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You guys {and gals} gave me something new to be thankful for

Post in 'The Boiler Room - Wood Boilers and Furnaces' started by ISeeDeadBTUs, Apr 15, 2009.

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  1. ISeeDeadBTUs

    ISeeDeadBTUs Guest

    I see post upon post about shutting down for the season . . . I am grateful to live in NY (not because we pay the highest taxes in the Union). It's still 30's at night and some 20's. Loaded appropriately - a few pieces of dry hemlock and/or pine slab during the day, larger pieces and more of them at night - the GW continues to put out as required.

    I had to shut down for the weekend, and I could not SLEEP, listening to the oil burner coming on! In 48 hours, my burner logged 8 hours . . . that's like the burner was running 17% of the time. And that was with the DHW turned off!!

    How many days before snow???

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  2. sweetheat

    sweetheat Member

    Joined:
    Mar 7, 2008
    Messages:
    230
    Loc:
    MDI/ME
    i see you! in exactly 180 days you will see snow. no oil for me though. a poet and i don't now it. 30 tonight tomorrow 60. be thankful for the wood you have stacked for next year! sweetheat
  3. steam man

    steam man Minister of Fire

    Joined:
    Jan 19, 2008
    Messages:
    652
    Loc:
    Northern Maine
    Since this is April 15th, a little tax education is in order. Since everyone in the northeast thinks they pay the most in taxes, (yes I have seen Maine listed as the #1 tax hell hole), here is Forbes list of the top ten taxed states at http://www.seeingtheforest.com/archives/2009/04/forbes_list_of.htm. The article was about Californians who think they are the most taxed. Ready?

    April 9, 2009
    Forbes List Of Highest-Taxed States Lists California
    -- by Dave Johnson

    This post originally appeared at Speak Out California.


    Forbes List Of Highest-Taxed States Lists California -- Not.

    The Forbes list of states that tax their citizens the most is out! And California ranks ... well, California isn't even on the list.

    Forbes: Where Americans Are Taxed Most:
    10. Pennsylvania (not California)
    9. Wyoming (not California)
    8. Washington (not California)
    7. Massachusetts (not California)
    6. New York (not California)
    5. New Jersey (not California)
    4. Minnesota (not California)
    3. Connecticut (not California)
    2. Hawaii (not California)

    Drum roll ....

    ... keep scrolling ...

    --- And the winner is ...

    1. Vermont (NOT CALIFORNIA!)

    At least I feel better Maine is not on that list.

    I almost think there is some correlation between living in a high taxed state and burning wood. Wonder why.

    Mike
  4. WoodNotOil

    WoodNotOil Minister of Fire

    Joined:
    May 6, 2008
    Messages:
    910
    Loc:
    Northern, Vermont
    There is nothing I loathe more than the sound of my oil burner firing. It will eat away at you until you put in storage for off season DHW. My burning has slowed considerably. The time between fires lengthens as the days get warmer. This will be my first off season completely without oil becuase I didn't get more storage built until the end of August last year. I am looking forward using all WoodNotOil! ;-)

    As far as taxes go... With three kids and modest income, I always get a nice tax return from the feds and end up paying almost all of my VT tax (so I believe the ranking!). Still... being the eighth generation to live off the same land its worth it. I wouldn't live anywhere else! :)
  5. 603doug

    603doug Member

    Joined:
    Sep 26, 2008
    Messages:
    64
    Loc:
    seacoast nh
    I will not shut down the boiler, I do not care how much work, it such a great sound not to hear the propane come on. Actually I need a fire about a couple of hrs then turn everything off and we have had all the hot water we need with very little wood burned.
    I wish they would not publish the highest tax states list because the idiots here think they can raise taxes and fees and say look we are way behind the poor folks everywhere else. Own any property in NH and be in business and they bag the hell out of you
  6. webbie

    webbie Seasoned Moderator Staff Member

    Joined:
    Nov 17, 2005
    Messages:
    12,101
    Loc:
    Western Mass.
    Of course, these little exercisers in pennies and dollars are typical of the drivel that fills our media these day.......and only tell a small part of the story. For instance, I'd certainly rather be a public school teacher in NJ making $80K per year plus benefits....and pay $500 more in taxes per capita....then be paid $35K in Florida for the same job, and not get taxed as much.

    As I like to think, it's not the taxes....it's what you have left over!

    I paid HIGH taxes when my stores were in NJ...but, guess what? There are a LOT of people with a LOT of money in NJ, so I ended up with a lot......

    Now, if you are in a high tax state AND you make chit......that is not good.

    Strange that PA made it so high on the list. I know that the property taxes there in rural areas are extremely low.

    Well, in either case, spring is here in Western Ma....I don't care what you say.
  7. ISeeDeadBTUs

    ISeeDeadBTUs Guest

    Actually, statistics can be made to say {almost} anything. The list you refered to looks at STATE taxes, while http://www.taxfoundation.org/files/sl_burden_1977-2008-200808073.pdf looks at state AND Local property taxes. If you scroll to the last page, you will clearly see that NY & NJ rank the highest.

    But here's what I find ironic less than 24 hours after finishing up my 2008 income taxes . . .

    I still paid 2.5 times to Uncle Sam what I did to NYS income and local property taxes combined. But everyone bitches about the property taxes. :smirk:
  8. steam man

    steam man Minister of Fire

    Joined:
    Jan 19, 2008
    Messages:
    652
    Loc:
    Northern Maine
    Even though I live in Maine where income is not what anyone would call high we get burned on taxes every which way. However, if you link to the Forbes article stating how the states are ranked they say they used ALL taxes paid by individuals-not just income taxes. From Forbes:

    Behind the Numbers
    The list of most taxed states comes from Census Department figures from from July 2007 to June 2008. We excluded all taxes not borne by individuals, instead including taxes such as: property, individual income, sales, alcoholic beverages, tobacco, motor vehicles, hunting and fishing, motor fuels, death and gift taxes, as well as insurance premiums. Adding up total receipts and then dividing by the number of citizens, we arrived at our tax-burden-per-person metric.

    Mike
  9. Nofossil

    Nofossil Moderator Emeritus

    Joined:
    Oct 4, 2007
    Messages:
    3,422
    Loc:
    Addison County, Vermont
    For my part, my state and local taxes together exceed my federal income taxes. In past years, my property taxes all by themselves have exceeded my federal income tax.

    Vermont has worked long and hard to attain its #1 ranking.

    This year, my total income went up 9%, mostly because Mrs. NoFossil got her Master's degree and increased her hours. You might think that would be enough so that We could go out to a nice dinner or something. Here's what happened:

    - My total taxes went up 25%.
    - My state income taxes went up over 50%.
    - Net increase in taxes consumed 75% of the increase in our income.
    - Our financial aid eligibility was reduced for each of the three children that we have in college (schools look at total income, not income after taxes)

    Net result: we're significantly worse off than last year. My wife's Master's degree and increased hours have actually reduced our standard of living.

    Web likes to say "it's not what you pay, it's what you have left". I have less left. There's something deeply wrong with a system that punishes hard work and initiative.

    Thank God the government doesn't control my heat!
  10. Vtgent49

    Vtgent49 New Member

    Joined:
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    Messages:
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    Loc:
    Central VT
    And Vermont just got another $25 million State tax surcharge, just to guarantee it's first place position.
  11. steam man

    steam man Minister of Fire

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    652
    Loc:
    Northern Maine
    At least the article noted that Vermont's taxes were "balanced across the whole spectrum". Sounds like they were trying to put a positive spin on Vermont's taxes.

    Mike
  12. 603doug

    603doug Member

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    Loc:
    seacoast nh
    If everyone had to do quarterly returns and not have automatic deduction and have this blind faith I am getting money back from the gov, like we have to do in business people would take notice on how their monies are spent.( I best be careful Homeland might consider me a right wing extremist :cheese: )
  13. Birdman

    Birdman New Member

    Joined:
    May 21, 2008
    Messages:
    278
    Loc:
    NH
    Wow... .WOodnotOil... 8 generations on the same land?!. Impressive. I am only the 3rd generation on my land... but I am the 7th generation to live in this same town. Looking past teh 7th? well they came from the town next over. SOunds like we have something in common. We both have gasifiers.. and I like to say when people ask me where I am from.... " We are teh ones who never moved away". The roots are deep... Can you imagine how many cords of wood have been burned between both of family trees? or cut for that matter?
  14. peakbagger

    peakbagger Minister of Fire

    Joined:
    Jul 11, 2008
    Messages:
    1,729
    Loc:
    Northern NH
    Vermont is occasionally referred to as the "socialist republic of vermont". Most of the towns have weak local regulations but the state makes up for it. The state writes the laws and then a third party non profit starts up to consult with the folks who have to comply with the laws. Inevitably the non profit is staffed with people who were instrumental in getting the law passed to begin with. Talk to anyone who ever been through Act 250 and they will probably agree with the comment that no good deed goes unpunished. That and other regulations drives up the cost of housing significantly and then the state makes sure that they get a cut of the property taxes. Throw in state taxes and a couple of towns with local sales taxes and it adds up.
  15. WoodNotOil

    WoodNotOil Minister of Fire

    Joined:
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    Loc:
    Northern, Vermont
    A good example of what you are talking about is septic systems. As of last year every new construction not on city sewers has to put in a mound system that starts at around 14k, even if their property would pass a perc test. I wonder if the people who engineer and put these systems in had anything to do with that new law? ;-)
  16. sparke

    sparke Minister of Fire

    Joined:
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    Loc:
    Maine
    Yet!! Wait till Obama is done...
  17. rphurley

    rphurley Feeling the Heat

    Joined:
    Nov 5, 2008
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    435
    Loc:
    Central/Eastern CT
    If we can decrease our dependence on foreign oil, then I'm all for it! We need to free ourselves from our dependence on these lunatics and just let them blow each other up the way they like to do, with no interference from us! Let China deal with their BS.
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