Englander 25 ep overfeeding even on LFF 1

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bcastine1

New Member
Oct 28, 2018
3
New Hampshire
Little background with my stove.
Recently the coil on the auger motor melted. Thinking the windings had just broken down overtime i simply replaced the auger motor and the control board fuse which had blown.
Replaced motor and was well for about 3 hrs. Then my smoke alarm went off, along with the tell tale sign of burnt electronics and a bunch of smoke This time the coil was on fire, stove fuse had popped again as it should. At this point I know i have a bigger problems with the stove.
I am an Electronics tech by trade which means I know just enough to be dangerous so I began reverse engineering the control board since no schematic seems to exist for it. I quickly troubleshot the problem to a bad transistor in the upper auger control circuit. The transistor was leaking 30 volts when it should be at zero(when the auger shouldn't be turning) This type of motor on the auger motor will always try to draw 50 or so watts when it sees any voltage. So when it is receiving 120v. it draws approx. ..42 amps(normal), when it was seeing 30 volts it was drawing in excess of 1.6 amps on my Fluke! The windings had no chance.
So with nothing to loose, I swapped the bad transistor out with the transistor for the lower auger motor(which is an unused circuit in this stove) same transistor part #. I also installed a 1 AMP buss fuse in series with the yellow wire to the auger motor to prevent the samething from happening again. I highly recommend doing this! Not just for to prevent you auger motor from spontanous combustion, but it will save your auger motor if the tranisistor fails. Combustion of the coil smells awful, and is surely horrible for your health to inhale the fumes. On the brite side, I haven't come across a similer instance on the internet to what happened to me.
Anyways, put it all back to work and all seems well with one exception. The dead time between the auger turning seems to be to short. With Low fuel feed on 1, and the heat setting of 1 the stove operates like its on 5-7 heat setting. In fact with heat setting of 1, 5 fan setting after about 30 minutes the stove will automatically go to a 9 fan setting(still indicates 5 on the control board), it will after 10 or so minutes return to the 5 setting speed. Lower buttons are set 1-4-1, likely 1-6-1 would work even better.
The heat setting adjustments work, the duration of the auger motor turning is longer with a higher heat setting same dead time. The LFF setting seems to make a difference. LFF on 1, heat setting 1 the auger turns for approx 2 seconds, with approx. 5 seconds of dead time. The 5 seconds of dead time is my problem, it is far to short.
The problem has nothing to do with thermostat mode, ive tried both modes, just because, jumper is installed as the stove is not used in thermostat mode.
I know I likely I need a new control board, possibly the transistor failing did something to the IC in the timing circuit of the auger motor. I don't have the time to to source the parts and replace them. So I just wanted to make sure I didn't miss anything, or if there was a sensor that talked to the board and would adjust auger down time etc. Also the auger operation is the same during start up and operate, in fact it over fills the burn pot on start up. $300 for a new board is a tuff pill to swallow for what it is.
 
It would help to know the make and model ,and year of your stove .
 
Just a guess, but you said you replaced the auger motor. Did you get one with the correct RPM?

Eric
 
Actually a second thought... If you grabbed it from the "other" auger motor, you may be feeding it too fast. The augers in the 25EP is a 2RPM motor but in the 2 auger stoves (25PDV, etc) those are 1 RPM. So, you could be inadvertently overfeeding it.

Eric
 
Im betting that when the resistor went tango uniform. That same 30volt leak had an adverse effect on you ic chip. I had a similar situation with my old 25pdvc, and i had to get a new prom and 4 triacs and optoisolaters. Now all ESW stoves use the same control board but the do change the programming in the prom for each model. Those proms are no longer sold separately (probably my fault). They spent 80 bucks shipping me jumper shunts instead of proms, till Mike holten went out and packed it himself.
 
Your problem is obviously worse than what I experienced and caused by something else, but I thought I'd mention one additional thing.

I also have a 25-EP that I've been using for many years. When I finally had to replaced my auger motor last year, I started getting somewhat too much feed. When my thermostat put it into low mode was like 2 or 3 used to be and running on number 3 was like at least 5 used to be with flame all over the top plate, and caused the blower to jump to 9 a few times per hour unless I kept the blower on 6 with heat setting 3. I'd prefer less noise.

For me it was the new auger motor that caused the problem. The original auger motor was 2.0 RPM and it seems the new CU-047042 motors supplied by Englander and elsewhere are now 2.4 RPM. Now .4 doesn't seem like much, but it's 20% more so with 9 heat settings each one is nearly 2 settings higher as far as feed rate is concerned. That wouldn't be a problem if the stove had an adjustable feed gate in the hopper like many others do, but it doesn't so there is absolutely no adjustment that can be made to the feed rate except for the 3 buttons on the bottom and those only change settings 1 and 2. Not to mention that the default setting is 1, so I can't go any lower.

It made thermostat hi/low mode pretty useless since dropping to low was still pretty hot. This year I replaced the auger motor again, making sure to find a 2.0 RPM and now the stove is back to where it should be. Just enough to keep the stove on when the thermostat drops it to 1 and not overheating on 3. The EP-25 has been great, but I really wish they included a way to fine tune the feed with a hopper gate or something. It would come in handy for various size pellets too.

Ray
 
I just went ahead and ordered a 1 rpm auger motor. I verified my current operational auger motor is exactly 2 rpm. I then did a 15min. cycle of turning the auger off every 15 seconds,then let it do its thing for 15 seconds simulating a 1 rpm motor and the burn was where it should be. I am also burning about 2x as many pellets as i was before this entire fiasco began. I took the original auger motor (which was a PU-047042) MK brand so it SHOULD be a 2 rpm, took the 2nd one(the one that caught on fire) a PU-047042 Gleason Avery which is the exact part that is in the stove now and rotated the motor end 200x. The output shaft on the original appeared to move half as far. So for whatever reason I believe my 2011 Englander 25EP wants to be fed by a 1 rpm motor. Makes no sense, all i know is its sucking down the pellets with a 2rpm motor, about 2+ bags a day(have tried 3 different brands) on 1 heat setting with the LFF at 1. At least the house is warm, could be worse lol. I will report back with the results after i receive and install the 1 rpm motor.