Another 'how much wood will I need?' question

[Jon1270]

I think I'm about to install an insert in my old, nonfunctional fireplace. I've never lived in a house with a woodstove, so I don't have much experience to base guesses on. Right now I'm planning a small, roofed wood rack on an old patio, and could use some insight as to how big it should be.

The house is in western PA, around 1400 sq. ft, brick with double-pane windows and moderately-well insulated. The stove probably something similar to an Osburn 2000 (2.1 cubic feet). I'm sure we'd enjoy somewhat frequent fires on chilly evenings, maybe loading it up to burn over night, but I don't expect it to be our primary heat source. If you had to guess (because you have to. I insist.) how much wood might we go through in an average winter?

We live in an old suburb full of mature trees, so opportunities to gather free wood are not uncommon. I'd like to do some of that, so I'll need extra space to store wood while it dries. How long does it typically take to dry freshly-cut hardwood? If I cut wood in the summer of 2012, for example, and stacked it under cover, would it be ready to burn during the winter of 2013-14, or might I have to wait longer?

 

[BrowningBAR]

Takes about a year, or more for wood to dry. Plan on 4 cord of wood a winter and cut 8 cord for the first two to three years so you are 3 years ahead.

 

[My Oslo heats my home]

I agree with BB, first year start with 2 years or more worth of wood to go through the drying process. Not sure you will have any luck this year unless you are able to purchase some dry wood to use. And another small note, oak seems to be one of those hardwoods that takes a bit longer to dry, at least 2 years on that but the rewards are amazing when you do get it dry. Good luck with your insert

 

[Jon1270]

Wow, 4 cords a winter? I don't have anything like that much space. Most of my yard is on a steep slope below the house, so not the most attractive place for a woodpile (carrying it up a steep hill in snow wouldn't be much fun).

I do realize I'd have to buy wood for this year. That's fine. I might even end up buying some wood every year.

How about this - how many times would you guess that a 2.1cf stove could be loaded from a single cord? I know I can look up the actual volume of a cord, but how tightly do you typically pack a stove for a long, slow burn?

 

[My Oslo heats my home]

over time wood burners 'feel out' how to burn their stoves in their home. Everybody burns a little differently. For example using myself, I pack the stove only at night for overnight burns. During the daytime I 3/4 load the stove on refills and depending on the conditions I run the air at about 1/2 to 3/4 to get a long even burn. But as I said, this is how it works for me and how I keep my home evenly warm through the day and into the overnight. I'm sure you will get 100 different answers for this question

 

[BrowningBAR]

Wow, 4 cords a winter? I don't have anything like that much space. Most of my yard is on a steep slope below the house, so not the most attractive place for a woodpile (carrying it up a steep hill in snow wouldn't be much fun).

I do realize I'd have to buy wood for this year. That's fine. I might even end up buying some wood every year.

How about this - how many times would you guess that a 2.1cf stove could be loaded from a single cord? I know I can look up the actual volume of a cord, but how tightly do you typically pack a stove for a long, slow burn?

There is 128 cu ft in a cord of wood. You will not be able to load 2.1 cu ft of wood in your stove per load.

And there is no such thing as a slow low burn on a non-cat stove.

 

[hockeypuck]

I think 4 chord is a very safe estimate..If you do not have enough dry wood now.. supplement with eco bricks or another quality wood brick. I was a doubter, but after 2 seasons of mixing bricks with wood, I am a convert. When given the choice between non seasoned chord wood or "bio bricks" , "eco bricks" ect..pay the premium for the processed wood. Make sure you are not buying the box store processed crap with wax in it.

I have a 1900 sq ft ranch and my predecessor ran 1000 gallons of oil for hw and heat. She was a single elderly lady. I have 3 kids and a wife. We now average 450 gallons of oil ( 25 per month for dhw) and 2 to 3 chord of wood now. Better safe than sorry. Getting ready to install a pellet stove and electric htwh to give the oil guy the shove off.

 

[Jon1270]

I'm sure you will get 100 different answers for this question

Yeah, I realize there's no 'correct' answer to this. I'm mostly trying to get oriented, so a range of answers is fine.

When you load a stove, do you leave as much air space in-between sticks as there is in a typical woodpile, or is it looser? If a cord is 128 cf, and if 3/4 of a 2.1cf stove is about 1.6 cf, does that mean you'd get eighty 3/4 loads from a cord?

 

[BrowningBAR]

Yeah, I realize there's no 'correct' answer to this. I'm mostly trying to get oriented, so a range of answers is fine.

When you load a stove, do you leave as much air space in-between sticks as there is in a typical woodpile, or is it looser? If a cord is 128 cf, and if 3/4 of a 2.1cf stove is about 1.6 cf, does that mean you'd get eighty 3/4 loads from a cord?

You are asking for an exact number on an process that is different every time it takes place. Wood is not uniform. Thus each load is different.

 

[Jon1270]

I really appreciate all the thoughts. You're right, the way I'm framing this implies an impossible level of precision that I'm not really expecting. What I meant to ask was more along the lines of, is eighty 3/4 loads from a cord a plausible number or way off for some reason I don't yet understand? I know it's imprecise, but it would help me put the other advice I'm being given here into context.

I'm used to turning on the furnace sometime in late October, and switching it off around the end of March. If the 1.6cf per load is right then four cords would be enough for a couple loads per day throughout the heating season, which I think is unlikely for us.

 

[rdust]

If you're really only going to burn in the evenings and overnights a couple cords will probably do. With that said if you somehow manage to find good wood this time of year you may get hooked on wood heat like many of us. I started out with the plan to supplement, after I had my first fire going I had no intention of letting the furnace run. Plan for 4-5 a year for the first couple years until you know what you're going to need for sure.

Most wood will season pretty well in a full year, oak needs 2-3 to be at it's best. Stack in single rows with good sun/wind and you'll speed up the odds on the oak. Also split smaller if you only have a year to season, I'd say nothing bigger than 4 or 5 inches.

 

[begreen]

If you buy wood in October, it might be passable by January if stored covered and not buried in snow. But if you have to restock in January, good luck. Reputable wood sellers can be hard to find and dry wood even harder.

 

[fossil]

...Wood are not uniform...

And, Jon, until you learn to express yourself as elegantly as brother BrowningBAR here (and the rest of us goofballs), you just ain't gonna understand the complex mind-bending mathematically intricate and subtle calculations we all must struggle with during the warmer months to make sure we'll be here to do it all again next year.

My suggestion is, until you've mastered the math, build your wood shelter just as large as you have room for, and fill it with just as much wood as will fit. It won't go bad like milk in the refrigerator if you find in the Spring that you put up more wood than you used over the winter. Let it sit, it's money in the bank. You'll figger it all out, I'm sure.

We really oughta be talking about the appliance and the space to be heated (while you gather as much wood as you can). Rick

 

[rideau]

A full cord usually contains less than 100 cu feet of actual wood. If you really fill your stove you might get about 60 fires out of a cord.

 

[Grisu]

The way you describe your situation sounds quite a bit like ours. We are also only part-time burners although wood is taking a bigger share of our heating needs each winter. Thus, my guess would be more in the neighborhood of 2 to 3 cords per winter. If you are planning on buying some please be aware that you will rarely get seasoned wood. When you shop around ask when the wood was split and stacked. Anything under a year is not seasoned (except ash maybe). I would also be there during the delivery and split a few pieces and take a moisture reading from the fresh surface.

 

[BrowningBAR]

And, Jon, until you learn to express yourself as elegantly as brother BrowningBAR here (and the rest of us goofballs), you just ain't gonna understand the complex mind-bending mathematically intricate and subtle calculations we all must struggle with during the warmer months to make sure we'll be here to do it all again next year.

My suggestion is, until you've mastered the math, build your wood shelter just as large as you have room for, and fill it with just as much wood as will fit. It won't go bad like milk in the refrigerator if you find in the Spring that you put up more wood than you used over the winter. Let it sit, it's money in the bank. You'll figger it all out, I'm sure.

We really oughta be talking about the appliance and the space to be heated (while you gather as much wood as you can). Rick

I hate it when I'm quoted used hideous grammar.

"I fail English? That's unpossible!"

 

[Jon1270]

Okay, this is starting to gel for me.

Being on a hillside, we have a walk-out basement. The best space we have for wood storage is a concrete patio slab immediately outside the basement door. It's 12 feet deep and 37 feet wide, and about 2/3 of it is covered by a big deck that's high overhead, level with the first floor. The patio area is interrupted by deck columns, and there are some pathways that need to be kept open. I could fit three rows 12' long and 4' high without any trouble, so 2.25 cords, and I'd still have room for a hand-splitting area. More than that that and it might start to feel cramped unless I build something to support taller stacks. There's also room just inside the basement door for a little more. Unfortunately I don't see multiple years' worth of wood at 4 cords/year happening here.

 

[Jon1270]

We really oughta be talking about the appliance and the space to be heated (while you gather as much wood as you can). Rick

I'm looking at the Osburn Matrix, which uses the same box as the 2000, just a different front. The house is around 1450 square feet, not counting the basement, but it's a 2-story colonial; no central great room to facilitate house-wide convection. I might use the furnace fan to distribute heat, though.

 

[Shadow&Flame]

And, Jon, until you learn to express yourself as elegantly as brother BrowningBAR here (and the rest of us goofballs), you just ain't gonna understand the complex mind-bending mathematically intricate and subtle calculations we all must struggle with during the warmer months to make sure we'll be here to do it all again next year.

My suggestion is, until you've mastered the math, build your wood shelter just as large as you have room for, and fill it with just as much wood as will fit. It won't go bad like milk in the refrigerator if you find in the Spring that you put up more wood than you used over the winter. Let it sit, it's money in the bank. You'll figger it all out, I'm sure.

We really oughta be talking about the appliance and the space to be heated (while you gather as much wood as you can). Rick

Fossil has it right...you should be considering space and not what you will use. There is an upper limit, but most just try and get as much wood as they can and get ahead. You are also going to have to get enough for this season and the next so the latter will be ready for next year. Build as big a shed as you have room for and fill it up...you will know how much you need to have on hand down the road. For now you just need to get some wood and the sooner the better.

 

[Jon1270]

Okay, 'as much as possible, as soon as possible' makes good sense. I'm afraid that 'as much as possible' may still be less than I'll eventually want, but dem's da breaks.

Thanks, everyone.

As a followup, how well-sheltered does a woodpile need to be? I've seen a lot of pics of woodpiles that don't appear to have any sort of roof at all. How does that work? Is that wood later moved to a drier location before burning?

 

[BrowningBAR]

As a followup, how well-sheltered does a woodpile need to be? I've seen a lot of pics of woodpiles that don't appear to have any sort of roof at all. How does that work? Is that wood later moved to a drier location before burning?

Some cover, some don't. I don't cover until a rain/snow/ice storm hits during burning season. I only tarp off the area that will be used within the next few days. Other than that, my wood stacks are uncovered and exposed all year.

I would like to have a nice large shed as it makes things easier during said rain/snow/ice storms. But it isn't a show stopper. Just a temporary pain in the ass.

 

[fossil]

Ya know, since this thread turned out to be almost all about wood, I'm gonna move it over into the Wood Shed forum. Jon, with just a little use of the search function in the Wood Shed forum, you can find way more information than necessary . Have fun. If you want to talk about the insert/stove itself, or the home to be heated, then by all means, feel free to start a new thread about that in The Hearth Room. Rick

 

[Jon1270]

Sorry, didn't recognize the distinction between forum areas.

Thanks again, everyone.

 

[fossil]

Sorry, didn't recognize the distinction between forum areas.

Thanks again, everyone.

Nothin' at all to apologize for, Jon. Stick around, look around, get familiar with what all we have to offer here (it's a lot!). Have fun. We're all glad you joined us here, and are eager to help in any way we can. Rick

 

[Shadow&Flame]

Okay, 'as much as possible, as soon as possible' makes good sense. I'm afraid that 'as much as possible' may still be less than I'll eventually want, but dem's da breaks.

Thanks, everyone.

As a followup, how well-sheltered does a woodpile need to be? I've seen a lot of pics of woodpiles that don't appear to have any sort of roof at all. How does that work? Is that wood later moved to a drier location before burning?

There are many variables to wood burning and experience is the best teacher. Wood is not all the same...different burn times and drying times. I understand that you might not have the room required...but as you say 'dems da breaks'

Most leave it uncovered until its seasoned and then either top cover or put it in a shed/carport/basement... Most of the time there is a certain amout of wood that is placed inside or on a porch that will be burned immediately. This way its assured it will not be wet and at least you can get a fire going to dry any surface moisture off damp wood.

I hope this has been helpful and not more confusing....

Welcome to the forum and hope you will put up some pics of your stove when you get it.