The way the air wash works on these stoves, they'll burn from front to back, as the airwash air is "washing" down the front of the stove keeping the glass clean. Good to hear that your wood is reading low. Those readings are from the interior of a freshly split piece, right? If so, it may be the 77 sq. in. flue.
Quadrafire 5700 doing a horrible job heating
- Thread starter 94BULLITT
- Start date
-
Active since 1995, Hearth.com is THE place on the internet for free information and advice about wood stoves, pellet stoves and other energy saving equipment.
We strive to provide opinions, articles, discussions and history related to Hearth Products and in a more general sense, energy issues.
We promote the EFFICIENT, RESPONSIBLE, CLEAN and SAFE use of all fuels, whether renewable or fossil.
- Status
94BULLITT said:
It could be a contributing factor, yes. But I would say it's only one thing in a string of variables: flue size, moisture content of wood, burning hot/clean vs. smoldering a fire, interior vs. exterior chimney, etc.
You did say that this basement was uninsulated?
94BULLITT said:
It sound like the wood is fine, that leaves a draft problem with the stove or the chimney - starting to sound like the stove - have you called the dealer?
No I have not called the dealer. That is the last resort, they will probably want to reline the chimney. There price for just the materials is over $1200. Does anyone know where this stove gets its air from. I know it gets some underneath right from the front at the primary draft. Is there any where else?
About the chimney - is there anywhere below the thimble where air could be leaking in, like an unsealed clean out door? Was there a fireplace?
Do you have windows/doors in the basement that you can open to see how that affects your draft? The airwash should not be leaving your glass black with air set so far open, and dry wood. Either draft is not pulling air through, or stove is not letting air in.
Do you have windows/doors in the basement that you can open to see how that affects your draft? The airwash should not be leaving your glass black with air set so far open, and dry wood. Either draft is not pulling air through, or stove is not letting air in.
The clean out is sealed pretty good. No there was not a fireplace. I tried opening a window and did not see a difference. Like I said earlier I can get a pretty good secondary fire going with the main draft closed all of the way and the start up open but I am afraid to run it like that and I should not have to be ran like that. The chimney probably enough draft that if the stove pipe was unhooked and you held a lighter there I guarantee you it would put it out.
94BULLITT said:
EPA stoves are, for the most part, built around and tested with 6 inch chimneys, except a few that have larger 8 inch. I wager that your stove hooked up to an insulated and lined 6 inch chimney will perform like a champ.
Keet playing with it, I had problems trying to run my summit for a while, I was turning the stove down too quick for the wood I had in it, I now get it a little hotter and have the right size splits (and wood type) so it can sustain the fire with less air. After it gets colder and have fires all the time it should be less of a problem. That oak you have needs a good bed of coals to burn correctly, the cherry should be a walk in the park.
With the wood testing fine, I am at a loss. My last guess is a combination of guesses, really. 1.) Even though your flue is less than 3x the area it should not exceed, it's still a 77 sq. in. flue compared to 28 sq. in. That's a significant increase in volume, which could slow the flue gases enough (because they have to expand to fill that area) to cause a poor draft. And the draft is the engine that drives the entire system, especially in an EPA stove. And my final guess is 2.) with this being a jacketed, convection stove it is having a helluva time competing with the BTU loss through uninsulated walls.
See below for how many BTUs an uninsulated wall will bleed. I truly wish I could be of more help, but the above is the best I've got.
http://www.woodstove.com/pages/guidepdfs/BasementInstall.pdf
See below for how many BTUs an uninsulated wall will bleed. I truly wish I could be of more help, but the above is the best I've got.
http://www.woodstove.com/pages/guidepdfs/BasementInstall.pdf
Now that the wood has been tested at acceptable levels (although, I have NEVER seen 7% mc on air dried firewood), its time to look into the flue as BroB and others have stated. If you have good firewood, and good operational technique, and you still can't get a good fire/draft, you will probably want to consider lining that flue.
I have never seen BroB state something as assuredly as the post above, and not be right. Just say'in.
I have never seen BroB state something as assuredly as the post above, and not be right. Just say'in.
Draft is the normal culprit, but I wouldn't rule out an actual problem with the stove. Call the dealer.
I am just afraid I will reline the chimney and not get any results. To get the stove to take off I have to open the door and it will burn like good then, that's why I think it is the stove. Is there any way I check to see if the chimney is to large by measuring the stove pipe temp and comparing it to the surface temp on the stove? I know if I had a manometer I could check the draft but the quadrafire owners manual doesn't say what the draft should be. I might go talk to the dealer Sunday. Does anyone know where this stove gets it's air from?
Probably missed it, but did you follow the intake air path all the way through the stove to make sure nothing's in there, like packing materials or stray bits of metal form the manufacturing process? You might want to take a look and blow a shop-vac through it from entrance to firebox to ensure there is good airflow getting into the firebox. Sometimes things happen in shipping. Oh and vacuum it thoroughly before blowing air through it... and be prepared for some dust :0
94BULLITT said:
Don't assume the dealer will insist this is the only solution. You could measure the draft - even though QF does not say what it should be, if you tell them (or those on this forum) what it is they may say fine, or way too low.
I wonder if any sweeps/shops ever use a "mock liner" - I'm thinking of something 6" and very light that you could temporarily use as a quick test liner to evaluate a stove/chimney for draft to illustrate the potential difference before and after lining.
There isn't anything wrong with that stove. I live just down the road from the OP with identical flue tiles in the chimneys and a large firebox EPA stove that for all intents and purposes is the same as that Quad. And if it wasn't for that liner in the chimney the thing would be a smoldering smoking mess.
The first clue is that it burns fine with the door open. EPA stoves have a high draft requirement because of the long path the air has to take from the back of the stove to the front to be fed to the fire and the airwash. As well as having to pull air through the secondary inlet and up through the manifold and tubes.
If that stove burns fine with the door open and doesn't with it closed then that chimney needs to be lined to get a proper draft for it to burn right. Period. We have a half dozen of these new stove situations every season here on the forum and the answer is always the same.
The first clue is that it burns fine with the door open. EPA stoves have a high draft requirement because of the long path the air has to take from the back of the stove to the front to be fed to the fire and the airwash. As well as having to pull air through the secondary inlet and up through the manifold and tubes.
If that stove burns fine with the door open and doesn't with it closed then that chimney needs to be lined to get a proper draft for it to burn right. Period. We have a half dozen of these new stove situations every season here on the forum and the answer is always the same.
branchburner said:
I have been racking my brain all week trying to think of something cheap that is 6'' to use a temporary line but I can think of anything. I could tell in 30min if it made a difference. I am going to blow through it with the shop vac at the one place it get air but there has to be another place or at least I would think.
Just some advice - first, empty it out completely (don't vacuum hot embers into a shop vac. Voice of experience it does not end well for the shop vac). Second, on my PE i had to remove a bottom ash ban, but after that everything was pretty exposed. You may not need to blow the air through and make a mess, if you can see everything is OK. Just basically ensuring no debris is plugging the air's path in. Do you have an outside air kit? Is there a plug that needs to be removed or anything? I wouldn't worry too much about it, as BB is probably right (as usual), but it would suck to line the chimney then find out some silly piece of cardboard just caused you to spend $1200... GL.
Also, two more questions -
1) Does this have the "set and forget" start up lever? If so, is there anything in that system that may be suspect? The OP has a stove with a system that has more complex draft regulation than most of ours. May have a problem in that. If it's burning well with dry wood and the lever on "start", but not on "run" (basically), then I would suspect the stove more than the chimney. Chimney prob doesn't help, but it sounds like it drafts ok on startup. I'd have the dealer come out and check it, then check yourself on a stove in the store - does everything look the same on that one as yours? Or is something connected differently?
2) Where on the stove is the thermometer?
1) Does this have the "set and forget" start up lever? If so, is there anything in that system that may be suspect? The OP has a stove with a system that has more complex draft regulation than most of ours. May have a problem in that. If it's burning well with dry wood and the lever on "start", but not on "run" (basically), then I would suspect the stove more than the chimney. Chimney prob doesn't help, but it sounds like it drafts ok on startup. I'd have the dealer come out and check it, then check yourself on a stove in the store - does everything look the same on that one as yours? Or is something connected differently?
2) Where on the stove is the thermometer?
- Status
Similar threads
