SMOKE ISSUES....indoor wood/coal boiler vs. gassification boiler

[avarose]

My husband just installed a Harman wood/coal boiler in our basement and I HATE it!! Most of the time the wood is smoldering causing a lot of smoke. I smell it in the basement and when you walk out the door of my house, I feel like I am in a toxic wasteland from the smell of burning creosote. I am a very health concious person who has two very small children and I just can not live comfortably knowing what kind of toxins are being released into the air around us. We are considering reselling this unit and putting in a gassification one but wondering if it really would make a difference. Are they truely almost smokeless? Hubby seems to think that as long as the wood is smoldering even with the gassification unit, smoke and toxins will be released because the smoke is only being combusted when fire is burning at high temps. Is this true? Does smoke then pour out the chimney creating creostote at that point? I always thought wood smoke fully combusts when burned at high temps anyway so isn't that kinda of backwards if that's the case? Or does the smoke somehow sit in the lower chamber waiting to be combusted? Or....is there not much smoke because of the fact that only the bottom of the stack of wood is lit up and when desired temp is reached, only coals remain hot? (hubby feels that is not even possible) Can you load it fully and only that bottom will ever light up? Trying to understand exactly what's involved with these gassification units .Please help if you can!

Debbie

 

[ikessky]

Burn hotter and use only seasoned wood and then see how much smoke is being put out. I run an indoor add on furnace and it does smoke when reloaded, but not to an annoying point. I think most all wood furnaces are going to smoke more than EPA stoves due to the lack of secondary burn or cat systems, but you can combat it by burning a little hotter and using dry wood.

 

[Tree farmer]

Some smoke is a reality of an inside boiler. But the only smoke you should be getting is when you open the loading door to put in more wood. I have a gasifier in my basement and ran into similar issues but these have been solved. There is a learning curve and maybe some simple fixes to eleviate the situation. One facility at work has a brand new Newmak wood/oil funace and they are still learning how to run this thing and yes they get smoke when loading. some things to heed and examine

only load the unit when it has burned down to coals
use dry wood
examine door seal to see if you have any leaks - maybe you can adjust hinge or gasket seal- the smell test around door seal tells you whether it is still leaking and this could be your creosote smell source
when starting up get a good hot fire going this may take 15 to 20 min
install an exhaust fan above loading door to evacuate smoke when you do get it

And yes I believe this is why outdoor wood boilers have become so popular because all this stays outside- but I like walking down into a warm basement to load my boiler not tread through snow
Gasifiers are the nuts and do burn all the smoke in the bottom chamber when heat is called for but ideally you need to set up with a water storage tank from 500 to 1000 gallons though I am running mine just fine without storage just consuming a little more wood.

Hope this helps.

 

[LeonMSPT]

I just went through this, and made the decision with my bankbook... the indoor add on wood/coal boiler was on the order of 4 grand less than the gasser. I've burned wood in it a few times, and the demand wasn't there to really work the thing, so it smoked up the town. Can't really let them smolder alot, or you're just going to make smoke and creosote.

I got a ton and a half of nut coal, free. I love it. Load it, and leave it alone. Hours and hours, no change in the boiler temp. Learning curve with burning coal, but I am getting it down now so I can load twice on mild days, and three to four times on really cold days.

New Yorker WC90, pipe in parallel with a 180k Burham fired at 130k, with the smaller nozzle. 3,500 sq ft apartment building with a 1000 sq ft basement that is being maintained at 70 degrees with the overheat zone on mild days. Also a 40 gallon indirect hot water heater on the system. Five adults living in the building, showers and laundry.

Thinking about buying some more coal, and burning that primarily in the wood/coal boiler. On really cold days, when I am around to feed it, I am fairly certain the wood will work fine when there is a demand to keep it running hot.

Leon

 

[avarose]

I thought about coal also but everything I am reading about coal is telling me it's more toxic to burn even though there is less smoke. If that's the case, then I won't even consider it. I am now wondering if a water storage tank is my best bet.

Debbie

 

[LeonMSPT]

Think of it as deferred solar energy... really.

I fail to see how it can be "more toxic" when it doesn't stink, doesn't make creosote, and there is no smoke. Pound for pound, my bet is it is no more or less toxic to anything or anybody than wood.

The issue is not whether or not we're going to have "impact". The question is what that impact will be.

I don't want to burn any more oil than absolutely necessary. Wood has the potential, at least when the weather is "mild" (winter in Maine, "mild" is 15 to 40 degrees) of nastying up the entire neighborhood and burning my house down. That is, unless I constantly check and clean the chimney whenever I notice an accumulation of creosote. Below 15 degrees wood is seeming to be okay from a smoke and creosote perspective.

I load the thing and leave it... twelve to sixteen hours between loading. No smoke, no smell, nothing but heat. "More toxic than wood."? I don't know...

Most of the negative press regarding coal burning is referenced to power plants. The processes they use there are much different, and hotter, than any residential coal boiler ever thought of getting. I have been unable to find anything regarding residential coal burning that indicates it's any more hazardous to the environment or anybody than burning wood, in anything including a gassifier.

 

[LeonMSPT]

Storage is one way... allows you to burn real hot two or three times a day. Money is an object here. I don't have anymore.

 

[Hydronics]

Leon,
You get 12 to 16 hrs between loadings! What's the firebox dimensions/ volume. How many sq. ft. is your house? I burned a little nut coal in my Buderus but not enough to really evaluate.
My boiler is rated 125 btu/hr w/ wood & 140 w/ coal. Coal produces more energy per volume.

 

[LeonMSPT]

Manual says about 40 pounds of coal to a load, "to the bottom of the loading door"... of course, it's all subjective. Maybe with the mound, I've got fifty pounds in it. Contractor and I agreed no barometric damper when I put it in... going to install it anyway. I know the chimney is pulling harder than the .04 called for by New Yorker.

House is 3,500 sq ft, plus 1000 sq ft basement currently heated to about 70 degrees with the overheat zone... weather unusually mild here last few days... teens to twenties at night and thirties during the day.

I got to say, "I like the coal."

Toxicity is a concern, and I've done my level best to find where it's any worse than wood for heating a house. I can't. Burning things, if one believes in the CO2 as a pollutant, and the Global Climate Change business, is bad.

So? Do we freeze to death in the dark? Do we go broke trying to avoid adding to global warming? Electric heat? They're making the power with coal burned at much higher temperatures and generating more pollutants than that little coal boiler could ever consider, even my portion of it.

 

[LeonMSPT]

I am betting with a barometric damper controlling the draft pulling through the fire, and some pea coal mixed in, on a mild day and night I will be able to squeeze the better part of 24 hours out of it.