Apple grinders for cider making?

[pybyr]

A friend has an antique cider press that's the focal point of a lot of grinding and pressing that usually nets 50+ gallons. The "press" part of the equipment works OK, but the grinder doesn't grind well and is exhausting to those who have crank.

The "electric garbage grinder" approach (with stainless blades and chamber) might be an option, although I've heard that large apples must be sliced first, which seems like it'd be slow and klutzy.

Anyone have any suggested designs. technologies, (or links) to help get me started? I've seen the designs with a cylinder of hardwood with stainless screws as shredding blades, but I am hoping for something quicker to make and quicker to use.

Thanks

 

[timfromohio]

I plan on building the "Whizbang Cider Press" based on plans/book by Herrick Kimball. It seems like a neat system and I think he is a top-notch guy. According to his plans/instructions, you do need to chop up the apples prior to putting them into the garbage disposal based grinder, but it looks like the mash coming out is much finer than out of a conventional grinder which in turn increases cider yields.

http://www.whizbangcider.com/

 

[pybyr]

Thanks Tim-- his approach does look like a valid one- although I'd be especially glad to find something that does not require chopping of the apples before grinding-- with the quantity of apples that everyone gathers and presses with my friend (all in one afternoon) chopping would become a huge task unto itself.

From what I understand, the main factor that causes the need for chopping for the disposal is the size of the opening-- anyone know if there are any disposal types that can be modified to have a top opening that is larger than a sink drain?

 

[TMonter]

I'll post a picture of the hand crank grinder on my press later today. It works very well and we usually get 20 gallons a year out of the press.

 

[Ncountry]

My father in-law built one of the crudest looking yet efficient cider mill I have seen. It is 90% built out of wood. with a metal plate for a large 1"threaded rod with a T handle and flat plate on bottom to squeeze the ground apples. Up top is a tapered chute with an 8" long x 4" diameter hardwood round (right out of the wood pile) with 100s of screws on a metal shaft run by small electric motor . The only thing I would change would be to power the long threaded rod or plunger with an electric motor with a simple belt tension clutch.

 

[Jags]

Many of the grinders actually had a v groove pulley built in for an electric motor and belt. If not, would it be possible to retrofit one and use an electric motor (something I always have 3 or 4 of laying around) to run the grinder??

 

[pybyr]

Many of the grinders actually had a v groove pulley built in for an electric motor and belt. If not, would it be possible to retrofit one and use an electric motor (something I always have 3 or 4 of laying around) to run the grinder??

Good suggestion-- but this grinder is so old that the only pulley drive is a big wide (non-V) pulley for a slow-RPM flat-belt (very wide) belt such as would've been used with the old 1-cylinder hit-n-miss engines-- and judging by the speed at which that pulley spins (it also serves as a flywheel to keep momentum while cranking), any modern electric motor would have to be geared down substantially-- and by the time the effort were put into that (as well as guards for any belts so that none of the cider-pressing attendees lose any fingers (or get clocked by the spinning 20" long crank handles handles that are rusted frozen on the gearings' shafts)(and the whole grinder is on the loose and tired side), it seems better to leave the old grinder "authentic" and create something on a more stand-alone basis.

 

[pybyr]

My father in-law built one of the crudest looking yet efficient cider mill I have seen. It is 90% built out of wood. with a metal plate for a large 1"threaded rod with a T handle and flat plate on bottom to squeeze the ground apples. Up top is a tapered chute with an 8" long x 4" diameter hardwood round (right out of the wood pile) with 100s of screws on a metal shaft run by small electric motor . The only thing I would change would be to power the long threaded rod or plunger with an electric motor with a simple belt tension clutch.

Thanks-- my friends' press/ grinder get used with/ by a lot of guests, including kids (which makes it a very fun seasonal event), who have no familiarity with the hazards of rotating machinery, so if I did something like that (and I've seen some interesting designs along those lines on the 'net), I'd need to do complete guards on all shafts and belts, which seems like it'd start to make this more elaborate than I'm hoping-- thus the appeal of a direct-drive mechanism such as the garbage grinder (or some way to make something similar, except with a bigger feed opening)

 

[pybyr]

I'll post a picture of the hand crank grinder on my press later today. It works very well and we usually get 20 gallons a year out of the press.

Thanks-- looking forward to the photo-

 

[firefighterjake]

Mmmmm . . . nothing better than cider in the Fall . . . as long as it isn't that pasteurized apple juice crap they label as cider . . . blah.

On second thought I take it back . . . there is something better than cider . . . hard cider.

 

[Gooserider]

Mmmmm . . . nothing better than cider in the Fall . . . as long as it isn't that pasteurized apple juice crap they label as cider . . . blah.

On second thought I take it back . . . there is something better than cider . . . hard cider.

You should try a good CYSER - apple cider based mead... I usually make at least one 5-7 gallon batch a year...

2-3 gallons apple cider, must NOT have sorbates in it, preferably not pasteurized, fresh from the orchard is best.
1 gallon or so of honey (preferably local, and minimally processed, not that overcooked grocery store crap!)
1 Tbl bee pollen
1 tsp propolis
1 tsp royal jelly
yeast nutrient
pectic enzyme
yeast - I have used champagne yeast, but that tends to make rocket fuel (18-20%+ ABV), Lalvin D-47 stops at a lower ABV level and is what I use now...
HOT water to make 5+ gallons

Mix all but yeast in primary fermenter, let cool to ~80F, pitch yeast, close fermenter w/ high flow capable fermentation lock. Keep fermenter at 60-70* temp.

When primary ferment ends / slows a lot (2-3 weeks) Rack to secondary add
more pectic enzyme
1-2 sticks cinnamon
1-2 whole nutmegs lightly crushed
10-15 whole cloves

Test SG and taste - if SG below 1.00 add more honey (unless you like really dry...)

Approx 1x month - 6 weeks, rack to fresh carboy - taste and test SG - if dryer than you like, add more honey. If not very clear, add more pectic enzyme, but only on 3rd racking

When taste is good, AND SG has been stable for at least one racking w/o adding honey, AND there is no visible sign of fermentation (usually 6-9 months for this brew) bottle and drink... (and it WILL get even better w/ more aging if you can stay out of it...)

As to the original question, I would think that it would be possible to make some sort of "pre-processor" chopper to feed the garbage grinder - also motorized, with one or two sets of coarse chopping blades and a chute that is long enough to discourage people from sticking their hands in, or some sort of safety lid interlock...

Another option might be some sort of variant on the old "vegematic" - a section of large diameter pvc pipe with a bunch of knife blades stuck through it at different angles... shove apples in the top, get chunks out the bottom... Maybe set it up with a pusher attached to a long lever? (Or for REAL over kill, repurpose your log splitter.... :bug: )

Gooserider

 

[m0jumb0]

this one doesn't seem too terribly complicated, at least if you have a decent wood shop:

http://www.sentex.net/~mwandel/press/apple_grinder.html