Looking at a used empyre elite 100 for 4k(probably get it for less) a floor model eko 40 for 4200 and the 3500 deal for the Tarm Bonus. Which boiler would you choose? 1100sq foot home with new radiators and probably won't have storage.
Eko 40, empyre elite, or tarm bonus?
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Tarm Bonus
Apparently it doesn't have that large of firebox, which is perhaps good for your 1100 ft2 home. Not sure about not having storage though. I've been told by Tarm 400 gallons is optimum.
I think there've been problems with Empyre and I recall that it isn't a pressurized model.
Apparently it doesn't have that large of firebox, which is perhaps good for your 1100 ft2 home. Not sure about not having storage though. I've been told by Tarm 400 gallons is optimum.
I think there've been problems with Empyre and I recall that it isn't a pressurized model.
maple1
Minister of Fire
Cross the Elite off the list.
I would pick the Tarm - but ask them first about running without storage. The Eko may or may not handle that better - but I would put some storage in regardless, especially with a house that small.
I would pick the Tarm - but ask them first about running without storage. The Eko may or may not handle that better - but I would put some storage in regardless, especially with a house that small.
Ya I don't know if the tarm shuts down and lights up to keep temp? Like the elite and eko do with the ceramic element. If not you would have to have storage.
The eko has electric ignition?
That little Tarm weighs 825 lbs, according to (broken link removed to http://woodboilers.com/media/wysiwyg/Downloads/Product_Brochures/Bonus_Plus_Brochure.pdf)
That little Tarm weighs 825 lbs, according to (broken link removed to http://woodboilers.com/media/wysiwyg/Downloads/Product_Brochures/Bonus_Plus_Brochure.pdf)
That's what the for sale description says, but when I went to the website it doesn't say anyting about a ceramic element. It does say its modulating and burns a load every 6 to 8 hours which I would think is the same thing. The nice thing about the Eko is that it's for sale 3 hours away and the Tarm would have to be shipped which could get expensive since it weighs almost 900 pounds.
maple1
Minister of Fire
Maybe 'ceramic' = refractory?
There's no magic re-ignition stuff going on with any of these boilers. The principal would be, when the boiler gets to temp, it shuts off its draft fan. Then when it cools off to a certain point, the fan starts again. Coals are what supplies the spark. If the down time is too long, it might not reignite. But you will have the best success with some storage - otherwise things will get creosoted, even a gasifier.
There's no magic re-ignition stuff going on with any of these boilers. The principal would be, when the boiler gets to temp, it shuts off its draft fan. Then when it cools off to a certain point, the fan starts again. Coals are what supplies the spark. If the down time is too long, it might not reignite. But you will have the best success with some storage - otherwise things will get creosoted, even a gasifier.
I have the Eko 40 but the Tarm is probably a little bit higher quality from what I have read. I don't believe the Tarm has electronics which can be a good thing. Some of other the Eko users have had to replace a capacitor in the control box that we believe fails because of lack of ventilation. I keep mine separate from the normal enclosure and others have added vents but mine has always worked fine. There is no re-igniter. The Eko fan can be set from 50 to 100% speed which allows me to run at a reduced output without storage. The fan will also slow down on its own as it approaches the set temp. When in idle mode, it runs the fan for a few seconds every 10 minutes or so. This is what keeps the fire from going out. I'm not sure but I assume Tarm does something similar although their fan may just run at 1 or 2 speeds like an Econoburn. The Empire is one to avoid as others have mentioned.
You must have started exploring this thinking these machines are sort of magic and actually change the way wood burns. Get that out of your head. They cycle the combustion fan on and off according to temperature settings on the aquastat. Eliminating the air supply is a poor and nasty way to extinguish a fire. The only way to do it correctly is to remove the fuel supply which the fossil fueled appliances to and now some pellet appliances do. These cord wood machines haven't learned how to do that yet. At Idle (no combustion air being supplied) these things are tar factories. The only way around this is to burn hot and continuously 'till the fuel is consumed.
I have a 1100 sq ft home I'm heating with an EKO 25 and wasn't able to get my storage installed the first winter. Believe me, it was a stinking, nasty mess. Had an odiferous drip pan under the flue pipe to catch the tar.
Take the EKO 40 off your list, It's too large for your house unless you spend the winter with your windows open. You will have the same problem with the other units but to a lesser extent.
I have a 1100 sq ft home I'm heating with an EKO 25 and wasn't able to get my storage installed the first winter. Believe me, it was a stinking, nasty mess. Had an odiferous drip pan under the flue pipe to catch the tar.
Take the EKO 40 off your list, It's too large for your house unless you spend the winter with your windows open. You will have the same problem with the other units but to a lesser extent.
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Ive owned an eko 40 for about five years now, it does the job . Mine will most likely be for sale come summer time. I wish I had bought a larger higher end boiler now .
I have an EKO 25. It heats my water and 2200 sq.ft ranch with 9' walls fine. It doesn't tar up much at all but I use very dry wood. I ran the 1" copper to a HX above the furnace. It didn't work to my satisfaction without storage. I decided to run 1,000 ft 1/2" pex under half the house. This works very well. The floor in the kitchen and family room is comfy. Laying on the carpet is warm. I also ran some in the master bath to keep the tile from being cold, but of course my wife says it is not enough. I didnt do the pex the fancy way like others. No zones at all. I just tap into the 1"pipe. Works really good off one pump. Also, if the house is insulated good, the 25 will roast you unless it is -25 and windy.
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The more I think about it I think I'm gonna stick it in the shed. Do you think a heat exchanger and a hot tub would kinda work as storage? Would love to get one of these free broken hot tubs and convert it to heat off the boiler.
It could be heat storage for your boiler if it were built to withstand 180 degree water and the only thing other thing you wanted to use the tub for is scalding chickens in order to pluck them.
Of course I am not gonna keep a hot tub at 180* but keeping hundreds of gallons of water a 100* will add significant load to the system and keep it from short cycling/smoldering I would imagine. I called Tarm today and they say you need atleast 400 gallons of storage with the bonus. Shipping is gonna be around 500 bucks. So I am thinking I can get that thing shipped and installed with an old propane tank for the price of a floor model Eko 40. Easy decision.
maple1
Minister of Fire
I was on here a year ago asking the same questions when we put the house together, but the budget started getting short and my plumber offered me a nice NG boiler for 200 bucks. That and my buddy/contractor/financier was completely against a wood boiler. So I now have a great system with Myson radiators that keeps my house very cozy, but costs 60-200 bucks a month to heat. Wood is cheap and plentiful around here and it would be awesome to be able to not worry about the next bill.
Karl_northwind
Minister of Fire
The nice thing is with 500 gallons storage, you can use a single 500 gallon LP tank and not have to weld anything. the newer ones even have a drain at the bottom so you can attach a pipe there for your boiler/heating supply return. if you use an older one, you may have to fabricate a dip tube or 2 to get to the tank bottom.
karl
karl
That boiler size might be a good match for your house size. I still can't believe it weighs 825 pounds.
I found a old 600 gallon propane tank for $350. It has a large outlet on the bottom and 3 or 4 more inline up to the top on one side of the tank. It even has a frame on the bottom to keep it off the ground. Anybody have any problems using these without cleaning? Guy said it's been outta service sitting for years.
Take the plugs out of the bottom and use a pressure washer in through the top three holes . I got quite a bit of Schmegg out of my two tanks .. I also put a gallon of 6% chlorine in each and filled them up toilet them soak for a few days.
Lack of experience prohibits me from answering your question but I recommend buying it anyway. How hard would it be to clean it?
Getting back to your hot tub idea. I don't believe maintaining 100 degree temperature water would put any significant load on your boiler. This belief comes from an incident I experienced with a hot tub (spa) several years ago. I had a 6 person tub in a solarium and heated with it the normal electric element plugged into a 20 amp wall socket.
One evening when I was about to take my nightly dip I whipped my left foot over the side and into the water. It just about peeled the skin off. It appears that I had left the light on from the previous session and that had heated several hundred gallons of water above tolerable levels.That's the load your boiler will see. Not much!!
When people here ask about keeping a OWB from freezing I often think of that incident but feel reluctant to recommend a light bulb as a heating unit although actually an incandescent bulb is a heater that emits light and an LED is a light that emits a little heat.
Getting back to your hot tub idea. I don't believe maintaining 100 degree temperature water would put any significant load on your boiler. This belief comes from an incident I experienced with a hot tub (spa) several years ago. I had a 6 person tub in a solarium and heated with it the normal electric element plugged into a 20 amp wall socket.
One evening when I was about to take my nightly dip I whipped my left foot over the side and into the water. It just about peeled the skin off. It appears that I had left the light on from the previous session and that had heated several hundred gallons of water above tolerable levels.That's the load your boiler will see. Not much!!
When people here ask about keeping a OWB from freezing I often think of that incident but feel reluctant to recommend a light bulb as a heating unit although actually an incandescent bulb is a heater that emits light and an LED is a light that emits a little heat.
Gonna order my Tarm Bonus today. I think that little guy with 600 gallons of storage will be awesome. Gonna try to get it installed for the price of the floor model Eko. Where do I find the best deal on insulated pex to put in the ground?
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