Blase King Ashford 3.0 enamel brown what should it cost?

[stovelark]

Seems there are a few opinions here Jotul's blue black enamel is a satin finish due to having 7 layers of paint baked into a porcelain finish, vice 9 layers for their glossier colors. I have had enameled stoves and painted ones, the painted ones gray out almost immediately but unless you see a new one, its not so noticeable. Many MFRs now use the satin black paint (Jotul switched to it a couple of years ago). Does anyone use metallic black anymore? I liked that finish too, seemed to hold up better than flat black... I like the majolica colors as well, but my favorite is still blue black enamel from Jotul. Keep warm all, we are still burning here in NE.

 

[webby3650]

Seems there are a few opinions here Jotul's blue black enamel is a satin finish due to having 7 layers of paint baked into a porcelain finish, vice 9 layers for their glossier colors. I have had enameled stoves and painted ones, the painted ones gray out almost immediately but unless you see a new one, its not so noticeable. Many MFRs now use the satin black paint (Jotul switched to it a couple of years ago). Does anyone use metallic black anymore? I liked that finish too, seemed to hold up better than flat black... I like the majolica colors as well, but my favorite is still blue black enamel from Jotul. Keep warm all, we are still burning here in NE.

Blaze king, Lopi/Travis/Avalon,FPX, SBI, and Regency use metallic paint. I agree that it looks better than flat. Blue black is also my favorite from a durability standpoint.

 

[Cast Iron]

For you anti VC folks, the "new and improved" ( I hope ) Flexburns offer "twilight" enamel which is like Jotul's blue/black.
The Encore Flexburn is ordered, reports to come. My ash is on the line.

 

[bholler]

For you anti VC folks, the "new and improved" ( I hope ) Flexburns offer "twilight" enamel which is like Jotul's blue/black.
The Encore Flexburn is ordered, reports to come. My ash is on the line.

To be clear most of us want to see vc do well. I personally am not anti vc. But i see these stoves used in the real world all the time and i see the problems with them. And untill they get even close to the durability of the other stuff on the maket i cannot and will not recomend them to anyone. No matter what finishes or features they offer because if you have to keep dumping money into them to keep them in working order to me the looks and features dont matter in the least.

 

[webby3650]

To be clear most of us want to see vc do well. I personally am not anti vc. But i see these stoves used in the real world all the time and i see the problems with them. And untill they get even close to the durability of the other stuff on the maket i cannot and will not recomend them to anyone. No matter what finishes or features they offer because if you have to keep dumping money into them to keep them in working order to me the looks and features dont matter in the least.

My feelings exactly.

 

[begreen]

Having owned an original VC stove I have a love of their design. They made a solid, good looking stove that heated our small home well and needed minimum maintenance. This was a 1979 Resolute. Fast forward to 1999 when I had to tell a close friend that had a gorgeous enameled Resolute Acclaim that she should get rid of the stove. This was her sole heat and the stove had already had 2 expensive replacements of the refractory package. Things did not get better for VC after that. I thought there was a glimmer of hope with the short-lived VC Madison, but that design didn't stick around. Now with a large parent company and improved internals there is hope that VC will regain their good name. We'll see.

 

[stovelark]

I too liked the Madison, I guess it was not a top loader and folks didn't give it a chance. The stove was made very well, I knew 3 people with them, they did very well, in fact I thought they might give the Oslo from Jotul some trouble. I think folks just didn't take to it. The Montpelier and Merrimack inserts with their sec tube burn system burn nicely too, albeit the blowers could be quieter, espec the Montpelier. I hope HHT saves them, but history hasn't exactly seen HHT as a savior for stove companies, its always HHT's needs first... we'll see. The name VC is still worth a lot by itself....

 

[Cast Iron]

You will have a full report in time. The Encore Flexburn is in the warehouse, delivery in a week.
My ash is on the line with this HHT/VC product.
Spring has not arrived here in VT--sleet, snow, freezing rain this weekend. Where are you AlGore ?

 

[bholler]

You will have a full report in time. The Encore Flexburn is in the warehouse, delivery in a week.
My ash is on the line with this HHT/VC product.
Spring has not arrived here in VT--sleet, snow, freezing rain this weekend. Where are you AlGore ?

I have enough full reports on enough flexburns to form my opinion of them. And that is like most others in the industry. They have improved over the older designs but are still plagued with durability issues. And i have a feeling the only way they will get away from that is to abandon the troubled down draft system

 

[stovelark]

A friend of mine worked at VC when the "neverburn" system came into being. The VC folks were vehement in their top load stoves, being that was what their name was built on. He suggested that perhaps a system where smoke needs to go down to burn would in the long run not be sound. He had experience with Jotul's down burning catalytic design for their Firelight 12 (and their getting away from it as quick as they could). The top load design I personally liked was Quad's Isle Royale- prob the only top loader I'd have.... I do think we all wish VC luck, but I have to ask if the end users (their customers) are really happy having that design? Is top loading that much in demand still? I'm hard-headed I guess, I still like their tube stoves better.....

 

[begreen]

The top load design I personally liked was Quad's Isle Royale- prob the only top loader I'd have.... I do think we all wish VC luck, but I have to ask if the end users (their customers) are really happy having that design? Is top loading that much in demand still? I'm hard-headed I guess, I still like their tube stoves better.....

What's your thought on the Jotul F50?

 

[stovelark]

Hi BG, the Rangely so far has while its been received ok, about the only time it sells over the Carrabassett is for the top load feature or if someone has to have the ash pan system and doesn't care about the TL feature. (The Carrabassett as you know doesn't have an ash pan option, its a poor man's Rangely). I will say this- the Rangely is one crazy heavy stove at 565 lbs. Not caring/needing a top load specifically, I myself would get a Carrabassett for almost $450 less, the F55 is a heat beast. The Jotul cast clad stoves offer a good value, but I still prefer the Enviro and PE cast clad looks, I just wished those stoves cost a little less. The real thing I liked about the IR, and if I was looking for a top loader, I knew it burned beautifully and was a tremendous heater, no fuss, no muss and of course, one pretty stove. And yes, sometimes looks do count even with us guys.. Take care.

 

[webby3650]

A friend of mine worked at VC when the "neverburn" system came into being. The VC folks were vehement in their top load stoves, being that was what their name was built on. He suggested that perhaps a system where smoke needs to go down to burn would in the long run not be sound. He had experience with Jotul's down burning catalytic design for their Firelight 12 (and their getting away from it as quick as they could). The top load design I personally liked was Quad's Isle Royale- prob the only top loader I'd have.... I do think we all wish VC luck, but I have to ask if the end users (their customers) are really happy having that design? Is top loading that much in demand still? I'm hard-headed I guess, I still like their tube stoves better.....

I also really liked my isle royale. It’s a superior design to VC. I don’t see the appeal of the top load design though, with a well designed stove I don’t see the benefit of a top load.

 

[begreen]

I have gone that route too, though I came very close to getting an IR instead of the T6. Simple is good. I have grown fond of our KISS stove.

 

[Cast Iron]

For those using the front or side load ( older Oslo for us ) and heating with the stove for near 100% of need, top loading is a big convenience.
Grab an armful of splits, raise the griddle, drop in a load. Simple.
Yes, looked at the Jotul ( not Firelight cat ) and Quadra top loads. Inconvenient, clunky designs, limited space for wood, too many devices ( tube holders swung out of the way ) with the potential to break. And yes, the VC Flexburn also has the potential in the damper to have problems.
So, why the VC Encore Flexburn? It is good looking with a durable color she likes, blue/black enamel called "Twilight" .
As posted, dealers called and spoken with seem satisfied with both HHT's service and their customer's experience with the Flexburns for the past 3 years of Flexburn manufacture.
After some intense pushing, VC sent the Service Manual for the Flexburns. Impressive, showing the improvements to the previous VC cat stoves. One is that the cast plates are gassketed, not cemented. Another, the whole refractory unit is hardened to some kind of mysterious fiberglass strength.
More important, HHT/VC improved the warranty to all the "breakables" in the stove for years, and the thinner cat. The cat BTW has a 3 year warranty, not "prorated". For you doubters, the new cat is 1/2 the thickness of most cats. I worry about that.
When customers have had a part break, dealers say that the company sends out a replacement fast with only a pic needed.
So for all you BK and Woodstock and Jotul fanatics out there, we shall see how this beast works out. No Kool Aid with the Flexburn.
My ash is on the line.

 

[stovelark]

Cast Iron- you seem biased to the point of almost excess. How long have you been with VC? I'm wondering because if you have went through the pain of servicing broken fountain assemblies (seemingly, many of them) as many here have, then you would understand our reluctance to believe in that or any new version of the system. Remember too, VC left a lot of folks with warranties not covered hiding behind the "change of ownership flag". I do applaud you for believing in your product, but coming from many unbiased, just had to fix the issues, its hard to believe this version is going to be different. I hope I'm wrong. Having said that, I still like the Montpelier/Merrimacks. As for side vs top- I'll take the side too, easy to load, out of the main heat lobe of the stove, longer pieces of wood, what's not to love? Please remember, we all want VC to succeed, just hope I don't have to fix em..... Keep warm.
PS- Don't consider myself a fanatic to any stove, I just find I like the ones who just do their job with little or no complaint. These companies charge too much for any less expectation...

 

[Diabel]

Grab an armful of splits, raise the griddle, drop in a load.

Good luck with that!!

 

[bholler]

For those using the front or side load ( older Oslo for us ) and heating with the stove for near 100% of need, top loading is a big convenience.
Grab an armful of splits, raise the griddle, drop in a load. Simple.
Yes, looked at the Jotul ( not Firelight cat ) and Quadra top loads. Inconvenient, clunky designs, limited space for wood, too many devices ( tube holders swung out of the way ) with the potential to break. And yes, the VC Flexburn also has the potential in the damper to have problems.
So, why the VC Encore Flexburn? It is good looking with a durable color she likes, blue/black enamel called "Twilight" .
As posted, dealers called and spoken with seem satisfied with both HHT's service and their customer's experience with the Flexburns for the past 3 years of Flexburn manufacture.
After some intense pushing, VC sent the Service Manual for the Flexburns. Impressive, showing the improvements to the previous VC cat stoves. One is that the cast plates are gassketed, not cemented. Another, the whole refractory unit is hardened to some kind of mysterious fiberglass strength.
More important, HHT/VC improved the warranty to all the "breakables" in the stove for years, and the thinner cat. The cat BTW has a 3 year warranty, not "prorated". For you doubters, the new cat is 1/2 the thickness of most cats. I worry about that.
When customers have had a part break, dealers say that the company sends out a replacement fast with only a pic needed.
So for all you BK and Woodstock and Jotul fanatics out there, we shall see how this beast works out. No Kool Aid with the Flexburn.
My ash is on the line.

Again i am not sure why you value the info given to you by the people trying to sell you a stove over the input from guys who have absolutly nothing to gain or loose in the situation. We just work on the stoves in the feild and get to see first hand how the designs hold up in the real world. And we get to see the real value of the warranties from different companies. We all agree they are making improvements. But just the fact that they need to have a seperate technical service manual to tell us how to work on the stoves while most other companies just cover that in the regular manual should tell you something.

And yes some of the other top loaders have more complicated mechanisms. But for the most part those stoves have proven to be much more durable.

 

[stovelark]

I'm assuming cast works for VC, his posts seem to indicate this. Its also great to believe in (we all want to) what you sell, but you have to accept that that particular design gives a lot of grief. It's always amazed me that they stuck with that design too- but wanting to top load I guess doesn't give many choices. What I don't always get is why MFRs do not listen more to the folks that work with and service their products to kinda spearhead an improvement if one can be obtained. If it just can't be and is cost prohibitive is one thing, but sometimes it seems sometimes a suspect design is just kept with anyway and dealt with as necessary, rather than changing it....

 

[webby3650]

I'm assuming cast works for VC, his posts seem to indicate this. Its also great to believe in (we all want to) what you sell, but you have to accept that that particular design gives a lot of grief. It's always amazed me that they stuck with that design too- but wanting to top load I guess doesn't give many choices. What I don't always get is why MFRs do not listen more to the folks that work with and service their products to kinda spearhead an improvement if one can be obtained. If it just can't be and is cost prohibitive is one thing, but sometimes it seems sometimes a suspect design is just kept with anyway and dealt with as necessary, rather than changing it....

I don’t know? Why would a VC employee get on here like this? Cast, is it true?

 

[Diabel]

I don’t know? Why would a VC employee get on here like this? Cast, is it true?

I don't think he works for VC. But it is obvious who runs that household........(kidding!)

 

[webby3650]

I don't think he works for VC. But it is obvious who runs that household........(kidding!)

Well, that’s more common than not unfortunately...
We sure won’t be buying a stove based on looks at my house! Looks are definitely a plus, but not at the expensive of lack luster performance, constant break downs, and poor customer service.

 

[bholler]

Well, that’s more common than not unfortunately...
We sure won’t be buying a stove based on looks at my house! Looks are definitely a plus, but not at the expensive of lack luster performance, constant break downs, and poor customer service.

Looks are important to both me and my wife but not above function.

 

[bholler]

For those using the front or side load ( older Oslo for us ) and heating with the stove for near 100% of need, top loading is a big convenience.
Grab an armful of splits, raise the griddle, drop in a load. Simple.
Yes, looked at the Jotul ( not Firelight cat ) and Quadra top loads. Inconvenient, clunky designs, limited space for wood, too many devices ( tube holders swung out of the way ) with the potential to break. And yes, the VC Flexburn also has the potential in the damper to have problems.
So, why the VC Encore Flexburn? It is good looking with a durable color she likes, blue/black enamel called "Twilight" .
As posted, dealers called and spoken with seem satisfied with both HHT's service and their customer's experience with the Flexburns for the past 3 years of Flexburn manufacture.
After some intense pushing, VC sent the Service Manual for the Flexburns. Impressive, showing the improvements to the previous VC cat stoves. One is that the cast plates are gassketed, not cemented. Another, the whole refractory unit is hardened to some kind of mysterious fiberglass strength.
More important, HHT/VC improved the warranty to all the "breakables" in the stove for years, and the thinner cat. The cat BTW has a 3 year warranty, not "prorated". For you doubters, the new cat is 1/2 the thickness of most cats. I worry about that.
When customers have had a part break, dealers say that the company sends out a replacement fast with only a pic needed.
So for all you BK and Woodstock and Jotul fanatics out there, we shall see how this beast works out. No Kool Aid with the Flexburn.
My ash is on the line.

You do realize just dropping an armload of splits in there is going to destroy the refractories and probably break the glass right? Not to mention loading that way will mean you can fit in much less wood than if you stacked it meaning less heat and less burn time.

 

[Diabel]

You do realize just dropping an armload of splits in there is going to destroy the refractories and probably break the glass right? Not to mention loading that way will mean you can fit in much less wood than if you stacked it meaning less heat and less burn time.

I size every split that goes in! Like lego blocks, any other way forget about the 8hr burn.