Draft problem.. I think!

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retiredff

Member
Jan 20, 2008
89
60 miles SE of Indy
We bought a Regency F2400 w/fan a few years ago and have been happy with the stove considering our home is a 2 story 2400 sq' farmhouse. I am gradually getting the house tighter to stop the cold air infiltration. Our problem is when the outside temp reaches 35 deg. or so the stove will not draft properly. I can't get the flue temp above 400. My installer says he has never seen anything like this. I think the cap is NOT above the peaks far enough.

My current setup is:

Regency F2400
double wall pipe all the way from stove to 90, then into old INTERIOR flue to a "T"
flue was relined w/SS and insulated approx. 22'
the roof has a STEEP pitch, maybe 45 deg. angle.
the cap may NOT be above the peaks (probably level) - chimney is between east and north peaks.
the south side of house has 6 old/tall hard maples much higher than the house

Does anything sound amiss besides the cap not being above the peaks enough?

I have a probe type thermometer because of the double wall pipe. When cold out, I run the flue temp between 800-1000 deg. I called Regency and asked if this was to hot, they told me they have never over fired one of their stoves using wood and my installer said he and his son run up to 1200 deg. and have never had problems. We decided to add 2' to the cap so we were sure the flue was above the peaks. Does this sound like we are headed in the right direction?

BTW, the wood is a hardwood mix, 2 years old and a moisture content from 16-20%

Thanks

Tony
 
Tony, that extra 2' should definitely help but I'm not sure just how much. Our chimney is on the south side and is not as tall as the peak. We are also surrounded by some tall oaks on one side and a mixture of maple, oak and pine on the other sides. In addition to that, our chimney is very short; too short according to all theories. Yet, we have no problems with it.

I wonder if you are simply trying to get the flue temperature too hot? The only reason I see for anyone to run that hot is because they do not have good fuel. You have a hardwood mix (which rather loosely describes it) and it is 2 years old. What does 2 years old mean? Has it been cut, split and stacked in the open air for 2 years? If so, then it should be good except maybe for oaks. If it has not been split and stacked in open air (wind should hit the sides of the stacks) then it will take longer to dry. Wood also should be stacked so it does not touch the ground. You want air circulation under the wood too in order to take care of ground moisture. It also depends upon how many rows you stack together. If you want the wood to dry the fastest, then stack in single rows. Our wood we stack in triple rows but we have lots of time. I've stacked probably up to 20 rows together at times but that wood also had many years to sit and dry.

Good luck.
 
Thanks for the reply,

The wood has been split/stacked in sun w/good air (it's windy here, we are rural). My moisture meter shows 16-20%. The "mix" is walnut, ash, hard maple, elm. When the outside temp gets over 35 deg., I have to keep the door slightly cracked to get the flue temp to 400.
It's like the fire is being choked with lazy flames. The wood didn't matter but I would assume the elm would burn quickly, it didn't.

This stove is really insulated, the cats sleep under it and I'm within 12" from the back wall, that's the reason for the double walled pipe from the stove out, and also for the high heat. I have wondered before when there is just a bed of coals and the flue temp is 3-400 it feels like a blast furnace when I open the door to reload. I also assume ALOT of heat is going up the flue, however I do know that the heat output is alot more with the fan. A Regency tech said maybe the 90 and the "T" was the bottleneck and a straight flue would be better. I agree but that is impossible in this house. My installer is bringing the pipe monday or so and I will explain exactly how I burn, the temps etc. and ask him to be sure the pipe is installed and sealed correctly. I would burn it then asap for a test but next weeks temps will be in the mid 60's. I also think because the windows suck as at times the drapes move some when real windy probably hurts alot. For this winter I have taken steps to seal the house, install plastic window covers etc. I'll post what my installer suggests and pic if I can.

Maybe the stove is over insulated?
 
Another thing you can do for an experiment is to go to the hardware store and just buy some single wall pipe. Go up top and add a 3' section or even 2 sections and see if it makes a difference.

Good luck.
 
Your chimney should be three feet above the highest point that it exits your roof, and at leat 2 feet above any part of the roof that is within 10 feet of it.

I'd start with that and see what happens.
 
Pyro,
It's not above the highest peak within 10'. I'm not sure it is even with the peak. My installer is bringing a 2' section, I'll repost when it's installed and the weather is cold enough to burn.
 
Tony, You said that you have tightened up the house to eliminate air leakage. Stoves require a certain amount of combustion air. If the house is too air-tight then you should consider an outside air system. To check whether if this may be an issue, try running the stove with a nearby window/door cracked open. If this improves the stove's performance, increasing heat output, then the tightness of the house is an issue.
 
Also check your horizontal run of stove pipe, it should rise at least 1/4" for every foot of horizontal run into your chimney.
 
Green - I am sure hat is not the problem in this 1905 farmhouse. It has been insulated, and the windows are shot.

Todd - I will have my installer check that.

Thanks for the help, I will repost when the weather permits me to burn and my installer has added the pipe.
 
As Dennis mentioned if you have a probe thermometer and are running close to 1000 degrees F you're really running a bit too hot . . . to be honest when I get the flue temp above 800 or so degrees I start to get a bit concerned . . . at 1000 degrees F I am in full alarm, sitting on the couch until midnight mode.

I am a bit confused (understandable since I am a firefighter ;)) . . . the problem with the flue temp is that when the outside temp is above 35 degrees F or so since you can't get it up any more . . . or the problem is that you can get the flue temp up quite high, but when you start to close down the air control that the flue temp dips down to lower than optimal numbers?
 
Jake,

I'm retired fire.

When the temp gets near or above 35 I have to burn smaller pieces of wood and at times crack the door to get the flue temp at 400. My installer installed a 2' double walled extension today. When it gets cold enough I will test it out.

My installer and his son run their flue temps hotter than I do. That is the reason I run it up that high. When the temps get cold teens to 0 at nights, the stove put out plenty of heat but because the windows leak (I can see/feel the air move depending on wind direction) the stove struggles to keep the lower part of the house at 70 deg.

I checked my wood today, the moisture content for the elm is 12%, walnut is 14-16%, ash is 15%, hackburry and oak is 20%.
 
retiredff said:
Jake,

I'm retired fire.

When the temp gets near or above 35 I have to burn smaller pieces of wood and at times crack the door to get the flue temp at 400. My installer installed a 2' double walled extension today. When it gets cold enough I will test it out.

My installer and his son run their flue temps hotter than I do. That is the reason I run it up that high. When the temps get cold teens to 0 at nights, the stove put out plenty of heat but because the windows leak (I can see/feel the air move depending on wind direction) the stove struggles to keep the lower part of the house at 70 deg.

I checked my wood today, the moisture content for the elm is 12%, walnut is 14-16%, ash is 15%, hackburry and oak is 20%.

I figured you were with the nake retiredff . . . I figured either that or you were a retired fig farmer. ;)

So I guess this means as a brother I have to cut you some slack . . . however, as a Colts fan no doubt I still must insist that I retain the right to insult your football team and Peyton Manning. ;)

I think you might be on to something . . . if your draft is marginal and the temps outside are on the milder side sometimes getting the wood up to temp can be a challenge. I find this to be more pronounced with smaller loads of wood . . . in these cases I sometimes have to open up the air more than I prefer so I can maintain a hot enough temp in the flue.

Wood sounds excellent.
 
yep, 27 years. Speedway Fire Dept. - City of Speedway, home of the Indy 500, Brickyard 400 and the GP something or other.

air damper wide open and at times the door cracked, flue temp maybe 400.

The Colts are screwed for this season, too many injuries.

I don't follow pro sports much any more. Over paid a$$holes with too many bad habits. Almost sounds like a few firefighters I know except for the $$$$$. However our pension is nice. It would be better if the medical was included. Social Security starts in may 2011. That means more fishing, hunting, beer drinking and whatever else I can think of the wife doesn't like!
 
retiredff said:
That means more fishing, hunting, beer drinking and whatever else I can think of the wife doesn't like!

I don't know you - but I like you. :coolsmile:
 
Jags said:
retiredff said:
That means more fishing, hunting, beer drinking and whatever else I can think of the wife doesn't like!

I don't know you - but I like you. :coolsmile:

amen
 
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