I have finally decided on a stove and now there seems to be a problem with location.Two dealer have come out and saw no problem with the location I have picked.The third whom I am buying the stove from said I cant install a stove where I have picked to install. There is a window and he said you have to be 18 inches away from a window there is 28 inches from the bottom of the window sill to the floor. Couldnt he go thru the wall there? There are also my main heater and sewer stack running up the side of the house on the outside could that be a problem? Do you have to be so many feet from either of the stacks?He also quote me with about 10 feet of exhaust pipe? Also said it would be about 825 just to break thru the brick of my house(100 year old philadelphia soft red brick) he said it would take the better part of the day for two men?The install is going to be 4500 for a floor model pc-45. 2700 stove,825 break thru brick,the rest for pipe? That seems high,I saw on line Simpson duravent kit for about 350? Just wondering about opinions on this? Tried to upload photo it was too big...Lisa
new install tricky
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Lisa, the installer who has a problem with the location may or may not be correct......it may have to do with whether it's a "working" window (one that you can open).
These are the guidelines for installation near a window:
Minimum 4' clearance below or beside any door or window that opens
Minimum 1’ clearance below or beside any window that does not open.
Minimum 1' clearance above any door or window that opens
These are the guidelines for installation near a window:
Minimum 4' clearance below or beside any door or window that opens
Minimum 1’ clearance below or beside any window that does not open.
Minimum 1' clearance above any door or window that opens
If you can post some pictures or a diagram as to where the exhaust pipe will come out the dealer may be correct. You can also call you local codes office to find out what restrictions they have around windows. What imacman has posted is pretty standard and for your own good.
I've cut through cinder block and it did take several hours to swiss chess and chisel the hole from inside and out, so I would guess real brick would take a similar amount of time. If 825 is his total labor that doesn't sound too bad.
With regards to the pipe Duravent PelletVent is the lowest cost and problematic due to leaking. The local dealers around here don't even use it so they don't don't have to come back. So around here you're paying for Duravent PelletVent Pro or ICC Excel - both have premium costs. The dealer could also be quoting 4" which will make the price higher as well. You mentioned a sewer stack. Is this a basement install? If so, you generally need more pipe than usual, futher increasing your cost. Post what type of pipe and size you were quoted.
I've cut through cinder block and it did take several hours to swiss chess and chisel the hole from inside and out, so I would guess real brick would take a similar amount of time. If 825 is his total labor that doesn't sound too bad.
With regards to the pipe Duravent PelletVent is the lowest cost and problematic due to leaking. The local dealers around here don't even use it so they don't don't have to come back. So around here you're paying for Duravent PelletVent Pro or ICC Excel - both have premium costs. The dealer could also be quoting 4" which will make the price higher as well. You mentioned a sewer stack. Is this a basement install? If so, you generally need more pipe than usual, futher increasing your cost. Post what type of pipe and size you were quoted.
This is the ouside view and the inside view. The window never opens.The airconditioner is never removed it weighs a ton...The bottom of the window sill to the floor is 28 inches.The wall is 57 inches from side of window. However to right u can see doorway that leads to kitchen,so area to break out is just where airconditioner is located...maybe the last guys right. I also wanted to know where to go for permits and inspections? They must be in place before any work begins correct? As you can see I live in a row home and want to have the exhaust on my property,not in the breezeway between myself and the church next door.Please let me know what you think...Lisa
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I think the last installer is correct too....that area is just too "tight" to install a stove. I don't think you'll have the proper clearances for the pipe, or even inside for the stove for that matter.
Is that the only place you can put it?
Is that the only place you can put it?
Forgot to mention..the stove would be where the hutch is pictured. Will be getting rid of that piece of furniture.I live in the city so I really want the exhaust on my property?
Hi Lisa,
The installer that you picked is correct about not being able to put the stove where you want. The clearances are just not there. That 28 inches is already chewed up by the fact the vent pipe is at least 4" OD, has to be going slightly upward and the centerline of the the exhaust exit on the stove is going to be several inches (on my stove it is approximately 15") above the hearth which is going to be above the floor. Then if you just do a horizontal termination away from the outside wall with the A/C unit it is likely going to be closer than 4 feet from the other window in that third photograph. The A/C unit might also be considered an operable ventilation intake under the code.
Then as imacman has noted it also looks like the interior space isn't there as well.
I also am not certain about getting the exhaust from the stove to where you were planing on having it exit the house under the A/C unit.
There is just not enough information to suggest a possible placement.
Do you have the information on the stove that tells you the required clearances for installing the stove? While it isn't like a wood stove there are several very important clearance issues that can not be overlooked, that is the stove can't be placed against the walls nor too close to furniture. It also gets hot and shouldn't be close to where people might normally walk close to it.
The installer that you picked is correct about not being able to put the stove where you want. The clearances are just not there. That 28 inches is already chewed up by the fact the vent pipe is at least 4" OD, has to be going slightly upward and the centerline of the the exhaust exit on the stove is going to be several inches (on my stove it is approximately 15") above the hearth which is going to be above the floor. Then if you just do a horizontal termination away from the outside wall with the A/C unit it is likely going to be closer than 4 feet from the other window in that third photograph. The A/C unit might also be considered an operable ventilation intake under the code.
Then as imacman has noted it also looks like the interior space isn't there as well.
I also am not certain about getting the exhaust from the stove to where you were planing on having it exit the house under the A/C unit.
There is just not enough information to suggest a possible placement.
Do you have the information on the stove that tells you the required clearances for installing the stove? While it isn't like a wood stove there are several very important clearance issues that can not be overlooked, that is the stove can't be placed against the walls nor too close to furniture. It also gets hot and shouldn't be close to where people might normally walk close to it.
Wow that's a tight fit.
In your first pic I see a bare brick wall. What's wrong with exiting on that side? Is that an alleyway, driveway or something that you can't exit on that side?
In your first pic I see a bare brick wall. What's wrong with exiting on that side? Is that an alleyway, driveway or something that you can't exit on that side?
Well it looks like the installer I chose is correct, and thank you to all who responded.I am happy to at least have others agree with his opinion on where the stove should go for correct performance.I still can't help but wonder why the others would agree to install where i had chosen if incorrect? Thank you,I am so glad I joined this forum...Lisa
I think it shows just how precious few people there are out there doing a good job. Good help is hard to find.
Personally I'd schedule another visit with the installer and ask what other options they see. Their experience may easily spot an option you've missed.
Perhaps if the clearances are sufficient it would be OK to install on the church side...
Perhaps you could go straight up through the roof.
I had some windows to navigate around with my install but I found a way after studying the installation manual and checking with the building inspector... Here's a link to some of my figuring... https://www.hearth.com/econtent/index.php/forums/viewthread/19448/
Lisa,
Get the installation manual for the stove and cut out or tape together a mask the size of the stove + its clearances. That will tell you minimum interior room needed to place the stove, then you have to allow for the venting, as you have to be able to get from the stove and out of the house.
Usually you can download the installation manuals in PDF format from the stove manufactures website.
As cncpro has mentioned there may be other options that we have no way of knowing about, such as what is directly above the room you want to place the stove in? This isn't rocket science it just takes a lot of measuring. Something that is very hard for any of us to do from pictures alone.
There were only a couple of places in this house that would have worked going out through the walls but several more if I wanted to go up.
Get the installation manual for the stove and cut out or tape together a mask the size of the stove + its clearances. That will tell you minimum interior room needed to place the stove, then you have to allow for the venting, as you have to be able to get from the stove and out of the house.
Usually you can download the installation manuals in PDF format from the stove manufactures website.
As cncpro has mentioned there may be other options that we have no way of knowing about, such as what is directly above the room you want to place the stove in? This isn't rocket science it just takes a lot of measuring. Something that is very hard for any of us to do from pictures alone.
There were only a couple of places in this house that would have worked going out through the walls but several more if I wanted to go up.
The installer has agreed to come back out,thinking of going up maybe. That will however entail going thru a bedroom(I have a VERY small 2 bedroom house).
Would the pipe have to be boxed in in some way? I couldn't find that in any of the paperwork I have.The bedroom isn't actually used as a bedroom. It is where my computer is located.He will be here Tuesday. I sure am glad I started now,if I am going to get this finished by the end of the year.
Am I correct that I have to get a permit first,stating I am gettin a pellet stove.Then I build my hearth pad,get my stove installed. Then I have who inspect everything? Still have lots of questions.....
Would the pipe have to be boxed in in some way? I couldn't find that in any of the paperwork I have.The bedroom isn't actually used as a bedroom. It is where my computer is located.He will be here Tuesday. I sure am glad I started now,if I am going to get this finished by the end of the year.
Am I correct that I have to get a permit first,stating I am gettin a pellet stove.Then I build my hearth pad,get my stove installed. Then I have who inspect everything? Still have lots of questions.....
rufusmom said:
It seems to vary a bit from town to town or state to state but...
You need to start with your building inspector and your homeowner's insurance first. The inspector will give you a permit and answer any other questions you may have. Your insurance company may raise your rate (mine didn't) and they may have some paperwork for the building inspector... Not sure but in some areas maybe a fire department official has to inspect ?
if thats not a public walkway, and snow load wont obstruct flue, and if you removed the ac, and if you permanently sealed the window, and used outside air
i dont see why it couldn't fit...and the space inside looks possible.
some careful measuring, and a chat with your local building inspector are in order. see if the inspector can meet you and the installer on site...
its his interpratation of the manual that matters!
below is from avalon newport manual- cap requirements above grade? just says
"Must not be located where it will become plugged by snow or other material."
Minimum 4' clearance below or beside any door or window that opens (This clearance may be reduced to18” if using outside air (see page 10) – we recommend the door or window be kept closed during operation.
Minimum 1’ clearance below or beside any window that does not open.
Minimum 1' clearance above any door or window that opens
Minimum 2' clearance from any adjacent building
Minimum 7' clearance above any grade when adjacent to public walkways
NOTE: Vent may not terminate in covered walkway or breezeway.
Minimum 2' clearance above any grass, plants, or other combustible materialsMinimum 3' clearance from any forced air intake of any other appliance
Minimum 2' clearance below eaves or overhangsMinimum 1' clearance horizontally from combustible wall
Must be a minimum of 2' above the roof
i dont see why it couldn't fit...and the space inside looks possible.
some careful measuring, and a chat with your local building inspector are in order. see if the inspector can meet you and the installer on site...
its his interpratation of the manual that matters!
below is from avalon newport manual- cap requirements above grade? just says
"Must not be located where it will become plugged by snow or other material."
Minimum 4' clearance below or beside any door or window that opens (This clearance may be reduced to18” if using outside air (see page 10) – we recommend the door or window be kept closed during operation.
Minimum 1’ clearance below or beside any window that does not open.
Minimum 1' clearance above any door or window that opens
Minimum 2' clearance from any adjacent building
Minimum 7' clearance above any grade when adjacent to public walkways
NOTE: Vent may not terminate in covered walkway or breezeway.
Minimum 2' clearance above any grass, plants, or other combustible materialsMinimum 3' clearance from any forced air intake of any other appliance
Minimum 2' clearance below eaves or overhangsMinimum 1' clearance horizontally from combustible wall
Must be a minimum of 2' above the roof
Dave, I think that walkway is actually shared with the church next door which puts it off limits as far as Lisa is concerned.
I think that she has a very tight set of clearances that are going to get in the way, but you are correct it is what the inspector thinks the manual says and any more stringent regulations that the city has that will actually determine what can go where.
It isn't just where the vent will be as she wants that stove in a particular spot to the right of the current A/C where that hutch in the last picture is.
I think that she has a very tight set of clearances that are going to get in the way, but you are correct it is what the inspector thinks the manual says and any more stringent regulations that the city has that will actually determine what can go where.
It isn't just where the vent will be as she wants that stove in a particular spot to the right of the current A/C where that hutch in the last picture is.
Well the installer will be here tomorrow,possibly going up?
The walkway in the picture above is actually where I want the stove vented. I wouldn't have a problem sealing the window,however the airconditioner must stay.The spot this installer wants to install is actually to the right of the hutch on a wall that runs the full length of my home.That is where the church is located and between the church and my home is a gated breezeway? It looks as though in fact a long time ago there was a house there. The reason I don't want to install there is because I wouldn't have acces to the exhaust and I wouldn't be able to clean it. Also there are often kids running thru this area,they climb the 6ft fence.Nothing is set in stone on my end except the fact I would like the exhaust on my property. The table and chairs and the hutch are going to be removed when the stove is installed so there should be enough room....
The walkway in the picture above is actually where I want the stove vented. I wouldn't have a problem sealing the window,however the airconditioner must stay.The spot this installer wants to install is actually to the right of the hutch on a wall that runs the full length of my home.That is where the church is located and between the church and my home is a gated breezeway? It looks as though in fact a long time ago there was a house there. The reason I don't want to install there is because I wouldn't have acces to the exhaust and I wouldn't be able to clean it. Also there are often kids running thru this area,they climb the 6ft fence.Nothing is set in stone on my end except the fact I would like the exhaust on my property. The table and chairs and the hutch are going to be removed when the stove is installed so there should be enough room....
Installer came back out...said he can run exhaust under ac come up 90 degrees and terminate 9" above window. Master of fire said 2' from any adjacent building.
The price keeps going up...4700 now? Is this guy just telling me what I want to hear in order to make a sale???? PLEASE need opinions. Is it not possible to come out under ac angle over and run up beside green pipe? less windows there, less STUFF all around.....
The price keeps going up...4700 now? Is this guy just telling me what I want to hear in order to make a sale???? PLEASE need opinions. Is it not possible to come out under ac angle over and run up beside green pipe? less windows there, less STUFF all around.....
It's wicked tight, all the way around. I hate to say it, but you're gonna get whacked on any install here. At least the guy is being up front w/ you on everything, sounds like he knows his stuff. You got many issues that could cancel an insurance claim or policy. stick with it, pay the long dollar: It'll be less headaches for you in the long run.
rufusmom said:
I'm not one for lots of figuring, charts, and calculations but the feeling I get is that I'm spending almost as much on pellets each year as I would on oil... Plus I have to haul the pellets to the stove and store 5 tons in my garage plus the weekly cleaning every Sunday morning. I am happy I bought the stove and I love not being stuck with a single fuel source but I think it will be a few years before I "break even" on this whole pellet stove thing even though I did the install myself and built my own hearth pad riser.
If I was in your position I'd probably be thinking about spending that 4700 on a more efficient oil or gas heating system instead of a pellet stove... Or maybe better insulation... or new windows... whatever your house may benefit from. You may find that this would save you lots more in the long run. Just my 2 cents.
cncpro said:
I agree.....with all the tight clearances, possible insurance and code problems, I'd be upgrading what I had and insulating it better for that kind of $$. And the $4700 doesn't even include any pellets!
Lisa,
The fewer angles in the vent pipe the better.
If you can go out under the A/C and angle a tee and then a short length of straight followed by a 45 degree elbow and the straight pipe after that how far is it to your roof line?
That alley between you and the church is covered isn't it?
The fewer angles in the vent pipe the better.
If you can go out under the A/C and angle a tee and then a short length of straight followed by a 45 degree elbow and the straight pipe after that how far is it to your roof line?
That alley between you and the church is covered isn't it?
I have to say I am getting a little disgusted...I don't enjoy the heat from forced air...thats why I wanted the pellet stove. I have the company I am buying the stove from going crazy too, got something in effect to that in an email,they forgot to edit...My home is a two story row,so I'm gonna guess 20' to the roof? In the first group of pictures where the airconditioner is sticking out the window...is it possible to come out under ac,angle up and over and run parallel to green pipe in picture? There is only the one window on that side,and he could terminate 9" above correct? I have two more installers coming out this month,one tomorrow. If things with the next two are ridiculous maybe I will have to consider a gas upgrade.The installer also noted the current gas unit isn't up to code because pipe is cemented in the wall. Had that installed 14 years ago...Live and learn. Still really appreciate all you input I have learned a great deal in a way. Will continue to post until this matter is settled,and maybe I will be warm this winter? 
Thank you all...
Thank you all...almost forgot...can it honestly cost 3000 in exhaust to go just 9" above the window? and to break thru the wall?
I don't live in a big city so I can't comment on the prices there.
I'll just say sometimes you folks get things cheaper and sometimes you don't.
As far as piping costs you can price that on-line and then you need to remember the installer is going to mark that up.
If I had the tools to do a good job of cutting through the wall I'd do the install myself. I do not have the tools and I really wouldn't want to use the old fashioned method as it would only aggravate my arthritis.
It is possible to go out under the A/C and up after clearing it. I'm not so certain about only going to 9" above the A/C as I don't have any idea how that particular unit is considered by the code (some A/C units can be operated as powered air intakes, which would raise an issue as to how close that vent can terminate).
Even then how close would that window in the third picture be from the vent?
I'll just say sometimes you folks get things cheaper and sometimes you don't.
As far as piping costs you can price that on-line and then you need to remember the installer is going to mark that up.
If I had the tools to do a good job of cutting through the wall I'd do the install myself. I do not have the tools and I really wouldn't want to use the old fashioned method as it would only aggravate my arthritis.
It is possible to go out under the A/C and up after clearing it. I'm not so certain about only going to 9" above the A/C as I don't have any idea how that particular unit is considered by the code (some A/C units can be operated as powered air intakes, which would raise an issue as to how close that vent can terminate).
Even then how close would that window in the third picture be from the vent?
smokey,I did finally find the pipe listed on my quote. It appears to be pellet pro? But the price was at least doubled.I was under the understanding pellet pro wasn't the best choice for venting,funny according to my quote it costs a fortune,when in reality it is cheap. I had a chimney company out today to see what they would charge for the install part only.He quoted me 1100 cheaper than the company I want to buy the stove from. He said he uses pellet pro venting.
Would it be out of line for me to buy the pipe online and have him install? Or is that just not done? Any recommendations on type of venting would be a HUGE help. I saw one that looked good to me...it was called metalbest and the other was skelkirk? Are these any good? Perhaps it would be best if I went up to the roof with the exhaust? Maybe less problems with codes?
Would it be out of line for me to buy the pipe online and have him install? Or is that just not done? Any recommendations on type of venting would be a HUGE help. I saw one that looked good to me...it was called metalbest and the other was skelkirk? Are these any good? Perhaps it would be best if I went up to the roof with the exhaust? Maybe less problems with codes?
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