have anyone noticed a change in chainsaws or small motors using ethaneol, my saw start running at extreme high speed used it in about 3 tank fulls then change back to gas with out ethaneol running better THANKS
ethaneol
- Thread starter tnroadkill
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tnroadkill said:
That's because you are running your saw lean...that is, there isn't as much energy in a given volume of ethanol as there is in a given volume of gasoline. To run with ethanol, for starters the fuel charge must be richened. How much exactly I don't know.
Is it running hot as well?. There is a bit more leeway in running lean on ethanol as there is less energy and therefore less heat but were it me i'd go back to strait gas.
How to ajust carb on stihl pro saws http://web.archive.org/web/20051018212959/www.madsens1.com/sawtune.htm
listen to the “Saw Idle Adjustment Sound WAV” “once you here it you will never forget it”
listen to the “Saw Idle Adjustment Sound WAV” “once you here it you will never forget it”
smokinj said:
If you run your saws with it in it you are asking for a meltdown! use BP ultimate and good oil and you will not have any problems. I get to make lots of money from rebuilds do to todays fuels.
Rob
Stihl web site says its ok! i dont unless i have to, small carb adjust is all it takes.taxidermist said:
smokinj said:
Yeah they are also the ones to sell you the new parts to rebuild the saw. My saw bench says DO NOT USE IT
! unless you want to rebuild your saw
taxidermist said:
For many of us it is not really practical to drive 500 miles to get gas without ethanol. In other words, we have no choice in the matter.
Al
I like ethanol. I'd way rather give my money to a farmer than a mid east terrorist or commie dictator in south america. Set my car and truck up to burn E85. But the small two stroke stuff is where I draw the line. It seems like such a fine balance...you've basically got an engine spinning at 10,000+ rpm, lubed only by a fog of gasoline and 1 part in ~40 of oil. On top of that, the oil has so many conflicting requirements for performance that it's not even funny. Most all small engines I have came with a note that up to 10% ethanol (ie "E10" gasoline) is ok. I've run that in everything and never had a problem or really noticed a difference in performance.
I hear there is a new two-stroke oil coming out that is fully ethanol compatible. Might be fun to try that some day...see if I can take advantage of the 105 octane in E85 and really make some wood chips fly! But for 'normal' use I wouldn't recommend more than E10 - at that level, you shouldn't really need any additional carb tuning or adjustments
I hear there is a new two-stroke oil coming out that is fully ethanol compatible. Might be fun to try that some day...see if I can take advantage of the 105 octane in E85 and really make some wood chips fly! But for 'normal' use I wouldn't recommend more than E10 - at that level, you shouldn't really need any additional carb tuning or adjustments
I've had problems in my outboard and my truck, but none so far in the chainsaw. I found a source that doesn't have ethanol in it so I will be able to run the small engines on straight gas for a while longer.
Matt
Matt
If it really bothers you, run race gas. It somewhere above 100 octane, but pure. Smells pretty good, but also about 2x as much as others. Run the highest pump gas you can get and you should be good.
- Oct 3, 2007
- 1,539
I'm new to this whole game just bought my first saw (Echo CS400) about a month ago. I bought a gallon of regular gas (87 octane) and mixed it up with oil the proper proportions and proceeded to use the saw. I had a hell of a time cutting into a 6" diameter pine tree and I thought that maybe thought the chain was new that it needed to be sharpened. The saw bogged easily and just didn't seem to have enough power-is this due to the ethanol content? It was listed on the pump as 10%. What can I do to give the fuel a little extra kick-octane booster? In my turbo four cylinder days we used to add toulene to Sunoco Ultra 94 to get the octane rating up above 105, so adding some to this batch ought to get it into the mid 90s easily. Otherwise I can just dump this batch in my Toyota pickup-one gallon of mixed fuel shouldn't be that big of a deal diluted in 20 gallons of straight gas.
if its not running good get rid of it and go with 93 octane til you get it broke in.B.P. 93 octane gas is really god saw gas as mention,but not always easy to get to.Badfish740 said:
- Oct 3, 2007
- 1,539
The only reason I say BP/Amaco is they have the lowest or none in their gas You can run any gas as long as it is high octane and low EA. I too would rather give money to the farmers but I dont want to have to rebuild my saws at a toon of 300.00 per shot.
I also have an Echo CS-400. It runs and cuts great, with lots of power. I run a 16" bar on it instead of the 18" it came with (I never tried the 18"). I've only used 89 octane in it, since that's what the owner's manual specifies. I would feel fine using higher octane gas, but I would not use 87 octane in it.
taxidermist said:
BP/Amoco has the lowest or none of WHAT in their gas? What is low EA?
I agree with you & do run 93 octane in my saws. Around here we have no choice about ethanol. It was crammed down our throats. Doing all the work myself, it ended up costing me about $5000 to replace my perfectly good fiberglass gas tank in my boat. Had to rip a teak deck up, sawsall out a bulkhead & then a perfectly good 275 gal. tank. Had new tank built & fabricated custom hold down brackets. Re-glassed the bulkhead back in & then re-did the deck. I was NOT a happy person. It was either do all that or risk losing both 454 engines. I DON'T LIKE ETHANOL
!!Al
Badfish740 said:
IMHO, I would have the saw looked at and tuned up. 10% ethanol should not change the characteristics of the fuel enough to matter. If it is out of tune with regular gas, it is out of tune with 10% ethanol gas and throwing more octane (hence money) at it, won't fix a thing.
Additionally, more octane does not automatically equal more power. Octane only allows you to run more compression or boost which in turn makes more power. If the owners manual for the saw said to use 87, then you should be fine with that, unless you have boosted compression on the saw or added a turbo or supercharger
OOH! A blown chainsaw; what an idea! Maybe nitrous?
Sorry to heat about your bad experience, Al. There's lots of people in the same boat (no pun intended).
I always thought ethanol raised the octane anyway. High octane is a waste in most engines as it only prevents premature detonation (knocking). It doesn't add power, unless you can raise compression to take advantage of it. CNG has an octane of about 120-130 and it does nothing for performane. trust me. All the gas around here has ethanol as an oxygenate to help reduce pollution. They used to use MTBE, but that caused problems when it got out in the groundwater. I think most states on the East coast have oxygenated fuels; apparently, all the way to Maine!
The new chain saw is probably running a little rich as most manufacturers do this for break in. After you foul the plug, take it back to the dealer and have them readjust the carb. I wouldn't lean it out until it has a few hours on it.
Chris
Sorry to heat about your bad experience, Al. There's lots of people in the same boat (no pun intended).
I always thought ethanol raised the octane anyway. High octane is a waste in most engines as it only prevents premature detonation (knocking). It doesn't add power, unless you can raise compression to take advantage of it. CNG has an octane of about 120-130 and it does nothing for performane. trust me. All the gas around here has ethanol as an oxygenate to help reduce pollution. They used to use MTBE, but that caused problems when it got out in the groundwater. I think most states on the East coast have oxygenated fuels; apparently, all the way to Maine!
The new chain saw is probably running a little rich as most manufacturers do this for break in. After you foul the plug, take it back to the dealer and have them readjust the carb. I wouldn't lean it out until it has a few hours on it.
Chris
All I have run in may saws is the 10% blend and the same for all the lawn equipment 2 or 4 stroke and I have never had any issues with any of it. My O19 Stihl runs like the day I bought it 11 years ago and it has cut more over sized trees then it ever should have and has an oversized bar as well on it.
lobsta1 said:taxidermist said:
BP/Amoco has the lowest or none of WHAT in their gas? What is low EA?
I agree with you & do run 93 octane in my saws. Around here we have no choice about ethanol. It was crammed down our throats. Doing all the work myself, it ended up costing me about $5000 to replace my perfectly good fiberglass gas tank in my boat. Had to rip a teak deck up, sawsall out a bulkhead & then a perfectly good 275 gal. tank. Had new tank built & fabricated custom hold down brackets. Re-glassed the bulkhead back in & then re-did the deck. I was NOT a happy person. It was either do all that or risk losing both 454 engines. I DON'T LIKE ETHANOL
Al[/quo
I ment E or Ethanol they have the lowest amount in our area.
Echo does indeed want you to run a minimum of 89 octane. Unless it just won't perform I wouldn't change a setting until you put at least 1 or 2 tanks of gas through it. The directions for adjusting are listed in the manual if it is needed. The CS-400 is not a powerful saw, by that I mean you can stall it pretty easy if you try and horse it through the log, especially if its new and not broke in. Just let it cut at its own rate while holding a decent RPM. I say this not to offend anyone on their form of operation but rather because I know people that have used saws for years and still don't actually know how to use one properly.
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