kerosene to start a cat stove?

[greenie]

I've been heating with wood for over 30 years, and a master oil burner tech so please no safety tips. On a stone cold stove, I use a little kerosene on some left over charcoal to start the stove again. My question is will this practice damage the catalyst if the bypass is open? It's getting difficult to find a sheet of newspaper with no color (color inks are said to damage the cat), plus the kerosene (half a shot glass at most) gets the stove going quickly.
Question: Safety issues aside, will kerosene used to start a fire damage the catalyst?

 

[daleeper]

Ask the mfg. of the combustor. I doubt that you will get an answer though for liability reasons.

Bottom of page is a contact link.

http://www.sud-chemie.com/scmcms/web/page_en_7529.htm

Applied ceramics contact information:

http://firecatcombustors.com/contact.htm

I don't mind spending a little bit for firestarters that are safe for cats, as I don't have to start one from cold very often. The SuperCedars work great, and the guy that makes them posts here. I have used Meeco's with good luck also.

Good luck getting an answer, and welcome to the Hearth.

 

[Backwoods Savage]

Some old habits seem to die hard. If you are asking the question, that indicates you have some concern of doing this. Would it not be simple and easy to just create a different habit and let that old one die? (See, no safety words.)

 

[greenie]

Ask the mfg. of the combustor. I doubt that you will get an answer though for liability reasons.

Bottom of page is a contact link.

http://www.sud-chemie.com/scmcms/web/page_en_7529.htm

Applied ceramics contact information:

http://firecatcombustors.com/contact.htm

I don't mind spending a little bit for firestarters that are safe for cats, as I don't have to start one from cold very often. The SuperCedars work great, and the guy that makes them posts here. I have used Meeco's with good luck also.

Good luck getting an answer, and welcome to the Hearth.

Thanx for the welcome.

 

[begreen]

Greetings greenie, can you add your stove make and model to your signature?

I think you will find that there isn't a stove maker out there that would endorse using kerosene for starting a fire. But there are many that have strong statements prohibiting it. Be safe.

Check with your newspaper company about their inks. Most new presses are running soy based inks, even for color. I think they are safe. It's the older style inks and metallic inks that should be avoided.

 

[Battenkiller]

You're gonna get serious negs from the manufacturers, but that's likely because they haven't tested it and really don't know. My gut is that kerosene and the paraffin that is in most firestarters are going to produce the same types of byproducts. There's a lot more petrol-based hydrocarbons in a SuperCedar than there is in a half shot of kero, so my feeling is that it's probably at least as safe for the cat as the firestarters are, prolly even cleaner burning. Sounds like you know what you're doing, just don't mention it to the manufacturer if the cat craps on you, they'll blame the kero for sure.

 

[greenie]

Greetings greenie, can you add your stove make and model to your signature?

Just did - thanx for the reminder

 

[begreen]

The Sierra manual is pretty unambiguous here.

 

[Battenkiller]

The Sierra manual is pretty unambiguous here.

The OP posed a question in regard to kerosene damaging the cat. I really don't think that warning has anything to do with the cat, but rather, is a general safety precaution. "Keep all such materials well away from the stove while it is in use" has nothing to do with what goes on inside a stove. It is obviously a safety warning, something the OP specifically requested not to receive. I won't comment on the wisdom of putting flammable liquids into an open stove except to say there are better ways for me, but if those substances "or ANY such product" can damage a catalytic combustor, I'm quite sure those wax-based firestarters have no place in a cat stove either.

 

[North of 60]

What ever happened to just a match. If your wood is dry, which it should be, then there is no need for anything else.

EDIT:I am an A gas fitter by the way. AND I dont use a torch. :lol:
Welcome to the forum.

 

[begreen]

The Sierra manual is pretty unambiguous here.

I won't comment on the wisdom of putting flammable liquids into an open stove except to say there are better ways for me, but if those substances "or ANY such product" can damage a catalytic combustor, I'm quite sure those wax-based firestarters have no place in a cat stove either.

I think Blaze Kings ship with SuperCedars.

 

[BrotherBart]

Tom had an independent agency test Super Cedars in cat stoves. The results are on his website. I just checked and didn't find comparable information on Exxon's site for kero.

 

[Battenkiller]

Tom had an independent agency test Super Cedars in cat stoves. The results are on his website. I just checked and didn't find comparable information on Exxon's site for kero.

Funny guys.

Let's ask the cat stove makers if they independently tested for methanol, ethanol, formaldehyde, acetaldehyde, cresol, creosol, diacetyl, acetone, formic acid, acetic acid, and a whole host of ols, hydes, yls and cids that burning wood creates. Kero will burn cleanly without forming any of these things - just CO2, H2O and a tiny bit of soot, perhaps. Maybe they should stick to burning petrol products and avoid the wood entirely. Never heard of any of them poisoning an automobile cat.

 

[Battenkiller]

Just to set the record straight, I am neither advocating putting kerosene (or any flammable liquid) into a wood stove, nor am I implying that there is anything wrong with using SuperCedars or any other manufactured or homemade firestarters in cat stoves.

Myself, I thing they would actually work better than a liquid because they will provide a long burn with a lot of flame. Even a quarter of a SC burns for a long time. It easier, less messy, and safer for 99% of stove owners. Old habits do die hard. As long as you don't end up being a crispy critter in the headlines, everything's cool IMO, but there are passable methods and there are exceptional methods. Using a very small amount of kero to start a fire in a cold stove may be passable if done correctly, but using specially made firestarters is exceptional.

Send a request to SuperCedar and they will send you a couple to try. Break them into quarters and you will have eight cold fires to make up your mind which way is better. Bet I know which way you'll decide.

 

[vvvv]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paraffin

 

[NWfuel]

The Sierra manual is pretty unambiguous here.

The OP posed a question in regard to kerosene damaging the cat. I really don't think that warning has anything to do with the cat, but rather, is a general safety precaution. "Keep all such materials well away from the stove while it is in use" has nothing to do with what goes on inside a stove. It is obviously a safety warning, something the OP specifically requested not to receive. I won't comment on the wisdom of putting flammable liquids into an open stove except to say there are better ways for me, but if those substances "or ANY such product" can damage a catalytic combustor, I'm quite sure those wax-based firestarters have no place in a cat stove either.

Super Cedar is approved for use in Cat stoves. Blaze King includes one with every Cat stove they sell. The Sud Chemie Co. which manufacturers the combusters did the tests which can be viewed at www.supercedar.com. It states that it actually prolongs the life of the combuster. It reaches light off quicker which is the reason. They did tell me it is the only paraffin based firestarter they have approved of many that have been tested.
Thomas

 

[greenie]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paraffin

Thanks, that was the answer I was looking for. Fire departments and stove manufacturers warn against using liquid fuel to start wood stoves because common sense is in short supply these days. Adding even a shot glass of kerosene to a stove with hot coals will cause an explosion (TWA Flight 800 - jet A in an empty tank) Then there's the person that uses coleman fuel not realizing that coleman fuel is white gasoline and not kerosene. It's easier to give blanket "no liquid fuel advice" than it is to explain how to do it safely.
My question was whether the fuel would harm the catalyst, and I appreciate the responses and the concern for my well being

 

[Battenkiller]

They did tell me it is the only paraffin based firestarter they have approved of many that have been tested.

Again, Thomas, I did not mean to imply that your firestarters are unsafe to use, merely that kerosene will burn a lot faster and with a lot less soot at the same temperatures because it is composed of shorter length hydrocarbon chains. There is nothing scientific I can think of about kerosene that would lead me to believe it would harm a cat stove since it will burn into the same byproducts as will paraffin when it burns. That was the original question - will burning kero harm a cat combustor? I was only using the wax-based starters to make a comparison. Obviously to me, they will be just as safe to a combustor as kerosene would be.

But now I gotta ask. What did you do to your product that makes is pass an independent test where other similar products fail? Is it a special grade of wax you use, or is it the other junk that may be in a competitors product? Is the formula a serendipitous discovery you stumbled upon or did you submit numerous versions with different components for testing? Most importantly, do folks at home making their own starters out of wax and sawdust risk causing irreparable damage to their stoves? If so, we better get the word out, because there are an awful lots of folks here making their own firestarters.

 

[NWfuel]

They did tell me it is the only paraffin based firestarter they have approved of many that have been tested.

Again, Thomas, I did not mean to imply that your firestarters are unsafe to use, merely that kerosene will burn a lot faster and with a lot less soot at the same temperatures because it is composed of shorter length hydrocarbon chains. There is nothing scientific I can think of about kerosene that would lead me to believe it would harm a cat stove since it will burn into the same byproducts as will paraffin when it burns. That was the original question - will burning kero harm a cat combustor? I was only using the wax-based starters to make a comparison. Obviously to me, they will be just as safe to a combustor as kerosene would be.

But now I gotta ask. What did you do to your product that makes is pass an independent test where other similar products fail? Is it a special grade of wax you use, or is it the other junk that may be in a competitors product? Is the formula a serendipitous discovery you stumbled upon or did you submit numerous versions with different components for testing? Most importantly, do folks at home making their own starters out of wax and sawdust risk causing irreparable damage to their stoves? If so, we better get the word out, because there are an awful lots of folks here making their own firestarters.

We do use a highly refined paraffin where the larger companies use a slack wax. Our unique process combines a smaller percentage of this paraffin which enables out product to be oxygen rich therefore starting faster and burning cleaner. The machine I built produces 1300 per hour and performs best when the Cedar shavings/sawdust are sized to our specs along with the properly proportioned paraffin. The paraffin costs are around $1.30 per lb so that was my concern when developing the product. Use as little as possible and still have a product that will stay together. In the end it also helps to keep shipping costs down. I will admit I have been lucky from my early attempts at manufacturing the Super Cedar but in no way has it been a walk in the park. I developed the product back in 1978 before firestarters were commercialized and had a hell of a time convincing retailers to buy it. I waited 10 years for larger companies to come out with theirs and to create a market for firestarters. I realized I had the best one and started riding their coat tails which I am still riding by the way.