Cutting wood road side ?

wellbuilt home Posted By wellbuilt home, Dec 14, 2008 at 7:00 PM

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  1. polaris

    polaris
    Feeling the Heat

    Jan 31, 2008
    419
    4
    Loc:
    KY.
    I too own land in several areas and It seems urban folks see a 100 or so acres and can't imagine anyone other than the government really owns it or cares about it. I have destroyed a couple of deer stands that took a lot of work to build. If they had asked me to hunt I probably would have allowed it. As has been stated before somebody owns that land.
     
  2. jdemaris

    jdemaris
    New Member

    Oct 11, 2008
    452
    0
    Loc:
    Central New York State
    It has nothing to do with "being out in the sticks" or not. More to do with when it was done, and what the comprehensive plan is. Most towns that I know off do not want owership of roads. Why own when you can use it anyway, and let others pay the taxes? On the other hand, county roads are sometimes owned, and state roads are always owned, in my area.

    I've met with highway superintendents, county road supervisors, and several town attorneys who did NOT know who owned the roads are were clueless in regard to the legal issues. It tends to be something that is often taken for granted until a lawsuit pops up. Most of the USA is based on old English Law with some ammendments, when it comes to property ownership. Easiest way to check is the good-old tax bill. If the road by you is town owned, then you're not paying taxes on it. In many parts of Michigan, even when you own a road, you still get a tax break since the reasoning is - even though you own it, you cannot use it for much with a town highway running over it.

    If you live in an area, or town, that is only 60 years old - I know nothing about it. Never lived anwhere in my life like that. My town was incorporated 1797. The place I was born in, in New Jersey was incorporated 1820.
     
  3. backpack09

    backpack09
    Minister of Fire

    Sep 10, 2007
    554
    7
    Loc:
    Rochester, Mass
    Ahh, sorry, MY parcel was cut out 60 years ago. The Town itself broke from the the town to the north of us 100 years ago, and well, this is Massachusetts... the pilgrims lived right down the road.

    But beyond that... ALL of the subdivisions I have designed or worked on have (eventually) been taken over by the towns.

    As I said, I can only speak the areas I know and am familiar with... not generalized statements across the country as you are making.
     
  4. mikeathens

    mikeathens
    New Member

    Jan 25, 2007
    648
    0
    Loc:
    Athens, Ohio
    I have a power line right of way, phone right of way, and township road right of way on my 85 acre parcel. NO ONE has ANY right to steal wood from me. I use those downed trees for lumber or firewood. My neighbor owns 150+ acres around me and has had a couple very nice oaks and maples blow down. Very convenient along the road, so I asked, and he said have at it. I have deer poachers up and down the road every now and then. I don't see how this is any different.
     
  5. jdemaris

    jdemaris
    New Member

    Oct 11, 2008
    452
    0
    Loc:
    Central New York State
    If you live in an urban area that has sewer lines, water lines, gas lines, etc. buried all along the roads, they'd probably need ownership to avoid future conflicts. In my area, a general right-of-way for a public highway does not grant those rights. In fact, most older right-of-ways give the public the right of use "over" a property. That kind of negates any digging rights. Utility companies have their own right-of-ways, and they are negotiated. At the moment, Verizon is threatening to sue me for cutting an underground phone line the was buried 12" deep, out in the middle of one of my farm fields. They don't have a legal right to stand on, but they are used to bullying and scaring people.

    There have been several cities/towns in my area that have recently installed new sewer and water lines. It was done one of two ways. They offered to buy right-of-ways from property owners. If they refused, the towns simply took the land by "quick take" eminent domain.
     
  6. the_dude

    the_dude
    Feeling the Heat

    Feb 26, 2008
    298
    0
    Loc:
    Southern WI
    If properties owners truly could care less about downed firewood, why don't you ask? Did it honestly take strangers on the internet to convince you this was wrong? Also, you don't think there are many hillbillys around you. Are you including in your hillbilly count those that trespass and steal for firewood?
     
  7. GKG-MO

    GKG-MO
    New Member

    Dec 9, 2008
    38
    0
    Loc:
    Gray, PA
    The white man has the same philosophy.......

    Don't pay your taxes for a couple years and see if you REALLY "own" your land!
     
  8. Risser09

    Risser09
    New Member

    Jun 26, 2008
    179
    0
    Loc:
    Lancaster, Pennsylvania
    Look at you, Mr. Hot Shot with all his land. You should learn to share the wealth with us poor folk!

    Seriously though, I couldn't agree with you more. My family owns(ed) 100+ acre wooded properties with ponds/lakes etc. It becomes a royal PITA when self-entitled people feel they have the right to fish/hunt/trap (or in this case cut firewood) whenever/wherever they want. Kinda makes ya feel real shitty inside after spending so many hours painting and hanging bright fluorescent signs that say PRIVATE PROPERTY on every damn tree. I guess some parents just can't teach their children to respect other people's property.
     
  9. sapratt

    sapratt
    Feeling the Heat

    May 14, 2008
    394
    0
    Loc:
    Northwestern, Oh
    Maybe some high voltage electric fence will keep them out.
     
  10. jdemaris

    jdemaris
    New Member

    Oct 11, 2008
    452
    0
    Loc:
    Central New York State
    I wish it worked that way. I've got land up in Jefferson County NY that gets driven through, all winter and summer by four wheeled ATVs and snowmobiles. I was told by my insurance agent that - if I fence it - and someone crashes into the fence and gets hurt - I'm liable, regardless of how many posted signs I have.
     
  11. Tony H

    Tony H
    New Member

    Oct 24, 2007
    1,156
    1
    Loc:
    N Illinois
    You could do what a buddy of mine did and take and push / dump dirt push over (not cut) a tree or put some brush over the trail at places near where it enters the property. The lawyer said as long as it's not a "man-made" structure you are unlikely to be sued
    anyway it stopped the 4 wheelers from driving thru the area with no legal problems.
     
  12. wellbuilt home

    wellbuilt home
    Minister of Fire

    Jul 6, 2008
    532
    0
    Loc:
    NY
    I under stand where you are coming from . We are talking about two different things here . Your property is getting defaced . I would never dream of running my loader into someones property . I'm not leaving any trace , and in 4 years the wood will be dust . You guys have turned my way of thinking and I'm sorry i brought it up. John I did find some good 18" white oak to day to top off my pile . The people where happy to get ride of it .
     
  13. leaf4952

    leaf4952
    Member

    Dec 1, 2007
    113
    1
    Loc:
    The Pocono Mountains upper plateau area, PA
    SHEEEET ! Man if I was YOU and gone thru all THAT I'd definately be carrying a gun on my property ! and posting alot of no trespassing signs around the perimeters. But ya really can't do that with 100 acres. How bout appointed one trusted local man you'd give favor to (he may use your land for a few very specific things you say are ok) in trade for being a watchdog over your property when you are absent ? That way he'll feel protective over YOUR land cause he's getting something out of it. How's that for an idea ?
     
  14. CowboyAndy

    CowboyAndy
    New Member

    Feb 29, 2008
    744
    0
    Loc:
    Chateaugay, NY
    My family owns 200 acres of woods, and all the time we will be out cutting and see some stuff that has been recently cut that was not done by us. If we were to catch them, they would probably have a 12 gauge wound to the ass.
     
  15. firefighterjake

    firefighterjake
    Minister of Fire

    Jul 22, 2008
    17,140
    3,582
    Loc:
    Unity/Bangor, Maine
    As an avid ATVer and sledder I have to tell you that it ticks me off to no end when rogue riders blatantly disregard posted land . . . and sometimes even ride right around fences even. To me there are few things worse in terms of discouraging landowners to open up additional trails on their land at a future date . . . rogue riders ruin it for the responsible riders.

    On our ATV trail system one landowner has only asked that riders stay out of his gravel pit as this is an active pit and he is concerned about them getting hurt . . . I cannot tell you how many signs have been knocked down, how many times folks have ridden over or around the rocks/wood/gravel we've piled up to block the trail-side entry to the pit and a few years back someone even shot out his bucket loader's windows -- arrgh . . . ticks me off to no end. Sorry . . . just venting. I feel for you.
     
  16. firefighterjake

    firefighterjake
    Minister of Fire

    Jul 22, 2008
    17,140
    3,582
    Loc:
    Unity/Bangor, Maine
    Wellbuilt . . . there's hope for you yet. ;) :) Actually, it's encouraging to hear how you have been able to see the other side of things . . . and don't be sorry for bringing up this topic . . . there are a lot of new woodburners and learning what is right and what is wrong when it comes to getting wood is part of the learning curve . . . I would rather you come here and post this thread and learn why taking wood from another person's property is wrong now . . . than to end up on the wrong side of a shotgun or in court at a later date.

    And in looking on the positive side . . . it sounds as though you're finding some good sources for free wood by simply asking folks. Good luck with the wood burning.
     
  17. jdemaris

    jdemaris
    New Member

    Oct 11, 2008
    452
    0
    Loc:
    Central New York State
    Already did. Not sure about how "trusted" he is, but at this point, I figure it can't hurt. The guy I mentioned, that I caught cutting my trees along with his two teenage kids? Ends up, a year later he bought the 50 arce parcel next to mine - and - he lives in that general area. I'm 200 miles away and don't get there often. I gave him and his kids exclusive rights to hunt deer on my land with the agreement that they cannot cut trees and also - they have "power of me" to throw anyone else off. He's got a camp up there and stays alot in all four seasons - hunting, fishing, ATVing and snowmobiling. I guess - if "you can't beat them", "join them." He's got my phone # and I asked that he call if he ever seens anything funny. Not sure if he ever will, but what the heck. It takes us over four hours, one way to drive there. Since our latest little kid was born, it's just too long a drive for a one-way trip. Subsequently, we haven't been there in two years now. For all I know, it's been clear-cut. We keep it because taxes are very low (unusual for NY) and it's sort of our private wildlife refuge. Loaded with deer, brook trout, frogs, beaver, etc. - that is - unless someone has fished and trapped it out since out last visit. I'll also add, that with t his one particular parcel, my wife and I consider it our "wedding present." Around 15 years ago, when we got married, at home, in our barn - my wife's parents gave us a wedding gift of $10,000.
    That because they were so happy we got marrried at home and didn't waste money on a fancy wedding (my 2nd marriage but her 1st). Instead of paying bills, we wanted to buy something that would last awhile. So - we bought this forest on the great "Tug Hill Plateau" of New York for $100 per acre. Pretty good deal - try to find something that cheap now.

    Here's some photos. The one photo of the road is the one the logger built illegally. The picture of my 85 diesel Chevy Blazer is one of many such photos of having to drive through newly build beaver ponds on our land. Nice thing about having all diesel trucks is - I don't worry about the ignition getting wet. We've driven in some pretty deep ponds.

    The Tug Hill Plateau is kind of an unsual area in New York. Very rural and high - yet since it's huge flat-top plateau, you don't realize how high you are until you get to and end of it and look down. It gets some of the highest snowfall in this part of the country due to lake effect snow from Lake Ontario. A few years back, they had a 12 foot snowstorm that lasted 14 days. Subsequently, it's a big snowmobiling place in the winter, and ATV place in the summer - there are miles and miles of dirt roads going through private, state, county, and federal woodlands.
     

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  18. wellbuilt home

    wellbuilt home
    Minister of Fire

    Jul 6, 2008
    532
    0
    Loc:
    NY


    Jake thanks for the encouragement I never looked at it that way . and now i do . Its feast or fa min for me when i have wood i just want to get ride of it . When i have t time for it i don't have any wood to split . John
     
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