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Storage not getting up to temp

Post in 'The Boiler Room - Wood Boilers and Furnaces' started by Rob186, Dec 28, 2012.

  1. Rob186

    Rob186 New Member

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    Somewhat I'll try to get a diagram up this weekend real busy at work this is a new system installed in June so this is the first winter I am not getting any sizzling out of the wood I have a delta t pump on the secondary loop and a 3 speed pump on the boiler loop I turned the three speed circulator down to two and now I am getting higher water temps but still chewing through wood I am burning a full load of hardwood oak ash and cherry in 2 to 2 1/2 hours so on a normal day I am filling it 3-4 times and not getting tanks hot I'm hoping by turning the speed down I can Absorb more heat I may have had the water going too fast Nofosil your right heat is going somewhere just have find out where don't think it is the house the oil boiler didn't have any problems and that was smaller than the new wood boiler

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  2. Clarkbug

    Clarkbug Minister of Fire

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    Do you have a loading valve with the three speed pump built into it? Put the pump speed on 1.

    Do you have turbulators installed in the heat exchanger tubes? When is the last time you scrubbed them out?

    How much do you have the little window for air adjustment opened up?

    Is the bypass damper closed all the way during the burn?

    Is your storage well insulated?
  3. Rob186

    Rob186 New Member

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    The tanks are wrapped in r-30 fiberglass then boxed out in 1 " foam then 1/2 plywood the air adj. is about half way open I am noticing my stack temp is 225-260 c I clean the tubes about once every two weeks but they are not too dirty when I clean them going to let it run on 2 speed today then try 1 tomorrow see what is better
  4. Clarkbug

    Clarkbug Minister of Fire

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    Hmmm, I guess I dont know what "halfway" is. I havent ever tried to back it all the way out.

    Sounds like you are losing some heat up the stack for sure. What kind of a chimney do you have?
  5. Rob186

    Rob186 New Member

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    It's block lined with terra-cotta It is 2 yrs old had to rip the old one down the previous Oner never anchored it to the house so it was pulling away going to clean the boiler tomorrow see if that brings the stack temp down
  6. Clarkbug

    Clarkbug Minister of Fire

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    How tall is it? Just wondering if you have a lot of draft.
  7. Floydian

    Floydian Feeling the Heat

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    Hi Rob,

    Sorry for being blunt but.....your posts are vague and tough to follow. I have no doubt the folks here can help you but more info about your system could really speed the process up.

    Can you post some pics of your set up? Particularly your near boiler piping to/from storage and your heat loads.

    What supply temp water does your heat distribution require? What is your heat load at design temp? Avg temp?

    For math's sake: a 1000 gallons would require 500,000 btus to go from 120::F to 180::F. Assuming NO heat going to your house and ignoring standby heat loss from storage, 500,000 btus should equal about 103 lbs of wood with 20% moisture and 80% efficiency and 400::F flue temp . Give or take a bit with these numbers, but weighing your wood for a while could help you dial things in.

    Noah
  8. How are you measuring the tank temps?
  9. maple1

    maple1 Minister of Fire

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    My three speed loading pump has never been off low speed. Works like a top. Even in this cold weather I'm not burning more than two loads of wood over 7-8 hours per day to keep the house warm & storage hot.

    Something is just not right - hard to tell what exactly sometimes over the internets though.

    I would also ask what mike asked above about how you're measuring tank temps (maybe they're hotter than you think?) - and are your turbs in? If you've got oak I'd still maybe suspect your wood being not seasoned enough - but I also think you should get more than 2 - 2 1/2 hours out of a load of wood. Also not sure about the 'air window' on the 37. If it's the same as mine, mine is only open a crack - maybe you're putting too much air through it? Have you tried closing down the air adjustment?
  10. Rob186

    Rob186 New Member

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    I think I may have got it I turned the pump speed down to one and closed off the secondary air a little bit the stack temp went down and tank temp is up to 180 on the top tank with two loads of wood that took 3 1/2 hours to burn each one now I hope I have enough wood to last the rest of winter without going into next years stash since November I burned almost 3 cords of wood thanks everyone for their help will keep uh updated over the next week
  11. maple1

    maple1 Minister of Fire

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    Sounds like an improvement!

    What did your stack temps go to? Don't be afraid to try closing off the air even more - although not sure where you're at now. If you've got more chimney draft than spec'd, that could also increase air flow through the boiler & heat up the chimney - just something else that could be checked with a manometer. That's why Clarkbug asked how high your chimney is.

    I think I've only burned 3/4 cord or so in the last month - if you're at all in doubt about your wood supply, can you move some of next years inside now & get it drying more? I've had to do something like that in years past - I resplit it quite small & stacked up high in my basement where it was warmer. Once I also set up a box fan in front of it on low for a few hours a day. It dries pretty quick like that. Beats running out of dry wood in a couple of months.
  12. Clarkbug

    Clarkbug Minister of Fire

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    Glad to hear its better Rob!

    It took me several weeks to get my setup dialed in, and Im still struggling a little this year due to variations in wood quality. I run my pump speed on 1 unless I screw up and overload it and risk overheating my tanks. The air adjustment also took me a while to tweak. I just open it a little more when I see really dark ash on my turbulators. It sounds like your high flue temps may have been due to that air adjustment. Play with it more and you will find the sweet spot.

    Maple is right, it wouldnt hurt to move in some wood now if you can just to get it a little bit dryer in case you need it. You can also start scrounging pallets and mixing those in to help stretch your wood supply. Just look out for nails, and know that you will need to play with the air adjustment again if you use lots of the kiln dried stuff.

    Also, how big is your wood split? I really split mine small this year to help it dry, but also because it seems like the boiler likes it more. It really helps it get gassifying quickly, and put more heat out. If in doubt, split a few of your pieces in half again before you load up and see if that helps you out.
  13. Floydian

    Floydian Feeling the Heat

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    I really agree with this. Half rounds from 4 to 5" diameter pieces seem OK. The half rounds I have from 6 to 7" diameter pieces seem too big and I am re-splitting those. Definitely less bridging with the smaller pieces as well, although my loading technique is improving.

    Does this seem similar to your experience?

    Noah
  14. maple1

    maple1 Minister of Fire

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    I've been re-splitting before loading with the electric splitter almost everything I've been burning this winter - except for the last re-load before going to bed.

    Not sure it's necessary or making a real big improvement - maybe I just have a thing for my splitter. _g
  15. Rob186

    Rob186 New Member

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    Yea I split them too big so now then I resplit with maul in the basement before I put them in next year I will be splitting into 4 by 4 splits or smaller
  16. Clarkbug

    Clarkbug Minister of Fire

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    Noah,

    Its absolutely what I have found. The bigger stuff just holds other wood off the nozzle area, and my flue temps drop. I have found this a few times, and just stab at it with the poker until I can shift stuff down. Close the bypass and its off to the races.

    I found a used super split last year on Craigslist, and that made splitting smaller MUCH easier. Plus it helps my wood dry out when I wheel it near the boiler.

    Some day Ill get ahead....

    Maple, you must REALLY like your splitter....
  17. Fred61

    Fred61 Minister of Fire

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    I'm half owner of a big Didier splitter that will split 4 foot wood. It now lives with the other half owner, my old neighbor who stayed up on the hill when I moved to my little retirement home closer to town. Since I now buy my wood all split, I don't have a need for it but it's nice to have access to it without having to feel guilty about borrowing. I too have a little electric splitter that works great when the firewood vendors leave several pieces too large for a gasser. It will split 90% of the pieces. Makes me think that those 30 ton splitters are only for splitting 10% of the wood. Plus I can use it inside. I love it!
  18. Coal Reaper

    Coal Reaper Minister of Fire

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    rob,
    how has your system been functioning this week? how much wood are you going through and how often do you have to fire/reload with this "NJ cold"?
  19. Clarkbug

    Clarkbug Minister of Fire

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    Good question CR. I meant to follow up with him as well to see if things still were working out.

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