More Follow up from Stihl dealer re: fuel

[laynes69]

No. Something about alcohol and water destroying the interiors. The little ports inside were corroded. I'm now running star tron fuel enzyme to see if this problem goes away. Some have recommended leaving fuel in for storage to keep things wet and others recommend dry. I would run it out of fuel and store it over the winter dry.

 

[wkpoor]

Another great thing about AvGas is you never have to drain fuel. I can let saws sit for a year or more and it will start and run like I just poured fuel in it for the first time. If it does sit long enough to evap all the fuel it leaves nothing behind. Clean as laquer thinner.

 

[smokinj]

No. Something about alcohol and water destroying the interiors. The little ports inside were corroded. I'm now running star tron fuel enzyme to see if this problem goes away. Some have recommended leaving fuel in for storage to keep things wet and others recommend dry. I would run it out of fuel and store it over the winter dry.

I will be looking for the av gas. 460 192t and 880 all out of warranty! 460 and 880 you can always bet there empty.

 

[Corey]

I bought a stihl fs55 trimmer 2 years ago and it wouldn't prime this year. Ended up I needed a new carb from stihl and they said 19 out of 20 needed replaced. From what they showed me the fuel was corroding and eating the insides of the carbs. I'm now running a special stabilizer they recommended to try and stop the problems. There's no reason why after 2 years it should have happened. Either it's the fuel or a direct issue that stihl doesn't want to address. Luckily the carb was only 25.00 and now it runs better than when new. Still I wasn't happy. I paid for something I figured wouldn't give me problems and it has been one of biggest pieces I have owned.

Are you leaving fuel in or when storing or not?

No. Something about alcohol and water destroying the interiors...

Interesting you mention continual draining. I have not drained the fuel from anything I can ever think of in recent memory and also have not had any fuel related failure. This is over a whole range of small engines...leaf blower, weed eater, chain saw, lawn mower, wood splitter, jet ski's, etc.

The one thing I can think of which would come close is my 1996 Sea Doo jet ski. For the first couple years after I purchased it, I did the whole winterizing bit, fog engine, drain fuel, remove plugs, etc. In 1998 I moved into a house with a garage which stayed relatively warm, so all I did was fog the engine and put the battery on a tender. This basically continued until last summer, when after 15 years of service and at least 10 years on E10, I rebuilt the carbs on account of the fuel pump reed valves leaking slightly and the pencil-eraser sized internal fuel filters getting clogged with debris. The carbs basically looked fine inside with only the tiniest amount of white powder in some corners of the casting. It brushed away easily with a shot of carb cleaner and a toothbrush...and this is the dreaded 'E10 in a boat'...and a two-stroke at that. I don't really classify this as a failure, and certainly not due to any E10 fuel. I think reed valves are bound to wear out over 1-1/2 decades of service and a fuel filter smaller than a thimble is bound to get clogged over that time period as well.

Don't know if Stihl is cheaping out on the carbs or what. The jet ski appeared to be simple anodized cast aluminum which is not the most expensive material out there. But I would almost wonder if draining the carb allows seals to dry out and moist air to enter more so than just keeping it full of fuel?

smokinjay - I'll post updates of any progress on an E85 saw - success or failure - as long as it's the truth about what happens. I've been looking at an E85 compatible 2-stroke oil for a while now and started browsing craigslist for a moderate-cheap saw and hopefully one which might be easy to bump compression on. Somehow, cutting wood with whiskey just seems 'neat'!

 

[smokinj]

I bought a stihl fs55 trimmer 2 years ago and it wouldn't prime this year. Ended up I needed a new carb from stihl and they said 19 out of 20 needed replaced. From what they showed me the fuel was corroding and eating the insides of the carbs. I'm now running a special stabilizer they recommended to try and stop the problems. There's no reason why after 2 years it should have happened. Either it's the fuel or a direct issue that stihl doesn't want to address. Luckily the carb was only 25.00 and now it runs better than when new. Still I wasn't happy. I paid for something I figured wouldn't give me problems and it has been one of biggest pieces I have owned.

Are you leaving fuel in or when storing or not?

No. Something about alcohol and water destroying the interiors...

Interesting you mention continual draining. I have not drained the fuel from anything I can ever think of in recent memory and also have not had any fuel related failure. This is over a whole range of small engines...leaf blower, weed eater, chain saw, lawn mower, wood splitter, jet ski's, etc.

The one thing I can think of which would come close is my 1996 Sea Doo jet ski. For the first couple years after I purchased it, I did the whole winterizing bit, fog engine, drain fuel, remove plugs, etc. In 1998 I moved into a house with a garage which stayed relatively warm, so all I did was fog the engine and put the battery on a tender. This basically continued until last summer, when after 15 years of service and at least 10 years on E10, I rebuilt the carbs on account of the fuel pump reed valves leaking slightly and the pencil-eraser sized internal fuel filters getting clogged with debris. The carbs basically looked fine inside with only the tiniest amount of white powder in some corners of the casting. It brushed away easily with a shot of carb cleaner and a toothbrush...and this is the dreaded 'E10 in a boat'...and a two-stroke at that. I don't really classify this as a failure, and certainly not due to any E10 fuel. I think reed valves are bound to wear out over 1-1/2 decades of service and a fuel filter smaller than a thimble is bound to get clogged over that time period as well.

Don't know if Stihl is cheaping out on the carbs or what. The jet ski appeared to be simple anodized cast aluminum which is not the most expensive material out there. But I would almost wonder if draining the carb allows seals to dry out and moist air to enter more so than just keeping it full of fuel?

smokinjay - I'll post updates of any progress on an E85 saw - success or failure - as long as it's the truth about what happens. I've been looking at an E85 compatible 2-stroke oil for a while now and started browsing craigslist for a moderate-cheap saw and hopefully one which might be easy to bump compression on. Somehow, cutting wood with whiskey just seems 'neat'!

This would be cool. I have a cheep mac but its hard to keep running on regular gas so that would be a very good test. Wild thing cheep should do the job.

 

[laynes69]

I guess stihl bought out a company for their carbs. The old carbs were 65.00 and the new ones 25.00. From what I was told the new carbs have an epoxy sealant inside them for the welsh plugs. Guessing it's to stop deterioration from the fuel. The fuel additive I bought is supposed to keep the fuel fresh for 2 years. What stihl recommended was the additive in the fuel and to run a little premixed fuel in a can through it till it's dry. Like I say it's been a toss up to store dry or wet. Its just my saws or trimmer won't run right on fuel that's more than a month old. Maybe the additive will help. Not sure where to find the other fuel talked about on here.

 

[smokinj]

I guess stihl bought out a company for their carbs. The old carbs were 65.00 and the new ones 25.00. From what I was told the new carbs have an epoxy sealant inside them for the welsh plugs. Guessing it's to stop deterioration from the fuel. The fuel additive I bought is supposed to keep the fuel fresh for 2 years. What stihl recommended was the additive in the fuel and to run a little premixed fuel in a can through it till it's dry. Like I say it's been a toss up to store dry or wet. Its just my saws or trimmer won't run right on fuel that's more than a month old. Maybe the additive will help. Not sure where to find the other fuel talked about on here.

Any small airport.

 

[woodsmaster]

I emailed some follow up questions to my friend, the Stihl dealer in Dallas. Below is my email to him followed by his reply:

Matt, I have a couple of follow up questions for you.
A lot of guys in the forums are using 100LL av gas, which does not have ethanol and is high octane. At $5.65 or so a gallon, it's costly but since a two gallon can will last me for many months the cost isn't much of a factor and I figure it is much better for the long term health of my 390. What do you think?

Stabil now makes a gas additive that supposedly neutralizes the bad effects of ethanol. What's your take on such additives? Does Stihl have a policy on additives?

Thanks,
Ken

Ken,

I would stick with Stihl’s recommendations on fuel. If you use the Stihl oil the additive is not necessary. Stihl’s oil is formulated with a stabilizer in it. The 10% ethanol is fine. The bigger problem is letting the fuel get too old or store it in a container that is not sealed properly.



We do have a product called Motomix. It is premix fuel for handheld equipment with no ethanol. It is 92 octane and mixed with the Stihl Ultra Synthetic oil. Shelf life after opening is about 2 years. Works great for someone who doesn’t use much fuel and it is a much better fuel than pump gas.

It sells at most Stihl dealers for 8.99/quart.

Matt

I can't believe they sell fuel for 8.99 / qt. I could buy a few saws with the money saved using the cheap stuff. Havn't had any fuel related problems on a 5 year old saw.

 

[smokinj]

I emailed some follow up questions to my friend, the Stihl dealer in Dallas. Below is my email to him followed by his reply:

Matt, I have a couple of follow up questions for you.
A lot of guys in the forums are using 100LL av gas, which does not have ethanol and is high octane. At $5.65 or so a gallon, it's costly but since a two gallon can will last me for many months the cost isn't much of a factor and I figure it is much better for the long term health of my 390. What do you think?

Stabil now makes a gas additive that supposedly neutralizes the bad effects of ethanol. What's your take on such additives? Does Stihl have a policy on additives?

Thanks,
Ken

Ken,

I would stick with Stihl’s recommendations on fuel. If you use the Stihl oil the additive is not necessary. Stihl’s oil is formulated with a stabilizer in it. The 10% ethanol is fine. The bigger problem is letting the fuel get too old or store it in a container that is not sealed properly.



We do have a product called Motomix. It is premix fuel for handheld equipment with no ethanol. It is 92 octane and mixed with the Stihl Ultra Synthetic oil. Shelf life after opening is about 2 years. Works great for someone who doesn’t use much fuel and it is a much better fuel than pump gas.

It sells at most Stihl dealers for 8.99/quart.

Matt

I can't believe they sell fuel for 8.99 / qt. I could buy a few saws with the money saved using the cheap stuff. Havn't had any fuel related problems on a 5 year old saw.

Its not the past 5 years that has everyone worried. Its when the 15 percent hits the pumps is the issue.