Chimney pictures for review...

[tiggere]

Ok...I decided to move some stuff and get a look prior to the sweep/inspector getting here next week...here are some photo's for the resident experts to look at and see if anything jumps out at you...if you notice the terracotta flue on the right hand side of the photo...I'm pretty sure thats the flue for the oil furnace that used to be under the house...the roof has three flues coming out of the same stack on the roof and I need to go look but I think one is a fake...one is for the fireplace and one was for the old furnace...all in all it looks ok to me...no liner obviously...

 

[offroadaudio]

So are you burning in this now, or getting it cleaned and inspected for an install?

 

[brickman]

You are looking at the smoke chamber and smoke shelf. The liner starts on top of smoke chamber. Further up than your pics show. you need to go outside and see if the clay liner extends past top of chimney. Should be two, since there is one you can see in photo, probably from old flue in basement or for hot water heater.

 

[tiggere]

chimney sweep is coming out next Friday...it has a Buck 26000 insert in it now that my wifes grandparents installed when they lived here...the insert was installed Jan 9th, 1980...I know this because I have all the original paperwork...how cool is that...I took that from inside the stove looking up...it does have the terracotta flues coming out of the top of the chimney stack (3 of them)...like I said I think one is a fake...one was for the oil, and one for chimney...I am not burning in it now...I was a little concerned due to the fact that it has not been used in 10+ years so wanted to get someone out to look at it...it does not look that bad to me but definitely wanted to get others opinions on it...and as someone mentioned to keep the chimney sweep honest...

Would you guys have an issue burning in this? Or do you think a liner is going to be needed?

 

[offroadaudio]

Although it does look clean, I'd still be hesitant burning in it without a liner.
But, you're making the right move - have the pro sweep check it out and see what his recommendations are.
For safety - insurance and draft - a full liner is always better.

 

[tiggere]

What would be involved with installing a full liner (the roof part is a no brainer)...I assume I would have to pull the insert out to connect it to the stove somehow...what I have not seen is a "connector" from the stove damper to the recommended 8" flue pipe...the damper is a rectangle and that piece is probably going to be very hard to find for such an old stove...

 

[offroadaudio]

You're correct, they can be difficult to find. We'll need an expert to chime in, but I think Vermont Castings might make a rectangle to round adapter of some sort.
There are also liners that are rectangular - but they are a little pricey.
Let's see what the sweep has to say and go from there. If he insists on a liner, I can check my Copperfield Supply book and let you know if there is an adapter available and also about the rectangle flex. Just need the size of the flue exit on the stove.

 

[Loco Gringo]

This may help you. http://www.buckstove.com/buckfiles/manuals/Buck Stove Model 26000, 27000 & 28000 Manual (Rev 05-1987).pdf

 

[tiggere]

I found it...Buck has it for $138 and it includes the gasket and clamps...then the liner is another $600 for the 316Ti kit at Woodland Direct...it includes everything else that should be needed for the install...would you guys be ok burning one or two fires as is to see if it even heats the house enough for us to move forward or does it pose too big a threat with even one fire (trust me...the sweep is gonna hear the same thing I'm asking you guys)...this being the smallest of the stoves they make I'm not sure we are even gonna see enough heat from it to "recoupe" the money spent fixing it up the proper way...which is the whole reason for doing it in the first place...oil is expensive so we were looking for this to be an alternative heat source...it does have a fan though and the room is ducted with a return so we can run the central fan and pull the heat throughout the house (in theory it should work)...

 

[offroadaudio]

I don't think we've seen enough of the chimney to make that call.
But, it's a good idea - hopefully the sweep will give you the ok for a few fires.

 

[gzecc]

I found it...Buck has it for $138 and it includes the gasket and clamps...then the liner is another $600 for the 316Ti kit at Woodland Direct...it includes everything else that should be needed for the install...would you guys be ok burning one or two fires as is to see if it even heats the house enough for us to move forward or does it pose too big a threat with even one fire (trust me...the sweep is gonna hear the same thing I'm asking you guys)...this being the smallest of the stoves they make I'm not sure we are even gonna see enough heat from it to "recoupe" the money spent fixing it up the proper way...which is the whole reason for doing it in the first place...oil is expensive so we were looking for this to be an alternative heat source...it does have a fan though and the room is ducted with a return so we can run the central fan and pull the heat throughout the house (in theory it should work)...

You currently have what is called a slammer. An insert "slammed" into a fireplace with out any connection to the chimney. Your fireplace design was engineered to deal with the dynamics of an open fireplace. A slammer install has many inherent problems, draw, creosote etc. The best solution is to attach an 8" liner to the top of your chimney. Back in the day of your stove, a lot of installs were done with a "direct connect".
This is when a short 6-7' section is attached to the top of the insert and inserted past the smoke chamber.
Unfortunately, I doubt you will get the real benifit from this insert with at least a direct connect. I could be wrong.

 

[tiggere]

I was reading the online manual from Buck on how to install this stove...looks to me that the way it is installed is the "proper" way according to the instructions...none of the instructions say anything about adding a liner or even needing one...they do offer the "stack" for non-insert applications (this stove has a leg option for freestanding)...this is where the problem may come in...even if the sweep says that it needs a liner I'm not sure there will be enough room between the stove and the steel angle in the photo's above to get the stack to sit on top and get the liner connected...not to mention that the stack is for an 8" liner and I'm pretty darn sure it would never fit through that steel opening you see in the pictures above...not without removing the insert and reworking the chimney...

I'm real curious to see how you guys would deal with this...PLEASE give input here...I would hate to spend a bunch of money to get this thing done right when I could just put a pellet stove in a different area of the house and accomplish the same supplemental heating result (maybe more based on new stove location)

On another note...I got up on the roof...not to look at the chimney but because we have a roof leak over the carport that just showed up...NICE...anyhow...while I was up there I walked over and looked at the chimney...it was just like I thought...the center terracotta is the chimney flue...looks real good on the inside...just like the brown terracotta with zero creosote to be seen in the flue or on the flue cover/screen...the other is for the old oil furnace and the third is a fake filled with cement...I didn't bother with taking the cover off and looking down just yet as the roof leak was the task for the day...with good weather all next week I might manage to get up there again before the sweep gets here and take some pictures...

 

[cmonSTART]

Just from the photos you provided I would venture to guess there is quite a bit of non-standard construction. The smoke chamber is unparged, meaning the brick corbeling is showing (should be parged smooth). Also, that furnace flue should not be visible under any circumstances (should be separated by a wythe wall of 4 inches nominal thickness). Should you ever get a nice hot fire going in the fireplace, I could see that small area of the furnace flue heating up and cracking, leading to the possibility of CO entry into the home. Just a gut feeling here, but I would bet a proper Level 2 inspection would reveal a laundry list of issues with that fireplace.

When was it built?

 

[gzecc]

I was reading the online manual from Buck on how to install this stove...looks to me that the way it is installed is the "proper" way according to the instructions...none of the instructions say anything about adding a liner or even needing one...they do offer the "stack" for non-insert applications (this stove has a leg option for freestanding)...this is where the problem may come in...even if the sweep says that it needs a liner I'm not sure there will be enough room between the stove and the steel angle in the photo's above to get the stack to sit on top and get the liner connected...not to mention that the stack is for an 8" liner and I'm pretty darn sure it would never fit through that steel opening you see in the pictures above...not without removing the insert and reworking the chimney...

I'm real curious to see how you guys would deal with this...PLEASE give input here...I would hate to spend a bunch of money to get this thing done right when I could just put a pellet stove in a different area of the house and accomplish the same supplemental heating result (maybe more based on new stove location)

On another note...I got up on the roof...not to look at the chimney but because we have a roof leak over the carport that just showed up...NICE...anyhow...while I was up there I walked over and looked at the chimney...it was just like I thought...the center terracotta is the chimney flue...looks real good on the inside...just like the brown terracotta with zero creosote to be seen in the flue or on the flue cover/screen...the other is for the old oil furnace and the third is a fake filled with cement...I didn't bother with taking the cover off and looking down just yet as the roof leak was the task for the day...with good weather all next week I might manage to get up there again before the sweep gets here and take some pictures...

I have a 28000 buck. It has the boot on top of the insert and an 8" oval liner.

 

[tiggere]

built in 1964

gzecc - please link me to the boot and liner you used...

 

[Shari]

Okay - you want an opinion - being a woman I have lots of opinions on lots of things.

Here's the way I look at this:

Sentimentally, you may want to keep what you had because 'if it was good enough for (insert ancestral name here) it should be good enough for me & mine.

However -

If you look at 98% of the newer stoves they all require a 6" flue. What you have to determine is, for sentimental reasons, do you want to keep what you have adding a 8" liner kit only to find out the stove doesn't meet your heating needs and then one year from now you have to tear everything out, wasting the $$ you spent for a 8" flue, and then install a 6" flue.

It's your call what you want to do - however (another opinion here) - whatever size liner and stove you go with I would stick a liner in there and insulate it. Insulating a liner is not necessarily just meant to 'keep the flue warm so less creosote forms'. Insulation does that but also does more: An insulated liner adds an additional layer of fire protection for your home. You can always have a pro come out with a camera to visually inspect the interior of your chimney and get your chimney 'certified' but why go through that cost? Just insulate your liner, adding that extra layer of protection, and you should be good to go.

 

[tfdchief]

You can buy the rectangular to 8" round boot/stack for the top of a Buck 26000 at a number of places.
http://www.servicesales.com/stove_parts/buck_parts.html
http://www.stove-parts-unlimited.com
http://www.buckstove.com

The boot can be attached to the new Stainless Steel liner. positioned just above the stove, and the stove moved back in under it. Then it is a simple matter of attaching it to the stove with the T-bolts that you buy with the stack/boot, from inside the stove.

As you can see in my signature, I have burned a Buck 26000 for 30 years. It is old technology today, for sure. But it is a great heater and fairly efficient. Very solid steel stove. I live in central IL, burn 24/7, pretty much heat my 1500 square foot ranch (except maybe when the furnace runs once early in the morning) and burn about 3 cords a winter.

I am getting ready to install a NEW EPA stove in my kitchen and am really excited about it. But I will still be burning my old Buck!

By all means make sure your chimney is safe and if you can afford a new stove, buy it. I am just relating my first hand experience for what ever it is worth. ;-)

 

[Loco Gringo]

As you can see in my signature, I have burned a Buck 26000 for 30 years. It is old technology today, for sure. But it is a great heater and fairly efficient. Very solid steel stove. I live in central IL, burn 24/7, pretty much heat my 1500 square foot ranch (except maybe when the furnace runs once early in the morning) and burn about 3 cords a winter.

I am getting ready to install a NEW EPA stove in my kitchen and am really excited about it. But I will still be burning my old Buck!

By all means make sure your chimney is safe and if you can afford a new stove, buy it. I am just relating my first hand experience for what ever it is worth. ;-)

Thanks for the imput Chief. Considering your background I take this as good advice.