb & dumber.

Good vacuuming should be more than enough, unelse you miss a important spot you dont know about.

How easy is it to move a 400 lb pellet stove down a flight of stairs????

real tough for two guys ,impossible for 1 guy.

Before I do that, if I REALLY had to, as a last resort,first i,d vac up everyting I could find inside the stove, then i'd leaf blow it in the living room and vac up the room afterwards.

of course, i got hardwood floors,no carpets. It would ruin a carpet, forever.

Hardest way to repair stove. It work , but really hard to do.
Need take a shower & wash cloths afterwards, not to mention a lung full of soot.
Wear dirty old clothes & a resperator.

Good luck breathing afterwards. Just a little soot dust make me cough and leave the room, hacking.

OK smartie

If you dont have anything constructive to say to help this guy out dont say it at all.


I volunteer my time here to help people.

How many pellet stoves are 400 pounds?
I said the easies way to clean.

Our service guys take out all the blowers from the stove and take them out to our service truck and blast out the blowers with air with an air compressor.
You can not clean dust bunnies out of the blower motor and blower wheel with a vacuum.
 
wilbilt said:
pegdot said:
Hmmm.......mines a 91' so it couldn't hurt......now where did I put those steel toe boots? lol

Glad you found a fix!

Peg

Is yours a Trailblazer? I would really like to find a manual and/or schematic for this thing.


I have the same stove as you do, Trailblazer 1600 classic. I want to thank you for your finding of the trim pots, that was quite usefull. Also I will mention that my eploration of the unit found that the inlet screen to the blower was half clogged, somewhat like the inlet of a blow drier can get after a while. After cleaning that screen and wiping the fan blades, I found the unit seems to function much better, even on high speed. I have not found a manual yet, but if I do I will let you all know.

I also found that next to where the power cord enters the unit, there are two binding posts, one black, and one red. I tested them and found 13.1 volts dc. I wonder what the purpose of that power supply is?
 
Dude!

That 13 volt connection might be to attach a 12 volt marine battery for a battery backup feature! If you find a manual, check for the battery backup in the documentation.
 
bit_flores said:
Dude!

That 13 volt connection might be to attach a 12 volt marine battery for a battery backup feature! If you find a manual, check for the battery backup in the documentation.

That's exactly what it is. I ran mine on car batteries during a recent 55-hour power outage.

The fan runs more slowly when on battery, so the stove takes more watching to make sure the pot doesn't overflow. That's OK, as there isn't much more to do in the dark other thna watch the fire!

On the bright side, battery life was excellent. I ran one battery for nearly 24 hours before swapping it out...and it still started my truck!
 
As I read the first post I was thinking it sounded like an air leak. Guess it was...

Also FYI your stove functions in the opposite way as many of the modern ones. You have a POSI pressure firebox so it should be sealed up tight so there are zero air leaks. Most of the current stoves out there are NEG pressure firebox and POSI pressure venting, with the combustion fan between the firebox and the vent.
 
All I can say is wow! After adjusting the trim pots and cleaning the air intake, this unit is working as new. I am simply amazed at the difference in funtion. Even on high, which I was only able to run for short times before, it is doing fantastic.
 
SOSDD said:
All I can say is wow! After adjusting the trim pots and cleaning the air intake, this unit is working as new. I am simply amazed at the difference in funtion. Even on high, which I was only able to run for short times before, it is doing fantastic.

Good to hear.
I did vacuum out my intake screen a while back, but did not clean the fan.

I will make it a point to do so the next time I do a major cleaning.

Does your stove have an outside air kit?
 
jtp10181 said:
As I read the first post I was thinking it sounded like an air leak. Guess it was...

Also FYI your stove functions in the opposite way as many of the modern ones. You have a POSI pressure firebox so it should be sealed up tight so there are zero air leaks. Most of the current stoves out there are NEG pressure firebox and POSI pressure venting, with the combustion fan between the firebox and the vent.

Yes, the entire stove runs on positive pressure. I had a leaky door gasket and it was blowing sparks out into the room. Yikes.

I think I finally have my wife conditioned to close the door before she turns on the blower, LOL
 
From the last couple of posts, I believe you have a licensed ( or not ) clone of a Thelin 12VDC stove.
Jay Thelin developed a 12VDC pellet stove in the early 90s that uses a single fan for combustion and convection.

The Thelin will trickle charge a connected 12 V battery while it is plugged into AC.

On another topic, does anyone have any knowledge about an Earth Stove model MP 35/50 ?
I'm looking for any information regarding burn-back problems and solutions.

Thanks in advance.
 
pelheat said:
From the last couple of posts, I believe you have a licensed ( or not ) clone of a Thelin 12VDC stove.
Jay Thelin developed a 12VDC pellet stove in the early 90s that uses a single fan for combustion and convection.

The Thelin will trickle charge a connected 12 V battery while it is plugged into AC.

Looking at the description on the Thelin site, it seems like the technology is very similar. Everything from the banana plug binding posts, the low-medium-high setting, single fan and auger operation are very familiar. The very low power consumption while running on battery is something I have experienced as well.

The TrailBlazer stove looks nothing like the Thelin, which are very attractive IMO. The TrailBlazer is just a typical black box.

I also see that Thelin is located about 25 miles from here, while the Oregon company that manufactured the TrailBlazers seems to have vanished from the face of the earth. I wonder if there was any connection between the two.
 
SOSDD said:
All I can say is wow! After adjusting the trim pots and cleaning the air intake, this unit is working as new. I am simply amazed at the difference in funtion. Even on high, which I was only able to run for short times before, it is doing fantastic.

Sorry to dredge this thing back up, but it's probably good to keep it all in the same thread.

I had a revelation of sorts today while cleaning my stove. It had been burning worse since I bought a different brand of pellets a couple of weeks ago. They are Lignetics I bought at TSC, and they were stored outside (a bit damp).

At any rate, the combustion had really gotten bad the past couple of days so I decided to give it a good cleaning and clean off the fan blades as SOSDD suggested.

I got that done (removed the control panel to gain access to the top of the fan) and proceeded to start cleaning the firebox. I vacuumed out the burn pot and the bottom of the box as normal, and started scraping the heat exchanger tubes. There is a thickwalled 1/2" tube about 2" long that sticks down from the center of the top of the firebox. I had always assumed it housed a temperature sensor, as it has sort of a ceramic appearance.

As I was scraping, I bumped the tube, and it moved a little. Curious, I pushed on it again an noticed a stream of ash fell down from the upper rear of the firebox. I grabbed a flashlight and looked around up there. The tube is attached to a U-channel that wraps around the center heat-exchanger tube and is welded to the plate behind them.

It is a handle for rattling the upper baffle to clear the ash from up there.

After dumping and vacuuming out a huge volume of ash from up there, the stove is burning wonderfully.

I feel like an idiot, but I am smiling right now.
;)
 
wilbilt said:
SOSDD said:
All I can say is wow! After adjusting the trim pots and cleaning the air intake, this unit is working as new. I am simply amazed at the difference in funtion. Even on high, which I was only able to run for short times before, it is doing fantastic.

Sorry to dredge this thing back up, but it's probably good to keep it all in the same thread.

I had a revelation of sorts today while cleaning my stove. It had been burning worse since I bought a different brand of pellets a couple of weeks ago. They are Lignetics I bought at TSC, and they were stored outside (a bit damp).

At any rate, the combustion had really gotten bad the past couple of days so I decided to give it a good cleaning and clean off the fan blades as SOSDD suggested.

I got that done (removed the control panel to gain access to the top of the fan) and proceeded to start cleaning the firebox. I vacuumed out the burn pot and the bottom of the box as normal, and started scraping the heat exchanger tubes. There is a thickwalled 1/2" tube about 2" long that sticks down from the center of the top of the firebox. I had always assumed it housed a temperature sensor, as it has sort of a ceramic appearance.

As I was scraping, I bumped the tube, and it moved a little. Curious, I pushed on it again an noticed a stream of ash fell down from the upper rear of the firebox. I grabbed a flashlight and looked around up there. The tube is attached to a U-channel that wraps around the center heat-exchanger tube and is welded to the plate behind them.

It is a handle for rattling the upper baffle to clear the ash from up there.

After dumping and vacuuming out a huge volume of ash from up there, the stove is burning wonderfully.

I feel like an idiot, but I am smiling right now.
;)


Hey! I appreciate you bringing this thread back up... and now I am WAY later lol. I just picked up one of these stoves a week ago. Runs like crap. Creosote build up is amazing. So I took the panel off of the control board side and saw all you did and thought it was pretty interesting. Doesn't seem to safe if your away from home and your blower fan fails. It would fill the room with smoke before the lack of oxygen put the fire out. Guess that is what carbon monoxide detectors are for. Anyways, I thought maybe the tube to rattle the asses from the flu may have been some sort of flu control.. but you can't make it stay in any position, so I guess your right about knocking ashes free from the flu. I am taking the door into work and media blast it clean and replace the rope seal on the door, then hopefully next weekend can fire it back up and see if the cleaning I did will help the situation. I have a feeling it will as when I was transporting the unit home, it fell over on it's face.. probably knocking a bunch of ash and creosote into the area of the flu that plugged it up. Any luck on a manual yet? Anybody?
 
chris1450 said:
Hey! I appreciate you bringing this thread back up... and now I am WAY later lol. I just picked up one of these stoves a week ago. Runs like crap. Creosote build up is amazing. So I took the panel off of the control board side and saw all you did and thought it was pretty interesting. Doesn't seem to safe if your away from home and your blower fan fails. It would fill the room with smoke before the lack of oxygen put the fire out. Guess that is what carbon monoxide detectors are for. Anyways, I thought maybe the tube to rattle the asses from the flu may have been some sort of flu control.. but you can't make it stay in any position, so I guess your right about knocking ashes free from the flu. I am taking the door into work and media blast it clean and replace the rope seal on the door, then hopefully next weekend can fire it back up and see if the cleaning I did will help the situation. I have a feeling it will as when I was transporting the unit home, it fell over on it's face.. probably knocking a bunch of ash and creosote into the area of the flu that plugged it up. Any luck on a manual yet? Anybody?

It's good to know there are still some of these around. I still haven't found a manual or a source for parts.

Let us know how it turns out.
 
Dow N. Jones said:
curious as to how its vented
i have little trblzer woodstove EPA!...from yardsale & its great for burning sawdust + WVO + modifications

Currently it's vented two feet straight out with a hood. Plans are to go out a foot and up 4-5 feet when the economy recovers.
 
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