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Crafstman chain saw quit

Post in 'The Gear' started by Burd, Jun 11, 2008.

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  1. Burd

    Burd Feeling the Heat

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    Ha guy first time in the gear form glade its here
    Well we had a really big storm come and the winds took some trees and power lines on the next block. I went out and started helping cut up all the down trees to help with clean up.and things were going good until I ran out of gas in the chain saw.So I put gas in it and oil went to start it up and nothing. So I took out spark plug to see how it was burning and to clean it up It was dry.Then I noticed that it wasn't getting any fuel.I keep tring to prime it and nothing is coming in to the primer ball.
    Why is this and what can I do to fix it?
    I would think its a fuel line but how do you get to it?
    The saw is only two years old shouldnt less gas line last longer?
    Well I guess this info would help :coolcheese:
    Craftsman 42cc 18" Ezpull ( if that helps)

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  2. WILDSOURDOUGH

    WILDSOURDOUGH New Member

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    If it is the Black one- I think there might be a recall on it. Check your Sears dealer.
    Mine went kaput in six months- broken shaft. My Sears guy (the owner) gave me a new Husquvarna !- (After I had sent in the Sears one for repairs, and had bought a Husq from him.- so now I have two).

    Other than that... probably is the fuel line...and it's a bugger to get to, buired in the gas tank.

    FUN !!!
  3. BrotherBart

    BrotherBart Hearth.com LLC Mid-Atlantic Division Staff Member

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    Had it happen with a small Husky. The line had slipped off where it connects to the carb. Take off the air cleaner and take a look. Really cheesy clamps they use on them.
  4. Burd

    Burd Feeling the Heat

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    Thanks guy for the replies. Is there any one on the gear form that has the craftsman that can help me out money to tight to take it to a shop I would like to try and fix it my self.Is there any type of web page that could help me?BB how did yor make out with them storm last week?
    By the way the saw is the red one and it should be recalled Craftsman is really going down hill with there lawn and gardening.I have a 24" push mower that two years old and it about to take a sh t and the weed wacker been in the shop allready.Well for the price for the saw it did what I needed it for.
    Is it worth fixing or should I break down and get one thats more reliabile.WHAT TO DO WHAT TO DO
    CRAP I hate buying something that can be fixed The thing is how do you do it :coolsmirk:
  5. kevin j

    kevin j Minister of Fire

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    look at it this way:
    -you may not know much about fixing it
    -it is worthless as it is
    -thus, you can't mess it up too badly, because it is worthless if broken
    -you may fix it
    -and, you may learn a lot.

    everyone started somewhere.
    Take off some plastics, look for fuel lines loose, impulse line loose, cracked or worn etc.
  6. biggins08

    biggins08 New Member

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    My husky 141 vhad a disconnected fuel line after about an hour of use.......
  7. TruePatriot

    TruePatriot New Member

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    Feb 19, 2007
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    156
    Burd,

    Bad crank seals can cause your symptoms, but usually on older, high-hour saws. When hot, the worn seals expand, allowing vacuum to leak around the crank, instead of helping to pull the incoming charge into the cylinder. However, if your saw is not old, and you've faithfully run the proper fuel/oil mix, I would not suspect crank seals, first.

    Try it again when cold--some saws (especially ones with poor crank seals) can be hard/impossible to start when hot--some call this "vapor lock," but again, any vacuum leak, be it from a leaking impulse line, carb gasket, etc..., will cause a hard/no start on a two stroke, as two stroke crankcases must be airtight. And when the saw is hot, a cracked line or gasket can leak, though it did not leak when cold, thus causing the "hot no-start." (To rule out a leaking carb gasket, tighten carb hold-down bolts. If confident enough, remove carb and examine carb gasket for tears, cracks, etc..., reassemble, tighten firmly--but don't strip carb hold-down threads, and retry. Note: prior to carb removal, cover/seal off carb throat and blow away all debris with compressed air, so it does not fall into engine when carb removed.)

    My theory:

    I think Kevin j may be be right, when he says:
    The "impulse line" uses the variation in crankcase pressure, caused by the stroking of the piston/crank, to "pump" fuel from tank to the carb (presumably through the action of a fabric-type diaphram, acting as a "one way/check valve"--but don't quote me on that part. Regardless of the theory, however, you need a nonleaking impulse line for the saw to run properly.

    For example, I have a 25 (?) y.o. Homelight 360 (probably a near-professional saw, by today's standards? Opinions vary, but it's powerful and reliable, though heavy) that my Dad gave me and, last year, the "impulse line" developed a crack. After running perfectly for years, suddenly, one day, it revved wildly, running lean, and actually got hot enough, in the few seconds before I could shut it down, that it continued to run even AFTER I KILLED THE IGNITION. Essentially, it was "diesling"--running with no spark. And it was running fast. I've had my two stroke dirtbike do this too, when I run it out of gas for winter storage. The lean mixture let's it run hot enough to start firing without the spark. Had to stall the bike in gear.

    The reason I mention this is because, IF your saw revved wildly before it died or was shut down, that would IMO, definitely be indicative of a too-lean mixture, which would be consistent with a cracked/leaking impulse line. The reason being is that, counterintuitively, a lean mixture causes overheating, and a too-rich mixture will cause a a two stroke (or fourstroke, for that matter), to run cool.

    And a leaking "impulse line" will cause a lean mixture, as it did on my Homelite 360. After it continued to rev crazily, with the ignition switched off, I had to (quickly) choke it to death. And after almost total disasassembly (everything but the internals), I found the impulse line hose, that hooks to a nipple on the crankcase (with no hose clamp, IIRC) had cracked, defeating the impulse line's ability to "pump" enough fuel to the carb.

    A new piece of line, reassassembly of the carb I never needed dissassmble in the first palce (had I known what the problem was before I tore the carb down :shut: ) and it ran fine, and runs fine, to this day.

    Check every line's connection you can find, and check every inch of every line for cracks.

    Also, saws have a weighted end on the fuel pickup line, in the tank. I've had the line get "hung up" in my small, homeowner's Poulan Micro XXV, such that the end of the line was above the level of fuel in a near-full tank--result: air in the fuel line and a no-start. The solution is to rearrange the fuel line so it rests on the tank's bottom. When you tip the saw, in theory, the weighted fuel line end "follows" the fuel (because Gravity tells it to) so that, again, in theory, the fuel pickup is always submerged. That's what that "rattling" sound is in your saw, if you "shake it like a Polaroid picture" (apologies to Andre 3000).

    Priming the carb directly, (air cleaner off, safety glasses on, last will and testament filed with the attorney) with the proper gas/oil mix (not "straight gas"!) will prove whether you have a fuel-delivery problem or not. Take a clean Frenches mustard bottle (with the threaded nipple on it), put some fuel/oil mix in it, and dribble a quarter-thimble of fuel into the carb throat, then try to start. Hold the throttle open while dribbling--if it runs, briefly, you know you have a fuel-delivery problem. A leaking impulse line, or an unsubmerged fuel pickup line are two possible causes of a fuel-delivery problem.

    Good luck.

    Peter
  8. TruePatriot

    TruePatriot New Member

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    And after all that (apologies to those who dislike 6,000 character posts), I have to consider this:

    My neighbor's weedeater developed a cracked hose at the priming bulb, and it would not start, nor would it fill the priming bulb. Happily, both hoses leading to the bulb were visually exposed, and one was cracked. As Kevin J noted, some dissassembly is almost certainly required.

    Again, check all hoses, make sure fuel pickup is submerged and also make sure there is no obstruction or kink in the fuel line within the tank.

    Lastly, my old Poulan has a felt-like sleeve on the weighted, fuel pickup end. Once, this felt sleeve got so full of fine crap that, while not really noticeable, essentially choked it off. I removed the cotton sleeve, washed it out in clean gas, blew it out, and noticed that it was several shades whiter, for the cleaning. Presumably, fine dirt/crap packed into it, over the years, (I got the saw used, so I'll blame the P.O.) and choked off it's ability to filter/flow gas. Not sure if your saw has this felt filter-thingy or not, but mine just slipped on and off of the tubular, slotted fuel line pickup weight.

    Since your saw is newer, I would suspect some large piece of foreign matter may have got by the felt filter (if so equipped) and blocked of the entire line, rather than the years-of-impacted-crap-scenario I apparently had, on the Poulan.

    Another thought: is the fuel bulb itself cracked? Perhaps a (low) "pressure-test" is in order--IIRC, the only way I found the leaking impulse line on the Homelite 360, now that I think about it, was to gently blow air into the system (through the tank neck? I can't remember) and LISTEN FOR THE AIR LEAK. That part was easy--but finding the leak was a *****. I had to remove the flywheel to expose the nipple on the crankcase, if memory serves. YMMV.

    Good luck.
  9. Jags

    Jags Moderate Moderator Staff Member

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    What do you have to loose? Start pulling that baby down, and get to the innerds. If no gas when primer bulb is pumped, the most likely parts are loose/ bad hoses, ya picked up some crap off of the bottom of the tank, plugging something, or your primer bulb is loose/cracked. All the other suggestions are good ones, but a "primer" type carb and fuel system is pretty simple. No fuel in primer bulb---no vroom, vroom. Get that part fixed first.

    Edit: and TruePatriot has lots of good points in his post.
  10. Burd

    Burd Feeling the Heat

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    WOW Truepatriot that a lot of typing my eye hurt (only kidding)It really may be them seals the saw has a lot of hours on it well over 90hours some of them hours were 8+ on a good day< And I have been noticing that it been harder and harder to start when it Hot Im going to print out this page and when I get the chance ill take it a part.I bought this saw to clean out my lot when I bought the house three years ago so It owes me nothing.Ill bet if I go and try to start that saw right now it would fire up so Im thinking seals.I have looked at the fuel lines and they looked pretty good.But when I push the primer I can here air sucking in.Were it coming from I dont now
    Thank for all the help
    Maybe next week end I can get to the saw for this weekend Im going golfing with a really good buzz on Its very rare I get the chance to do so.
    HAPPY FATHERS DAY
  11. TruePatriot

    TruePatriot New Member

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    Burd,

    Re: this--I have no defense:

    If I knew how to be concise, or effectively self-edit, I'd probably be a successful writer by now--LOL

    But re: your saw:

    I'm thinking 90 hours is not enough to really worry about leaking crank seals yet, provided the proper oil/fuel mix was used. But this sounds like a plan:

    The only way I found my cracked impulse line, on the 360, as I say, was to blow into the fuel system, hear it leaking, and start digging, as has been suggested.

    I think if you pull off shrouds, covers, etc..., and follow the air-leaking sound, you will soon find the culprit, which a few of us here suspect is a leaking hose. I'm betting the basic saw has more than another 90 hours left in it!

    Please post what you find--I'm sure many here can help advise you, as you get further into that Homelite. I've also found a source for obsolete Homelite parts (not that you have to worry about that yet) should anyone else be wrenching on "the old stuff."

    And Jags? Thank you for this:
    It's nice to be appreciated, especially by those more knowledgable than oneself.

    If I was religious, I'd say "Thank God for www.hearth.com!"

    True Patriot
  12. snydley

    snydley Member

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    I've got the 55cc model of this saw,(easy pull or whatever it's called). I would expect that if you can hear air coming in that the fuel line has broken, or come off between the gas tank and the primer bulb. I've never had mine apart, but can only imagine there's just 2 or 4 screws that hold the tank on. Remove it, inspect and replace. Also, the fuel filter inside could be clogged up preventing gas from getting to the bulb, that wouldn't account for the air sucking sound you heard though. I would check these things first before you go taking the engine apart to check the seals, you might save yourself alot of work! ;-)
  13. eba1225

    eba1225 Feeling the Heat

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    Burd,

    From what you said here "Then I noticed that it wasn’t getting any fuel.I keep tring to prime it and nothing is coming in to the primer ball." it sounds like it could be a couple of things: the fuel line into the tank came off the carb at the primer button, or is plugged in the tank due to junk getting sucked up in the line.

    Just my .02
    Erik
  14. Burd

    Burd Feeling the Heat

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    Ha thanks every one for all the great repieles .Well I toke it apart and I found nothing wrong with the fuel lines So I cleaned every thing I could and put it back to gather . I primed it and the ball filled up Pulled it a few times and off it went Got it hot and shut it down. Now when shes hot It wount fire back offand when I push the primer it wont fill back up.The thing is every time I gun it hard and shut it down Or it runs out of gas I cant get it to fire back up and I noticed the last time It ran out of gas It wouldnt prime .
    So the best part of all this is that my wife told me to get a new one since we will be using it all the time for the fire wood Looking to spend $400 I would still would like to fix the craftsman and keep it for back up Our when the other on is in a pinch.
    any other thoughts on what to do with it
    Is it worth the time to fix it.
    And If any one is wondering what saw Im looking at its the MS310 or the MS290shitl Can wait Im picking it out this saturday and when it gets home Ill be putting it to work as we still have trees laying in nabors yards and some laying in allley ways .I was out yestuday with the hand saw and a saw saw cleaning a 9" limb off someones car.
    If any one wants to now how I feel about craftsman THEY SUCK :mad:
    well If any one can help with that peacie of crap.That would be great
  15. snydley

    snydley Member

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    Well, I thought you said it has about 130 hrs. on it now, if it's been dependable up to this point I'd say that was pretty good. Anything with that many hours on it is gonna need some service, especially if the maintenance hasn't been regular on it.
    I still think your problem with that saw is in the fuel system. I would replace the filter in the gas tank, replace the lines, and clean the tank and bulb assembly out thoroughly with carb cleaner.
    I would also change the air cleaner and spark plug. If the engine has good compression I would try to fix it, if not you'll need to replace the piston and rings and at the least hone the cylinder, maybe even replace that. That could run into some $$, but I just have the feeling your problem is in the fuel system, and has nothing to do with the compression.
    When you try to start it when it's hot it shouldn't be primed or choked. It should start on the 1st or 2nd pull of the cord. If after a few pulls it doesn't start either open the throttle fully with one hand and pull the cord a few times,(if it's flooded), or prime with the bulb,(if it's starved for gas). You should never have to prime it if it's hot though.
    I just bought a new saw myself to replace my Craftsman 55cc saw,(I still use the Craftsman for smaller stuff). I bought a Stihl MS361, 18" bar.. A GREAT saw. It cuts through the wood SO much better than the Craftsman. The only thing I don't like about it is the carb has a tendency to flood easily. I think this has as much to do with me not being familiar with the saw, as it does with the saw's starting characteristics. It's alot different than the Craftsman in that it doesn't have a primer bulb, and the throttle doesn't have a lock in the full open position,(safety reasons I'm sure), like the Craftsman does. I could always "clear" the flooding if the Craftsman got flooded by opening the choke and locking the throttle fully open. One or 2 pulls and it would start right up. The Stihl's throttle won't lock fully open, so I have to hold it open with my toe when I have my foot in the handle. Hopefully as I use it more I'll get the hang of starting it.
    Good luck with your new purchase and take care,
    Snyde
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