Accentra 52i -- more questions on cleaning etc.

[karen_in_nh_2014]

Hi, all. I'm pretty new to these forums but have read a lot of threads including several on the Accentra 52i.

I have a 2,400-square-foot Colonial-style house that I bought not quite 2 years ago. My first year I went through probably 800 gallons of oil (ugh). I'd had a Harman pellet furnace at my last house (which I still own but rent out) and was familiar with pellets, so I decided to get an insert in my fireplace (which I had never used since it was so inefficient). My Accentra 52i was installed on 10/28/13 and 99% of the time I love it.

This is one of the 1% times, alas. As of a few days ago, after I'd burned just under 3 tons of pellets (145 bags, to be exact -- I keep very detailed records on these things), after a few hours of normal operation the flame got really small and the heat output was minimal. I turned it off, did some "routine" cleaning (the kind I do every couple of days -- scrape the burn pot, empty the ash pan, vacuum the insides) but that made no difference. I decided to do a more thorough cleaning, during which I take off the bottom plate (behind the ash pan), the medallion, the cast rear covers, etc. -- I did that today. The area behind the burn pot was full of ashes, but the rest of the inside that I checked wasn't bad at all. (Note, about 6 weeks after I got the unit, the dealer had come and done a full cleaning of everything EXCEPT that which you have to pull the unit out to do -- he showed me how to do what he did, and that's what I did today. The unit started up fine after the cleaning today, but the flame was again very small even when I turned the thermostat to its max. Then even the tiny flame started to go out, so I just shut it off entirely.)

Some other info you might need:
- There is no smoke smell or anything like that -- just a tiny flame and very low heat output.
- When I am home, I normally run the unit on room temp with a very high setting (75+) -- this keeps it going as the house temp gets higher and higher (measured by my oil thermostat in the room across the hall). If I don't want the fire to go out, I switch to manual after the fire starts. Usually about an hour before I am going to go to bed, I turn the insert's thermostat down to ~53 (I know that sounds low, but it's actually more like a room temp of 58, and that's my usual setting when I go to bed -- I like a cold house overnight!), then an hour later just before going to bed I do some scraping/etc. since the insert is cool by then. Then I go upstairs to bed, and some time overnight the insert will normally start itself -- I think it typically takes several hours unless we are in the single digits or negative numbers, but I've never run out of pellets overnight.

I guess my biggest question is, any idea what could be causing the very low heat output? Is there more cleaning I should be doing? My dealer said I wouldn't have to do the pull-out-the-unit cleaning except for once a year, and I was going to have them do it the first time, but I am wondering if I need that now.

I have to say I have been very happy with the insert, generally speaking -- until a couple of days ago I had used maybe 100 gallons of oil (I use it only on nights when temps are going to be in the negative numbers, or when I am gone for a few days) and less than 3 tons of pellets, so I figured I would likely save close to $1,000 on my heating costs this winter. But having to have the dealer come out and do another cleaning (they charged me half price, $80, the first time as a "courtesy," but that is still high!) is really going to take away from the savings.

Any suggestions would be very much appreciated! Thanks in advance! (And BTW here's a photo of my kitties enjoying the insert right after I got it!)

 

[Ctcarl]

Hi, all. I'm pretty new to these forums but have read a lot of threads including several on the Accentra 52i.

I have a 2,400-square-foot Colonial-style house that I bought not quite 2 years ago. My first year I went through probably 800 gallons of oil (ugh). I'd had a Harman pellet furnace at my last house (which I still own but rent out) and was familiar with pellets, so I decided to get an insert in my fireplace (which I had never used since it was so inefficient). My Accentra 52i was installed on 10/28/13 and 99% of the time I love it.

This is one of the 1% times, alas. As of a few days ago, after I'd burned just under 3 tons of pellets (145 bags, to be exact -- I keep very detailed records on these things), after a few hours of normal operation the flame got really small and the heat output was minimal. I turned it off, did some "routine" cleaning (the kind I do every couple of days -- scrape the burn pot, empty the ash pan, vacuum the insides) but that made no difference. I decided to do a more thorough cleaning, during which I take off the bottom plate (behind the ash pan), the medallion, the cast rear covers, etc. -- I did that today. The area behind the burn pot was full of ashes, but the rest of the inside that I checked wasn't bad at all. (Note, about 6 weeks after I got the unit, the dealer had come and done a full cleaning of everything EXCEPT that which you have to pull the unit out to do -- he showed me how to do what he did, and that's what I did today. The unit started up fine after the cleaning today, but the flame was again very small even when I turned the thermostat to its max. Then even the tiny flame started to go out, so I just shut it off entirely.)

Some other info you might need:
- There is no smoke smell or anything like that -- just a tiny flame and very low heat output.
- When I am home, I normally run the unit on room temp with a very high setting (75+) -- this keeps it going as the house temp gets higher and higher (measured by my oil thermostat in the room across the hall). If I don't want the fire to go out, I switch to manual after the fire starts. Usually about an hour before I am going to go to bed, I turn the insert's thermostat down to ~53 (I know that sounds low, but it's actually more like a room temp of 58, and that's my usual setting when I go to bed -- I like a cold house overnight!), then an hour later just before going to bed I do some scraping/etc. since the insert is cool by then. Then I go upstairs to bed, and some time overnight the insert will normally start itself -- I think it typically takes several hours unless we are in the single digits or negative numbers, but I've never run out of pellets overnight.

I guess my biggest question is, any idea what could be causing the very low heat output? Is there more cleaning I should be doing? My dealer said I wouldn't have to do the pull-out-the-unit cleaning except for once a year, and I was going to have them do it the first time, but I am wondering if I need that now.

I have to say I have been very happy with the insert, generally speaking -- until a couple of days ago I had used maybe 100 gallons of oil (I use it only on nights when temps are going to be in the negative numbers, or when I am gone for a few days) and less than 3 tons of pellets, so I figured I would likely save close to $1,000 on my heating costs this winter. But having to have the dealer come out and do another cleaning (they charged me half price, $80, the first time as a "courtesy," but that is still high!) is really going to take away from the savings.

Any suggestions would be very much appreciated! Thanks in advance! (And BTW here's a photo of my kitties enjoying the insert right after I got it!)

Well it sound like to me you need to pull it out. clean your flu with a 4 inch brush. I have the 25 ft fiberglass rod screw on kitt .i got my p35i 6 weeks ago and did my first ton cleaning. Let me tell you the flu was full of ash. Buckets of it and that was one ton. You said you done 3 and no back cleaning.after the flu clean your fines box . Again mine was full.Also your fan needs to be cleaned.So pull her out and clean all that and see what happens. I watched the DVD that comes with it and from what your saying low flame low heat it most likely needs a good full cleaning.btw my dealer said to do it once a year or every 2 or 3 tons . I go by what the DVD says. After your first ton doing a cleaning . That will determine if you need to do it more or less. Good luck

 

[karen_in_nh_2014]

I didn't GET a DVD -- my dealer didn't have any yet (I think the 52i had just come out and they didn't have any yet).

I will have them come out again. Between my first cleaning ($80) and the next one ($160, full price this time), that's a ton of pellets. :-(

As I wrote, I love the insert when it's working -- just wish the dealers were clearer about the maintenance involved and EXACTLY how to do it. Mine certainly knows that I was planning to use my insert as my primary source of heat (which would be, I thought, 4-5 tons), but he still said the "major cleaning" (where you pull it out) would be once a year, and he did not "open her up" when he came out to do the first cleaning. This morning, I just did what he did -- clearly not enough.

Thanks for replying, I appreciate it!

 

[karen_in_nh_2014]

Well it sound like to me you need to pull it out. clean your flu with a 4 inch brush. I have the 25 ft fiberglass rod screw on kitt .i got my p35i 6 weeks ago and did my first ton cleaning. Let me tell you the flu was full of ash. Buckets of it and that was one ton. You said you done 3 and no back cleaning.after the flu clean your fines box . Again mine was full.Also your fan needs to be cleaned.So pull her out and clean all that and see what happens. I watched the DVD that comes with it and from what your saying low flame low heat it most likely needs a good full cleaning.btw my dealer said to do it once a year or every 2 or 3 tons . I go by what the DVD says. After your first ton doing a cleaning . That will determine if you need to do it more or less. Good luck

You also mentioned "the 25 ft fiberglass rod screw on kit" for the 4" flue, which makes it sound like a standard Harman accessory? Or did you buy it elsewhere? More details, please!

 

[NHcpa]

Hi, all. I'm pretty new to these forums but have read a lot of threads including several on the Accentra 52i.

I have a 2,400-square-foot Colonial-style house that I bought not quite 2 years ago. My first year I went through probably 800 gallons of oil (ugh). I'd had a Harman pellet furnace at my last house (which I still own but rent out) and was familiar with pellets, so I decided to get an insert in my fireplace (which I had never used since it was so inefficient). My Accentra 52i was installed on 10/28/13 and 99% of the time I love it.

This is one of the 1% times, alas. As of a few days ago, after I'd burned just under 3 tons of pellets (145 bags, to be exact -- I keep very detailed records on these things), after a few hours of normal operation the flame got really small and the heat output was minimal. I turned it off, did some "routine" cleaning (the kind I do every couple of days -- scrape the burn pot, empty the ash pan, vacuum the insides) but that made no difference. I decided to do a more thorough cleaning, during which I take off the bottom plate (behind the ash pan), the medallion, the cast rear covers, etc. -- I did that today. The area behind the burn pot was full of ashes, but the rest of the inside that I checked wasn't bad at all. (Note, about 6 weeks after I got the unit, the dealer had come and done a full cleaning of everything EXCEPT that which you have to pull the unit out to do -- he showed me how to do what he did, and that's what I did today. The unit started up fine after the cleaning today, but the flame was again very small even when I turned the thermostat to its max. Then even the tiny flame started to go out, so I just shut it off entirely.)

Some other info you might need:
- There is no smoke smell or anything like that -- just a tiny flame and very low heat output.
- When I am home, I normally run the unit on room temp with a very high setting (75+) -- this keeps it going as the house temp gets higher and higher (measured by my oil thermostat in the room across the hall). If I don't want the fire to go out, I switch to manual after the fire starts. Usually about an hour before I am going to go to bed, I turn the insert's thermostat down to ~53 (I know that sounds low, but it's actually more like a room temp of 58, and that's my usual setting when I go to bed -- I like a cold house overnight!), then an hour later just before going to bed I do some scraping/etc. since the insert is cool by then. Then I go upstairs to bed, and some time overnight the insert will normally start itself -- I think it typically takes several hours unless we are in the single digits or negative numbers, but I've never run out of pellets overnight.

I guess my biggest question is, any idea what could be causing the very low heat output? Is there more cleaning I should be doing? My dealer said I wouldn't have to do the pull-out-the-unit cleaning except for once a year, and I was going to have them do it the first time, but I am wondering if I need that now.

I have to say I have been very happy with the insert, generally speaking -- until a couple of days ago I had used maybe 100 gallons of oil (I use it only on nights when temps are going to be in the negative numbers, or when I am gone for a few days) and less than 3 tons of pellets, so I figured I would likely save close to $1,000 on my heating costs this winter. But having to have the dealer come out and do another cleaning (they charged me half price, $80, the first time as a "courtesy," but that is still high!) is really going to take away from the savings.

Any suggestions would be very much appreciated! Thanks in advance! (And BTW here's a photo of my kitties enjoying the insert right after I got it!)

Hi Karen, I am looking to get a Harman insert...if I may, where did you purchase yours?

 

[alternativeheat]

You also mentioned "the 25 ft fiberglass rod screw on kit" for the 4" flue, which makes it sound like a standard Harman accessory? Or did you buy it elsewhere? More details, please!

Karen, I wouldn't even go to the stove shop for the cleaning brush kit. My wife did that and the cost was something stupid and it was not anything to do with a Harman accessory. It was just a Rutland kit you can buy online for half the cost.. Also, is your chimney 25 ft more or less ? You may not need all 4 rods if it's shorter. Just saying.

 

[karen_in_nh_2014]

Hi Karen, I am looking to get a Harman insert...if I may, where did you purchase yours?

I got mine from Heart Line in Jaffrey NH. I bought the pellet furnace from them (for my last house) many years ago. They are very knowledgeable, but some are more helpful than others. Overall I have been happy with them simply because they are VERY experienced in pellet heating especially. I just wish they were ALL customer-service-oriented (some are totally wonderful, some are rude).

 

[NHcpa]

I got mine from Heart Line in Jaffrey NH. I bought the pellet furnace from them (for my last house) many years ago. They are very knowledgeable, but some are more helpful than others. Overall I have been happy with them simply because they are VERY experienced in pellet heating especially. I just wish they were ALL customer-service-oriented (some are totally wonderful, some are rude).

Thanks for the reply, I think your experience is typical... I did see excellent reference on Hearth and Home in Hampton Falls, but they are an hour away. There is a new Harman dealer in Weare and I am going to visit them tomorrow.

 

[karen_in_nh_2014]

Karen, I wouldn't even go to the stove shop for the cleaning brush kit. My wife did that and the cost was something stupid and it was not anything to do with a Harman accessory. It was just a Rutland kit you can buy online for half the cost.. Also, is your chimney 25 ft more or less ? You may not need all 4 rods if it's shorter. Just saying.

That's interesting, as I was just looking on amazon ... I did a search for "chimney brush" and one of the hits was for a "Rutland Products PS-4 4-inch round pellet stove brush." It sounded like that would work, but I will need several 5-foot extensions as well, and they are $15 each. I guess it's worth it if it WORKS.

Incidentally, I have no problem at all making time once a week to thoroughly clean the insert -- an hour a week of cleaning to save $1,000 a year on oil is worth it to me. I just wish the instructions were clear, and that dealers didn't make it seem like virtually no maintenance was required. I KNOW they are trying to sell the stoves, but they end up with a lot of people who have no idea how to clean/maintain the appliance, and those dealer cleanings can get REALLY expensive.

Thanks so much to those who have replied, and I would love to hear from anyone else who can help! I will "like" all the replies -- I assume that is like "rep points" on some other forums!

 

[alternativeheat]

That's interesting, as I was just looking on amazon ... I did a search for "chimney brush" and one of the hits was for a "Rutland Products PS-4 4-inch round pellet stove brush." It sounded like that would work, but I will need several 5-foot extensions as well, and they are $15 each. I guess it's worth it if it WORKS.

Incidentally, I have no problem at all making time once a week to thoroughly clean the insert -- an hour a week of cleaning to save $1,000 a year on oil is worth it to me. I just wish the instructions were clear, and that dealers didn't make it seem like virtually no maintenance was required. I KNOW they are trying to sell the stoves, but they end up with a lot of people who have no idea how to clean/maintain the appliance, and those dealer cleanings can get REALLY expensive.

Thanks so much to those who have replied, and I would love to hear from anyone else who can help! I will "like" all the replies -- I assume that is like "rep points" on some other forums!

Yes, Like = points, you now have one too !
FWIW, it took me over two months to decide first on a pellet stove and then on which free standing one vs an insert. I figured the P52i, while beautiful, was also going to be a beast to pull as I age ( be 64 next month and from there I won't get younger), then crawl into the fireplace and do what ever in there. One of the shops installers one day showed me the cleaning routine on the P61 and I was won over with that. Not as pretty, no sure isn't, and not as tucked away neatly but easy to clean. Just talking here but the store owner would have sold me anything !

 

[Ctcarl]

That's interesting, as I was just looking on amazon ... I did a search for "chimney brush" and one of the hits was for a "Rutland Products PS-4 4-inch round pellet stove brush." It sounded like that would work, but I will need several 5-foot extensions as well, and they are $15 each. I guess it's worth it if it WORKS.

Incidentally, I have no problem at all making time once a week to thoroughly clean the insert -- an hour a week of cleaning to save $1,000 a year on oil is worth it to me. I just wish the instructions were clear, and that dealers didn't make it seem like virtually no maintenance was required. I KNOW they are trying to sell the stoves, but they end up with a lot of people who have no idea how to clean/maintain the appliance, and those dealer cleanings can get REALLY expensive.

Thanks so much to those who have replied, and I would love to hear from anyone else who can help! I will "like" all the replies -- I assume that is like "rep points" on some other forums!

You don't have to pay anybody. You can do it yourself.once you get that bond with your stove you will feel better doing it your self. Yes I used Amazon to buy the Rutland rods and the 4 inch brush. Also here's 7 mins link that is basically what my DVD told me. Just follow step by step and you will be fine . Good luck .

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[fmsm]

Go to the local box store and buy a lint eater dryer vent cleaning kit for 35 bucks, it comes with 12 feet of rods, a 12 ft ext. is like 20 bucks more. Works great, just remember to always go clockwise or tape the connections.

Pull and clean every ton!

 

[NHcpa]

just ordered my accentra insert - install March 12. I was going to run out of firewood for my Jotul so this should help...assuming I find pellets!

 

[alternativeheat]

just ordered my accentra insert - install March 12. I was going to run out of firewood for my Jotul so this should help...assuming I find pellets!

Beautiful stove !!

 

[NHcpa]

Beautiful stove !!

Very much looking forward to it. 3000 sq ft open concept Cape...have been using Jotul Fireside since 1997 and 6 cords of wood. Looking for less work, to be warmer and still have the Jotul for weekends.

 

[Ctcarl]

just ordered my accentra insert - install March 12. I was going to run out of firewood for my Jotul so this should help...assuming I find pellets!

Be sure to get some pics

 

[NHcpa]

Here is a before...don't know why it's sideways...

 

[Ctcarl]

View attachment 128762 Here is a before...don't know why it's sideways...

You getting the rail kitt? I didn't need one luckly

 

[NHcpa]

You getting the rail kitt? I didn't need one luckly

Yes, I purchased the slide kit. Unlike a free standing stove, the insert with rails opens the rear for thorough cleaning.

 

[dradam1]

How much did they pop you for the rail kit, if I may ask?

 

[NHcpa]

How much did they pop you for the rail kit, if I may ask?

It was part of the package deal from stove, install, piping, $139.

 

[NHcpa]

How much did they pop you for the rail kit, if I may ask?

And oh, my wife is from Bucks County - Warrington.

 

[dradam1]

And oh, my wife is from Bucks County - Warrington.

Good deal on getting it in the package. I should have tried that....... She is from the rich part of the county. I'm all the way up in the north part of the county with the poor people.

 

[karen_in_nh_2014]

UPDATE ...

My dealer's tech came this past Monday to fix my insert. He said several of their customers who'd bought this new version of the insert (Accentra 52i) were having the exact same problem, and they (the dealer) fixed it by moving the exhaust probe a few inches (so it "reads" the exhaust better). He had to pull the insert out in order to do this, so he also cleaned out the flue (I'd bought the brush and extension rods from amazon) -- that took just a few minutes and reassured me that it is not at all hard to do (although it looked a bit awkward!). It looked like a lot of ash to me, but he said it wasn't bad at all.

I'd used just under 3 tons of pellets. I've been doing the "regular" cleaning (including removing the inner parts) -- basically everything except pulling the insert out, because what I'd been told was that that would need to be done only once a year. The tech said that is correct, it SHOULD only be needed that often, even if I use (as expected) up to 5 tons a year.

The tech also said the insert looked like I'd been doing the cleaning correctly -- he said it was nothing I'd done or hadn't done. That was reassuring, although I was annoyed that an apparent design flaw seemed to be to blame for the issues I was having. OTOH they only charged me 30 bucks, so I couldn't get too worked up about it!

The insert has been back to normal for the past few days, so my kitties are happy! I expect that I'll use maybe another ton in what's left of this winter, so I'll have 4 tons left for next year -- will buy more this spring to have a bunch in "reserve."

BTW, the tech also said he didn't think the rail system was worth it (my dealer charges $299!).

Just thought I'd update everyone.

 

[alternativeheat]

UPDATE ...

My dealer's tech came this past Monday to fix my insert. He said several of their customers who'd bought this new version of the insert (Accentra 52i) were having the exact same problem, and they (the dealer) fixed it by moving the exhaust probe a few inches (so it "reads" the exhaust better). He had to pull the insert out in order to do this, so he also cleaned out the flue (I'd bought the brush and extension rods from amazon) -- that took just a few minutes and reassured me that it is not at all hard to do (although it looked a bit awkward!). It looked like a lot of ash to me, but he said it wasn't bad at all.

I'd used just under 3 tons of pellets. I've been doing the "regular" cleaning (including removing the inner parts) -- basically everything except pulling the insert out, because what I'd been told was that that would need to be done only once a year. The tech said that is correct, it SHOULD only be needed that often, even if I use (as expected) up to 5 tons a year.

The tech also said the insert looked like I'd been doing the cleaning correctly -- he said it was nothing I'd done or hadn't done. That was reassuring, although I was annoyed that an apparent design flaw seemed to be to blame for the issues I was having. OTOH they only charged me 30 bucks, so I couldn't get too worked up about it!

The insert has been back to normal for the past few days, so my kitties are happy! I expect that I'll use maybe another ton in what's left of this winter, so I'll have 4 tons left for next year -- will buy more this spring to have a bunch in "reserve."

BTW, the tech also said he didn't think the rail system was worth it (my dealer charges $299!).

Just thought I'd update everyone.

That's cool, so you're up and running.! I don't get how he could move the exhaust probe, meaning the ESP ? Or do you mean the room temp probe ? Either way I'm not really getting what he did .