Cleaning your Chimney with additives

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soupy1957

Minister of Fire
Jan 8, 2010
1,365
Connecticut
www.youtube.com
I was perusing a website this morning, looking at the options I have for additives that can be used for creosote buildup that will occur in all wood stove applications, over time.

Obviously we intend to have the Chimney Sweep come out (I know, I know,......many of you do your own), and do a proper cleaning.

However, I'd been exploring the idea of some sort of additive that can be used during the normal burning season, that might help "chip away" (so to speak) at any potential build up that could occur.

Anyone who has been dealing with this topic for any length of time, has learned that maintaining a proper fire is really the biggest thing that any wood burner can do, to keep a clean system; but even THEY will tell you that creosote STILL builds up, and needs to be cleaned. It's just the "nature of the beast" as it were.

So I went to a particular manufacturers website of stove products, and noted the following disclaimer on it's Data Sheet .pdf file:

"For maximum safety: Rutland recommends a professional chimney cleaning, thereafter pursuing a
vigorous preventive maintenance program using Rutland Creosote Remover. The use of Creosote
Remover does not eliminate the need for regular chimney cleaning."

This is obviously the companies "Disclaimer" but............it also tells you something about the product itself. I read an article on one of the recommended websites (recommended by someone in here), which talked about a study done of the additives available out there for chimney cleaning, and basically the article said they saw no noticeable improvement in the stoves in which they used the applications, -vs- the ones that they DIDN'T use the application in.

It was testing done by an Agency similar to Consumer Reports, in which they had a half dozen stoves lined up, burned them the same, (time, wood, intensity, etc), and used a random sample of the most common and readily available creosote sticks, powder (etc) and so forth, in 3 of them, and no additives in the other three. They saw the same creosote levels in all SIX stoves, regardless.

The testing done was somewhat old however, leaving to question if these additives would work any better in the newer EPA-Rated stove equipment. It was conducted in 1986, so there is a wide margin for variance there, (admittedly). I contacted the authors of the study and asked if there had been an updated study done, that reflected the same testing results,but with the newer stoves, and they indicated that there had been "no new Iteration (Revision) to the testing, using the newer stoves."

Based on the study read (cited) and the disclaimers I see, (obviously a CYA thing for this particular manufacturer, and most likely found on any OTHER product manufacturers website or catalog, as well), I am no further moved toward being convinced that these types of additives are really of any significant value. (My opinion only, obviously).

There may be some who believe they work, and will perhaps be able to offer evidence that is irrefutable in that regard, but I have yet to see that data, and I've been looking rather extensively at this issue. If the newer EPA-Rated stove configurations (which in and of themselves, by re-burning the gases, may in fact, decrease the creosote build up potential), were tested, I am curious to see how THEY would fare, in this particular study.


-Soupy1957
 
I think they are a waste of money. I don't have an EPA approved stove. I do burn dry wood, and burn it clean. I clean my chimney once a year, and get about a coffee can full of flaky black stuff. Additives are snake oil, IMO.
 
soupy1957 said:
I was perusing a website this morning, looking at the options I have for additives that can be used for creosote buildup that will occur in all wood stove applications, over time.

Obviously we intend to have the Chimney Sweep come out (I know, I know,......many of you do your own), and do a proper cleaning.

However, I'd been exploring the idea of some sort of additive that can be used during the normal burning season, that might help "chip away" (so to speak) at any potential build up that could occur.

Anyone who has been dealing with this topic for any length of time, has learned that maintaining a proper fire is really the biggest thing that any wood burner can do, to keep a clean system; but even THEY will tell you that creosote STILL builds up, and needs to be cleaned. It's just the "nature of the beast" as it were.

So I went to a particular manufacturers website of stove products, and noted the following disclaimer on it's Data Sheet .pdf file:

"For maximum safety: Rutland recommends a professional chimney cleaning, thereafter pursuing a
vigorous preventive maintenance program using Rutland Creosote Remover. The use of Creosote
Remover does not eliminate the need for regular chimney cleaning."

This is obviously the companies "Disclaimer" but............it also tells you something about the product itself. I read an article on one of the recommended websites (recommended by someone in here), which talked about a study done of the additives available out there for chimney cleaning, and basically the article said they saw no noticeable improvement in the stoves in which they used the applications, -vs- the ones that they DIDN'T use the application in.

It was testing done by an Agency similar to Consumer Reports, in which they had a half dozen stoves lined up, burned them the same, (time, wood, intensity, etc), and used a random sample of the most common and readily available creosote sticks, powder (etc) and so forth, in 3 of them, and no additives in the other three. They saw the same creosote levels in all SIX stoves, regardless.

The testing done was somewhat old however, leaving to question if these additives would work any better in the newer EPA-Rated stove equipment. It was conducted in 1986, so there is a wide margin for variance there, (admittedly). I contacted the authors of the study and asked if there had been an updated study done, that reflected the same testing results,but with the newer stoves, and they indicated that there had been "no new Iteration (Revision) to the testing, using the newer stoves."

Based on the study read (cited) and the disclaimers I see, (obviously a CYA thing for this particular manufacturer, and most likely found on any OTHER product manufacturers website or catalog, as well), I am no further moved toward being convinced that these types of additives are really of any significant value. (My opinion only, obviously).

There may be some who believe they work, and will perhaps be able to offer evidence that is irrefutable in that regard, but I have yet to see that data, and I've been looking rather extensively at this issue. If the newer EPA-Rated stove configurations (which in and of themselves, by re-burning the gases, may in fact, decrease the creosote build up potential), were tested, I am curious to see how THEY would fare, in this particular study.


-Soupy1957


Soupy, I'm sure I've answered this before but your statement that all wood stoves are going to produce creosote is not necessarily true. As I've stated many times, burn dry wood and do not worry about creosote.

Case in point: We've burned our Fireview for 3 full winters and this is our only source of heat. We have cleaned the chimney one time in 3 years but it really did not need it then. We got many a cup of soot; no creosote. I did look into the chimney this summer and it is clean all the way up.

So no, you do not have to have creosote. It is more of a case of people not burning dry enough wood that causes creosote. We've burned wood for over 50 years now and the only time we had creosote were the few years that our wood was not dry enough due to some unfortunate things that happened at the time. Usually we burn wood that has been cut, split and stacked at least 2-3 years. That takes care of the whole problem.
 
and "dry enough" meaning 20% or less moisture content, with no residual chemicals or treatments in the wood.........Agree?

-Soupy1957
 
soupy1957 said:
I read an article on one of the recommended websites (recommended by someone in here), which talked about a study done of the additives available out there for chimney cleaning, and basically the article said they saw no noticeable improvement in the stoves in which they used the applications, -vs- the ones that they DIDN'T use the application in.

It was testing done by an Agency similar to Consumer Reports, in which they had a half dozen stoves lined up, burned them the same, (time, wood, intensity, etc), and used a random sample of the most common and readily available creosote sticks, powder (etc) and so forth, in 3 of them, and no additives in the other three. They saw the same creosote levels in all SIX stoves, regardless.

Soupy, do you have a link to that article? I'm curious.

Those additives don't reduce the amount of creosote formed, they just change the physical properties of it. If you're not getting glaze creosote in your flue, they won't do a darn thing. Most folks never have a problem with glaze creosote.

There is no substitute for proper burning practices. The only additives I use in my stove are dry firewood and air.
 
jeff_t said:
I think they are a waste of money. I don't have an EPA approved stove. I do burn dry wood, and burn it clean. I clean my chimney once a year, and get about a coffee can full of flaky black stuff. Additives are snake oil, IMO.

I have an EPA approved stove, burn somewhat dry wood (I can't seem to get away from being the grasshopper and wind up doing most of my firewood processing in the fall), clean my chinmey once a year and I get nowhere near as mcuh creosite as you do. I get zero accumulation between the stove collar and the outside...all of my creosote winds up stuck to my cap and about the last 2-4 inches of pipe below the cap. I get maybe a cup of crap that I get out of my cap every year. The secert I beleive is to burn it hot and hard daily and really get the flue gasses moving, on their way out they take some of your buildup with them.
 
I marked the link SOMEWHERE in my Browser and will attempt to find it. Can't get my fingers on it right this minute..........will try to locate it, yes.

More and more, as this topic comes up (not so much about additives really, but more about HOW to burn wood in such a way as to keep the level of creosote down, to avoid a chimney fire), I realize that burning correctly really DOES make a difference in the end results.

Those who have "Chimney fires" seem to be those who have a lot of angles in their flue (or at least more severe angles) that are not cleaned out well, and those who (attempt to) burn wet wood, and trash, and who let their fires smolder or burn little bitty fires regularly.

Seems that the "basics" still hold: "burn dry wood/don't burn trash/build a hot fires/minimize angles in the flue pipe/don't let your fire smolder."

-Soupy1957
 
soupy1957 said:
I marked the link SOMEWHERE in my Browser and will attempt to find it. Can't get my fingers on it right this minute..........will try to locate it, yes.

More and more, as this topic comes up (not so much about additives really, but more about HOW to burn wood in such a way as to keep the level of creosote down, to avoid a chimney fire), I realize that burning correctly really DOES make a difference in the end results.

Those who have "Chimney fires" seem to be those who have a lot of angles in their flue (or at least more severe angles) that are not cleaned out well, and those who (attempt to) burn wet wood, and trash, and who let their fires smolder or burn little bitty fires regularly.

Seems that the "basics" still hold: "burn dry wood/don't burn trash/build a hot fires/minimize angles in the flue pipe/don't let your fire smolder."

-Soupy1957

By George, I think he's got it!

Incidentally, no fancy schmancy chemicals for me . . . just burning seasoned wood at the proper temp and no issues with creosote.

I'm with Quads -- just use seasoned wood in the sucker!
 
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