Question About Harman Manual Igniter Position

[F4jock]

I had a post few weeks ago about the same deal..
switching to manual and having the dist blower shut off [immediately] thus sending lot of heat up the exhaust pipe.
[yes I know how it works.. room/manual works off of the ESP probe in the flueway] and Not the room temp probe.
since the dist blower has not come back on since I switched to manual 25 minutes ago,
I don't think running in Stove[ or constant] temp is going to be any better since that mode runs off of the ESP probe also.
soooo, have been sending heat up the exhaust for almost 30 minutes while the pellets are in maint mode or simmer as I like to call it.
I seriously don't think there is anything wrong with my Harman P61A. I think it is working as it is supposed to..
Note: I just raised my set temperature from 70 to 75 on the room temp dial.
the distribution blower clicked on so my ESP probe is fine..

Ah ha! So it would seem that if the stove is in a maintenance burn the blower is not active. This really doesn't bode well for the way we run which is at about 69 to 70 °f max. Think I'm gonna stick with Room Temp Auto.

 

[F4jock]

You don't want to know what our summertime electric bills are: central air and we maintain the same 70f that we do in the winter.

 

[Cory S]

You don't want to know what our summertime electric bills are: central air and we maintain the same 70f that we do in the winter.

We keep our Central AC at 72*. 2 refrigerators, 1 chest freezer, and three occupants. $89-102.00/month. Last two months without the AC, $77.00 and $64.00 for October. We also have the 3rd highest KWH cost in the U.S.

 

[Tonyray]

Ah ha! So it would seem that if the stove is in a maintenance burn the blower is not active. This really doesn't bode well for the way we run which is at about 69 to 70 °f max. Think I'm gonna stick with Room Temp Auto.

well, not exactly...
what I have found out is in room/manual, I need to set my temperature at least 5 degrees higher than in room/auto.
my reply to you was approx 25-30 minutes ago and the dist blower is still running since I raised the temp from 70 to 75...
bottom line I assume is that the ESP Probe[ in the exhaust] doesn't match the temp selected when in room/auto and needs to be set a bit higher.
as I said earlier, as soon as I raised the temp from 70 to 75 [in room/manaul] the blower came right on and is still blowing and feeding pellets to bring the room temp up.

 

[Golfeur]

My idea why the fan faster distribution stops in the temperature chamber in manual is that the screw continuous power operated on a low fire and the temperature in the room would go far beyond the setpoint when in automatic fan continuous distribution work longer because the feed screw stops and the remaining pellet remains a burn will not do much to exceed the temperature setpoint.

 

[F4jock]

Well from what I can glean there MAY be two advantages to Room / Manual: longer igniter life and less pellet use. Problem is I don't know that anyone has quantified those onservations. It'd have to be done under tightly controlled conditions for the data to be meaningful and outside of a fairly sophisticated test facility I don't see it happening, thus it's pretty much personal preference / subjective I guess.

 

[Tonyray]

Well from what I can glean there MAY be two advantages to Room / Manual: longer igniter life and less pellet use. Problem is I don't know that anyone has quantified those onservations. It'd have to be done under tightly controlled conditions for the data to be meaningful and outside of a fairly sophisticated test facility I don't see it happening, thus it's pretty much personal preference / subjective I guess.

longer Igniter life is a no brainer since it is not re-flaming the pellets over and over .
they are easy to replace and can bought on ebay for around 70.00 and identical Harman specks right down to length of wire..[not saying you should run in Manual JUST to save Igniter. many here have same one for many years..
as far as pellet consumption, I would Assume that with the stove shutting down sometimes for possibly an hour at a time. room/auto would use less pellets even though it needs to do an initial feed.. but as you said, no one seems to have the scientific answer'... just have to try both modes on equally temp days and get a general eyeball of pellets used..
btw:
in room/manual, blowers is coming back on approx every 20 minutes or so...
I have a poor insulated old house so it is deff picking up on heat loss.
think I will give manual a try for a while at least after dark.
daytime sun comes out and we get sun thru the windows so room/auto during the daylight hours...
hope this has helped a bit..

 

[Golfeur]

I tried it in automatic room temperature and when the feed screw stops the fan to run continuously 20 minutes it stops when the fire is almost extinguished. It remains stopped 4 minutes and the stove comes back on automatically.
If I put it in the manual for the same temperature the fan stops 27 minutes
So my heat goes out the chimney, as in manual feed rate operated in continuous feed

 

[Tonyray]

I tried it in automatic room temperature and when the feed screw stops the fan to run continuously 20 minutes it stops when the fire is almost extinguished. It remains stopped 4 minutes and the stove comes back on automatically.
If I put it in the manual for the same temperature the fan stops 27 minutes
So my heat goes out the chimney, as in manual screw operated in continuous feed

sorry but your loosing me talking about the screw..
what screw do u mean?

 

[Golfeur]

Translation is excused
pellet feed

 

[Tonyray]

Translation is excused
pellet feed

well, tonite I have been running it in room/manual but I set my temperature dial to 75 instead of 70 which I put it on in room/auto.
the fan doesn't seem to shut off as long now... maybe around 10 minutes before coming back on.
the savings here is on pellets since the stove does not need to re-fill the pot from zero and re-ignite all over again as it does in room/auto.

 

[Golfeur]

You're right my p68 turns back on when the stove is running feed 3 1/2 minutes and the igniter is still 4 minutes

 

[Golfeur]

Tonight I make the same experiment with the same conditions except manual
In automatic I did 28 hours with 1 bag

 

[bogieb]

I had a post few weeks ago about the same deal..
switching to manual and having the dist blower shut off [immediately] thus sending lot of heat up the exhaust pipe.
[yes I know how it works.. room/manual works off of the ESP probe in the flueway] and Not the room temp probe.
since the dist blower has not come back on since I switched to manual 25 minutes ago,
I don't think running in Stove[ or constant] temp is going to be any better since that mode runs off of the ESP probe also.
soooo, have been sending heat up the exhaust for almost 30 minutes while the pellets are in maint mode or simmer as I like to call it.
I seriously don't think there is anything wrong with my Harman P61A. I think it is working as it is supposed to..
Note: I just raised my set temperature from 70 to 75 on the room temp dial.
the distribution blower clicked on so my ESP probe is fine..

Tony - have you tried setting it in stove/auto? The book doesn't say anything about that mode, but the fan will stay on the entire time (at least if you have it on mid or high - not sure about low). May not work as you wish, but may be worth investigating.

 

[Tonyray]

Tony - have you tried setting it in stove/auto? The book doesn't say anything about that mode, but the fan will stay on the entire time (at least if you have it on mid or high - not sure about low). May not work as you wish, but may be worth investigating.

Going into 3rd pellet season and never tried Stove temp..
Well, actually I prob did when I 1st got it but not for any period of time & wasn't expirienced enough yet with settings to compare back then.
I will try stove after a week here on Manual so it's embeded in my " tinkering around mode"..
I am for sure a room/auto during the shoulder times when Sun comes out full blast late mornings/early afternoons.. we get tons of sun blasting thru our " house of windows" here.

 

[bogieb]

Going into 3rd pellet season and never tried Stove temp..
Well, actually I prob did when I 1st got it but not for any period of time & wasn't expirienced enough yet with settings to compare back then.
I will try stove after a week here on Manual so it's embeded in my " tinkering around mode"..
I am for sure a room/auto during the shoulder times when Sun comes out full blast late mornings/early afternoons.. we get tons of sun blasting thru our " house of windows" here.

Room / auto for me too so far this season (except a couple nights where for whatever reason I tried something else). It's hard to play around with different settings when they will heat you out of the house at this time of year

 

[F4jock]

Interesting observations from everyone. What I don't like about Stove Mode and Room Manual Mode is that when I reach my desired room temperature the stove banks down but never shuts off and tends to overheat the room.

As for saving pellets because the pot doesn't have to be refilled, I don't know about that because when you are banked down you're constantly using pellets where if the stove was off you wouldn't be using any. I kind of think that over time it evens out. Perhaps the wife and I like Room Auto better because we don't keep the house that warm, we both like it between 68 and 70. Of course this cost us money in the summer when we turn on the AC.

 

[Tonyray]

Interesting observations from everyone. What I don't like about Stove Mode and Room Manual Mode is that when I reach my desired room temperature the stove banks down but never shuts off and tends to overheat the room.

As for saving pellets because the pot doesn't have to be refilled, I don't know about that because when you are banked down you're constantly using pellets where if the stove was off you wouldn't be using any. I kind of think that over time it evens out. Perhaps the wife and I like Room Auto better because we don't keep the house that warm, we both like it between 68 and 70. Of course this cost us money in the summer when we turn on the AC.

I agree about pellet consumption.. can't feed pellets when the stove is off for hour or hours.. .. much more pellet savings on Auto during shoulder season then it prob evens out as both modes are On all the time in bitter cold.

 

[bags]

I have had my P68 set in Room Temp with the igniter on manual for a bit now just idling along. My blower runs constantly because I have the Temperature Dial set at 5 just above the 75 degrees mark. My feed rate is at just less than 1 in between the 1 and the red hash mark. My house stat is currently reading 76 and it is about 12 feet away from the stove to the left of it.

The wife likes it warm as I have repeatedly stated here. I am in shorts, a T shirt and Crocs and too warm.

I think you have to set your temp dial to 4.5 to 5 in order for the distribution fan to constantly blow while running in this mode. This has been my experience anyway. anything less and the blower goes off and on or stays off. Running as I mentioned above I am using far less pellets than running any other mode. Cory and I are pretty much so running the same settings or close.

I do not mess with stove temp mode. I really have no use for it here. Maybe if another ice age sets in I might go that route with stove temp. Until then bring on the global warming because cold weather sucks IMHO.

 

[Tonyray]

I have had my P68 set in Room Temp with the igniter on manual for a bit now just idling along. My blower runs constantly because I have the Temperature Dial set at 5 just above the 75 degrees mark. My feed rate is at just less than 1 in between the 1 and the red hash mark. My house stat is currently reading 76 and it is about 12 feet away from the stove to the left of it.

The wife likes it warm as I have repeatedly stated here. I am in shorts, a T shirt and Crocs and too warm.

I think you have to set your temp dial to 4.5 to 5 in order for the distribution fan to constantly blow while running in this mode. This has been my experience anyway. anything less and the blower goes off and on or stays off. Running as I mentioned above I am using far less pellets than running any other mode. Cory and I are pretty much so running the same settings or close.

I do not mess with stove temp mode. I really have no use for it here. Maybe if another ice age sets in I might go that route with stove temp. Until then bring on the global warming because cold weather sucks IMHO.

wow.. feed rate at #1? I can see why the blower doesn't shut off..hard to fathom the temps you get with a feed rate that low..

 

[Golfeur]

When my test going to be finished in relation to test I did before (see my earlier post) I will give my comments. Currently I'm frying temperature automatic feed rate and temperature are the same settings

 

[Cory S]

wow.. feed rate at #1? I can see why the blower doesn't shut off..hard to fathom the temps you get with a feed rate that low..

My feed rate stays between 1-1.5 also. Stove temp mode. I keep the P61A as low as it will go most of the time. Turning up the feed burns significantly more pellets and raises the temperature. It doesn't matter where the temp/# dial is set, feed rate is changing the amount of auger time on mine.

 

[bags]

Cory, If you want the distribution blower to run while in room temp manual igniter then it does matter where the temp dial is set. Stove mode is different.

Tony, I run this way when the outside temps are not cold, cold. When the outside temps drop the feed rate goes up to 3.5 to 4. When the P68 is on that setting it is a heat throwing beast. I really bought it to reduce my wood usage in the Woodmaster OWB during the shoulder season thinking it would not keep up with heating my home in the cold. I was wrong and pleasantly surprised. It will heat the entire core of my house or the 2,350 SQ FT on two floors we mainly use. The PC45 is in another area of the house. My total square footage is right above 4,000 SQ FT.

This place is too damn big but works well now with the kids. When my wife retires in 7-8 years and the youngest is graduated etc; this place is going to be SOLD! I already have plans to build a new super efficient smaller place on my land here. I will divide some acres up and sell the house with 5 or so acres and keep the rest to build my new place. And my azz is outta here in the winter or at least part of it like after the holidays thru March.

Keep in mind I am a design build contractor so I can get a lot for much less building my own stuff like I have with this place. Bought the land and existing beat up house for $110K in 2003. They were asking $199K back then but lived in the UP in Michigan so they wanted it sold. This place with just 5 acres would bring every bit of $450 to $500K now. So there is my fund for the new place and some cash in the bank afterwards.

 

[Golfeur]

My test is finished I made 1/2 hour less and stove Temp Auto mode with 1 bag of pellets I made 27 1/2 hours compared Temp mode in room settings the same temperature and the same conditions outside temperature

 

[F4jock]

I see what you're doing, I think. Compensating for "always feeding" by setting the feed rate low speed as to top-limit the max pellets you can use?

I agree about the "5 or greater" temp setting to get the fan functional in "Manual /Room. Stumbled on that one.