Grandma bear smoking into the house...

[HunterDan]

So I lit up my new to me grandma bear this evening. The gentleman I bought it from painted it, which I think is where issue #2 is coming from. Issue #1, im hoping is a easy fix?

So I started a small fire in the stove tonight, got kindling lit along with a few bigger pieces ontop of it.

Issue #1
Stove top gauge (I have it on the slanted part between the upper and lower flat pieces, is that ok?) was reading about 450, draft caps still about 2-2.5 turns open, flue damper 3/4 to full open. Out of no where smoke started coming out the joint between the stove and damper connection. I shut the dampers all the way and it stopped a few seconds later. I opened up all the windows/fans on to clear it out.

Stove temp got at or below 325-350, I opened the draft caps 3/4 turn or so and let it heat back up, and as it did sure enough it started coming back out the connection again. Shut the dampers, waved the smoke away to shut off the smoke alarms and at this point I think I'm gonna let it die out and try again another night.

Issue # 2

When it got 450-475 there was smoke kind of coming off the right side of the stove. I looked at all the welds and they look great, just seem to be maybe burning off the fresh paint?


I think I'm going to get some hi temp stove sealant and "caulk" that joint between the stove and the damper. I had to buy a pipe crimper? (Unsure of the name) to get it to fit. I put some of that hi temp sealant inside before I slipped the pipe in, but guess that's not enough. Can I deal up that joint?

 

[jatoxico]

Sounds like a draft issue. What are the outside temps by you right now? Any chance there's a blockage? At the cap maybe?

 

[HunterDan]

The temp is probably around 55-60. This is all new install chimney (my first fire in it) so I know it's clean and no blockage. The cap is open (no screen in it)

I ran the stove with the load I had in there all the way down to burning coals (right now) with the damper full open and about 3/4-1 turn on the draft knobs. It stayed between 400-450 and no more smoke came into the house.

I planned on heating with this stove mainly all winter, but if something like this could happen out of nowhere, I may not be leaving it running during the day. I have 2 dogs that are crated during the day, and if this smoke started filling the house with us at work, I'm sure you know the outcome of that

 

[jatoxico]

You can seal the joint but basically the stove was producing more gas than it could expel = weak draft. 55-60 isn't very cool and other factors like wind can come into play. May behave very different when the temps drop.

How soon into the burn did you start cutting air (flue up to temp)? Can you give some details on the install? Total length of chimney, any bends? How about some pics inside and out?

 

[coaly]

Connection is fine, you're not letting enough heat up the chimney.
Stove top temp won't give you much information for chimney temp. You need the thermometer on the connector pipe before it enters chimney.
It will read about half the internal flue gas temp on the outside of pipe.
The key is keeping the gasses inside the chimney flue above 250* all the way to the top when smoke is present. This maintains proper draft and prevents condensing of water vapor in chimney which allows smoke particles to stick, forming creosote rapidly. Your chimney flue was not hot enough and the flue damper should have been open with doors shut. Only use it for open door burning with screen in place until you know where to set it. (The flue damper adds needed resistance which varies with pipe configuration and chimney flue, altitude, as well as temperature and atmospheric pressure. So no one can tell you where to set it) It is required with doors closed to slow a chimney with too much draft. It is a chimney control which affects the stove. The flue damper becomes your only control with doors open in Fireplace Mode.

The new paint will smoke during final cure. Each time you get the stove a little hotter you will smell it.

*** Post #10 here gives you the basics of what makes the stove work, and basic operation; It's all about the chimney, not the stove. When you understand the chimney is not only to carry smoke out of the house, but it is what makes the stove work, you'll understand any leaks into the stove or pipe allows inside air IN, not smoke out. ***
https://www.hearth.com/talk/threads/how-to-service-my-papa-bear-stove.156993/

 

[HunterDan]

Thank you both for the input!

Jat:
Chimney is 8" from stove to end of the chimney, straight up through my living room, attic above it and out the roof. The single wall in the living room is about 5', then 12' of class a chimney pipe up through the attic and out the roof. It sits about 5' above the ridge of the roof.


Coaly:
When you say connector pipe before it enters chimney, do you mean where the single wall pipe goes into the cieling support box?

How much smoke do you think the paint will put off? Enough to set smoke alarm?


Could you lay out the basics of starting a fire in this stove?

Should I light a ball of paper in there by itself first to warm up the flue? Then put my smaller kindling in with a few larger logs, flue damper full open, light the kindling, close the doors with the caps open 2 turns? How do I know when to close the caps more? What should I run the stove top temp at? Or should I be trying to keep at certain flue temp and not worry about the stove top

 

[jatoxico]

Thank you both for the input!

Jat:
Chimney is 8" from stove to end of the chimney, straight up through my living room, attic above it and out the roof. The single wall in the living room is about 5', then 12' of class a chimney pipe up through the attic and out the roof. It sits about 5' above the ridge of the roof.


Coaly:
When you say connector pipe before it enters chimney, do you mean where the single wall pipe goes into the cieling support box?

How much smoke do you think the paint will put off? Enough to set smoke alarm?


Could you lay out the basics of starting a fire in this stove?

Should I light a ball of paper in there by itself first to warm up the flue? Then put my smaller kindling in with a few larger logs, flue damper full open, light the kindling, close the doors with the caps open 2 turns? How do I know when to close the caps more? What should I run the stove top temp at? Or should I be trying to keep at certain flue temp and not worry about the stove top

Coaly is the expert here so I'll defer but off hand the chimney length and dia is fine. Sounds like a warm day w/ too cold a flue temp. You'll most likely figure it out as you get used to the setup but sending more heat up early to get everything to temp should help especially at startup on warmer days.

 

[coaly]

It can be enough to set off a smoke alarm. That's why I always recommend connecting a couple pieces of pipe on the stove outside and cure the paint outdoors. Depending on the paint, some are worse than others.

If you were trying to exhaust smoke from the house with a mechanical fan, that will bring the smoke right in as well. When you understand the principal of the hot gasses rising up the flue to make the "vacuum" in the stove to allow the PUSH of atmospheric air pressure in, you'll realize every fan that exhausts air out of the house depressurizes the home. You no longer have enough atmospheric air pressure inside the house to push into the stove intakes. So a kitchen range exhaust fan, bathroom fan, clothes dryer, even oil or gas burners that exhaust to the outside pull air from the home. If no window is cracked near the stove (for atmospheric air pressure to get to the stove intakes) and the house is tight, the chimney becomes the only air INTAKE. So the rising gasses are competing with mechanical blowers. These are very minute pressures less than your breath. In rare cases a stairway near the stove can allow heat to rise so rapidly, the heat moving away from stove becomes a lower pressure area than the inside of a cool chimney and the intakes become exhaust. This is called stack effect, only in certain configurations with a poor drafting chimney should this happen.

I start with paper or cardboard and kindling on top. Open flue damper and spin draft caps open 2 or 3 turns. Light and close doors. When you hear a roar going up pipe, I slowly close the flue damper until the roar stops. This allows air pressure pushing in the intakes to give the fire as much oxygen as it needs. If you slow the roar with air intakes, you starve the fire of oxygen and this is not the time you want to do that. Open damper in a few minutes before opening door to add larger pieces of wood. Close doors and it should come back to a dull roar and you should be able to close down to about 2 turns. If the roar continues, tilt damper enough to slow it down. You're trying to prevent most of the heat from rushing up the stack so the heat is used to get the larger pieces going. As the stove comes up to temp you should be able to open damper and close intakes down to about a turn. If you notice a lot of smoke coming out of chimney, give it more air. (when you noticed smoke leakage, you should have opened flue damper and opened air intakes to kick up the fire instead of closing it down cooling the chimney further) I usually have an established fire in about 10 minutes. Fuel has a lot to do with it and you'll learn which makes good kindling. Place wood in so the flames have to change direction to get up through the wood pieces. When starting keep air space between wood pieces as much as possible.

If you have the fire screen, you can also use it to start fires very easily. It will give the fire all the air it can get and you can close doors as soon as fire is established. This is a trick to starting with damp kindling which is never good, but can help in an emergency situation when that is all you have. This is another reason I prefer single door Bear Series stoves. Logs put in lengthwise get air rushing down between them and the air rushing in sounds like an oil burner. They start easier than your wide firebox getting air across the wood. It's all about oxygen mixing with flammable gasses as they are expelled from the heated wood. Flames are the ignited gasses coming out of the wood.

After a couple fires you'll learn the tricks to make it take right off. It will act differently with a bed of ash as well. When removing ash always leave about an inch to burn on. If you keep the stove going, you won't be starting with paper and cardboard. Simply remove a little ash in the morning from the front where it burns down overnight. Rake some ash ahead with coals. Lay kindling on the glowing coals and open damper as well as intakes a few turns. It should take right off and be able to add larger wood within minutes. Again, you should be back to 1 turn open as it comes up to temp.

The thermometer is calibrated for single wall pipe. Without an IR thermometer checking pipe and chimney flue at the top, you can only guess the temperature drop to the top from where you put the thermometer. With an established fire, try it a foot above stove on pipe (heat from stove will affect it as well this low) then raise it and note how much it cools. Check pipe temp where it dumps into insulated chimney at box. Figure 300* at this location is going to be close to 600* flue gas temp, so depending on chimney size and material cooling to the top is a guess. 250* internal is the temp to stay above all the way up. This is why an insulated chimney performs best, staying hot inside with less heat needed to be lost up the flue. You will know by how much creosote forms. Check it frequently and if it stays clean, close damper very slightly and monitor temps and how much creosote forms. It will only form creosote when smoke is present, so in the coaling stage temps will be down doing no harm. You can even close the damper with a pile of coals to prolong the burn, but until you get used to it, err on the side of leaving it open more than closed.

Stove top temperature doesn't mean much and varies from lower and upper cooking surfaces. As a general rule, with a baffle in the stove I adjust baffle for twice the stove top temp as the single wall pipe a foot above damper. That gives you about 550 to 600* stove top at 300* pipe temp. (fine for an insulated chimney with short vertical pipe run) Move the thermometer around with a gloved hand and record temps to get an idea what stove temps are compared to pipe temps. An IR thermometer is instant and worth the investment. Same as a moisture meter. I highly recommend both.

 

[CamFan]

It can be enough to set off a smoke alarm. That's why I always recommend connecting a couple pieces of pipe on the stove outside and cure the paint outdoors. Depending on the paint, some are worse than others.

If you were trying to exhaust smoke from the house with a mechanical fan, that will bring the smoke right in as well. When you understand the principal of the hot gasses rising up the flue to make the "vacuum" in the stove to allow the PUSH of atmospheric air pressure in, you'll realize every fan that exhausts air out of the house depressurizes the home. You no longer have enough atmospheric air pressure inside the house to push into the stove intakes. So a kitchen range exhaust fan, bathroom fan, clothes dryer, even oil or gas burners that exhaust to the outside pull air from the home. If no window is cracked near the stove (for atmospheric air pressure to get to the stove intakes) and the house is tight, the chimney becomes the only air INTAKE. So the rising gasses are competing with mechanical blowers. These are very minute pressures less than your breath. In rare cases a stairway near the stove can allow heat to rise so rapidly, the heat moving away from stove becomes a lower pressure area than the inside of a cool chimney and the intakes become exhaust. This is called stack effect, only in certain configurations with a poor drafting chimney should this happen.

I start with paper or cardboard and kindling on top. Open flue damper and spin draft caps open 2 or 3 turns. Light and close doors. When you hear a roar going up pipe, I slowly close the flue damper until the roar stops. This allows air pressure pushing in the intakes to give the fire as much oxygen as it needs. If you slow the roar with air intakes, you starve the fire of oxygen and this is not the time you want to do that. Open damper in a few minutes before opening door to add larger pieces of wood. Close doors and it should come back to a dull roar and you should be able to close down to about 2 turns. If the roar continues, tilt damper enough to slow it down. You're trying to prevent most of the heat from rushing up the stack so the heat is used to get the larger pieces going. As the stove comes up to temp you should be able to open damper and close intakes down to about a turn. If you notice a lot of smoke coming out of chimney, give it more air. (when you noticed smoke leakage, you should have opened flue damper and opened air intakes to kick up the fire instead of closing it down cooling the chimney further) I usually have an established fire in about 10 minutes. Fuel has a lot to do with it and you'll learn which makes good kindling. Place wood in so the flames have to change direction to get up through the wood pieces. When starting keep air space between wood pieces as much as possible.

If you have the fire screen, you can also use it to start fires very easily. It will give the fire all the air it can get and you can close doors as soon as fire is established. This is a trick to starting with damp kindling which is never good, but can help in an emergency situation when that is all you have. This is another reason I prefer single door Bear Series stoves. Logs put in lengthwise get air rushing down between them and the air rushing in sounds like an oil burner. They start easier than your wide firebox getting air across the wood. It's all about oxygen mixing with flammable gasses as they are expelled from the heated wood. Flames are the ignited gasses coming out of the wood.

After a couple fires you'll learn the tricks to make it take right off. It will act differently with a bed of ash as well. When removing ash always leave about an inch to burn on. If you keep the stove going, you won't be starting with paper and cardboard. Simply remove a little ash in the morning from the front where it burns down overnight. Rake some ash ahead with coals. Lay kindling on the glowing coals and open damper as well as intakes a few turns. It should take right off and be able to add larger wood within minutes. Again, you should be back to 1 turn open as it comes up to temp.

The thermometer is calibrated for single wall pipe. Without an IR thermometer checking pipe and chimney flue at the top, you can only guess the temperature drop to the top from where you put the thermometer. With an established fire, try it a foot above stove on pipe (heat from stove will affect it as well this low) then raise it and note how much it cools. Check pipe temp where it dumps into insulated chimney at box. Figure 300* at this location is going to be close to 600* flue gas temp, so depending on chimney size and material cooling to the top is a guess. 250* internal is the temp to stay above all the way up. This is why an insulated chimney performs best, staying hot inside with less heat needed to be lost up the flue. You will know by how much creosote forms. Check it frequently and if it stays clean, close damper very slightly and monitor temps and how much creosote forms. It will only form creosote when smoke is present, so in the coaling stage temps will be down doing no harm. You can even close the damper with a pile of coals to prolong the burn, but until you get used to it, err on the side of leaving it open more than closed.

Stove top temperature doesn't mean much and varies from lower and upper cooking surfaces. As a general rule, with a baffle in the stove I adjust baffle for twice the stove top temp as the single wall pipe a foot above damper. That gives you about 550 to 600* stove top at 300* pipe temp. (fine for an insulated chimney with short vertical pipe run) Move the thermometer around with a gloved hand and record temps to get an idea what stove temps are compared to pipe temps. An IR thermometer is instant and worth the investment. Same as a moisture meter. I highly recommend both.

 

[HunterDan]

So it happened again last night, just once this time.

I cracked the window by the stove about 3 inches. I did everything you said, kindling and small wood, closed the doors had the caps open about 3 turns. About 10 minutes In put some bigger pieces in, closed the doors/caps to 2 turns. Was letting it heat up and was in the kitchen and the smoke alarm started to go off and I looked in and smoke seemed to be radiating off the pipe, or was just running up the outside of the pipe. I spun the caps open like
You said and it got hotter and made it worse, so I spun them shut and within a minute the smoke stopped.

Opened all the windows again to get the smoke out. When it was smoking I glanced at the thermometer on the flue, and it read about 450-500. Outdoor Temp was 40-42. I think I let it get to much oxygen/to hot? But why would smoke start to come into the house?

Once I got things settled down, I opened the draft caps 3/4 - 1 turn and filled up the fire box and ran it the rest of the night no problems.


Any ideas? Did I just get it to hot? It seems like I'm Having this problem only when getting it started, once it's hot everything's fine

 

[CamFan]

It was mentioned that he noticed smoke at the side of the stove which may be paint curing. He could be correct here or it could be another thing and it will only happen if the draft is bad as described. During the building process the stove parts are all tacked together and welded on the inside corners. the top is put in place and tacked. It is then turned over on its top and welded after the legs are in place. this leaves a 1 1/2" in both directions area where the top is not welded behind the leg. which in a bad draft situation you could see smoke coming out from around the leg, and it could be any of them. This caused many on site warranty repairs. To solve the problem in the factory when the stove was upside down the top was welded to the stove body 2-21/2" in each direction at the legs. prior to painting we used high pressure air to check to be sure it was sealed, if not back to the welder. If it is an early stove this step may not have been done. it is easy to see when you know what your are looking for. You could seal the angle iron leg at the edge of the angle if you wanted to instead of welding inside. It is such a small spot and like I said it only came in play if there was a bad draft at some point. There is nothing we can do about mother nature, but we can fix an incorrect install.
I've been heating with wood and installing stoves since 1974 full time. I can not count the times that the first fire I built smoked back on me. I installed a new burn display in our store this year. I is the correct size pipe, and about a 35' tall chimney. We had a cold morning so I made the break in fire per the manual. It smoked like @#$% for the first few minutes (maybe 10-15) . the chimney had a air lock and once it heated up it took off. It has set now for a week or so so It may smoke back again but probably not. What you have been told here prior to my post are correct things to look for and check. I have never mentioned the leg leak here before to my knowledge.

 

[jatoxico]

I don't have a Fisher so no comment on whether you followed Coaly's procedure. From your previous post you have about 17' total chimney? This stove is not in a basement is it? And as already mentioned other exhaust fans in competition like kitchen fan, dryer can cause trouble.

Can you please post some pictures of the unit and chimney and a shot or two or the exterior stack? Trees, adjacent rooflines and other things can effect draft. Maybe something will click.

 

[coaly]

Normal. You're probably not getting wood smoke. I'm sure it's burning off the fresh paint. (did he tell you what paint he used??) By bringing the temp up on the pipe, the paint is probably cured. Next fire should be fine.
As it sits all summer, dust settles on the pipe and stove and even after cleaning or dusting you will get a hot metal smell the first fire, but nothing like new pipe or a freshly painted stove.
Now that you've had a couple fires, you have evaporated all the moisture absorbed into the firebrick from humid air all summer. Heat output will feel much greater and as it gets colder you'll find heat output higher.

 

[HunterDan]

Thank you guys for all the input. I am planning on another fire tonight (it's mid 50's during the day so don't feel the need to keep it going.)

I'll also snap some pics tonight and post them

 

[coaly]

When I suggested opening draft caps and damper, it was for wood smoke leaking in at a pipe joint. The chimney would be too cool and it needs oxygen to kick up the fire increasing the draft.
This time it sounds like you got the pipe hotter than before and it was normal paint burn off. Opening air inlet would heat pipe even more making it smoke more as you explained.
You'll find when starting it the kindling heats the pipe more than burning larger wood. When starting, the open air intakes allow more flow up the stack so the flames are going out the connector pipe. That's why I recommend closing damper enough to stop the roar when starting. It prevents the pipe from getting so hot and retains more in the stove to preheat the larger pieces. Once established with 1/2 to 1 turn, it slows the flow allowing more heat to be absorbed and radiated by stove and pipe temp will stabilize. I've found addition of a baffle inside evens out the temp spikes making it much more stable.

 

[HunterDan]

Ok I wanted to wait a little bit before I posted, don't want to jinx myself, but everything tonight has been very good, smooth sailing so far.

One thing I did notice was there was a lot of ash from only burning the last 2 nights, is that normal? I shoveled most out, leaving about an inch as you said. I started it up about 630, started with smaller pieces and some cardboard. Closed the doors with the caps open about 4 turns +\- and damper about half closed. Have thermometer about 18" off the stove top, it read about 200 and I put some bigger pieces in. let them heat up and start catching. Then I closed the caps to about 2 turns. Let thing warm up to about 375-400 on the flue pipe, and closed the caps down to 1 turn. Once it cruised for a bit and steadied out, I put bigger pieces in and filled the box about 3/4 of the way.

It's been about 2 hours now and no smoke inside which is a good thing! What temp should I aim to keep the stove pipe at? It's about 18" off the stove, and I've been running it about 350 or so? Is that a decent temp to keep things burning clean? (Less creosote?) should I close the damper any while the stove is cruising? I have it open now.

Also, how much smoke should I be producing while the stoves cruising? When the flue temp reads 375-400, there's a steady plume of smoke, but I wouldn't say overly smoky. Here's a pic of the smoke, almost a full load in the box, caps open 1 turn and therm reading about 350.



When I load more wood, should I just open the door, load the wood and close it up? Leaving the draft caps at 1 turn? Or do I have to adjust them to get the new wood to light?

I do plan on doing a baffle, I'm looking for a place locally that I can get the steel plate from... I'd rather do that than the angle iron with fire bricks.

 

[HunterDan]

Here's the promised pics.

As stated, there is about 5 foot of single wall above the stove, then 12' of stainless class a through a small attic and up to the roof.

The distance between the house and the pipe is a little over 13 feet, and the pipe is about 4.5' higher than the ridge vent (on that part of the roof)

 

[coaly]

Height and connection should be ok, but when you have the stove in a low portion of the building that there is a large area to rise into quickly, the rising inside fights the draft, so you do have to keep it hot. The insulated chimney should do that for you. A larger flue in a masonry chimney in that situation could be troublesome.

With stabilized temp at 350 at 18" up, I'd put it on the pipe where it enters chimney box to see how much cooler it is there. Double it for internal temp and guess how much it will cool rising up the insulated flue. I keep my 6 inch pipe on a 7 inch stove about 300 at 18" high and clean once mid season. I burn 24/7 using it as the only heat source. Creosote will form more near the top where it is coolest and on the screen where wind can cool the vapor as it exits. Of course wood has a lot to do with it. The baffle reduces stack temp slightly so you use less damper with a baffle but the difference is in the reduced smoke output. Less creosote forms at the same or lower temperature when there is much less smoke particles.

To answer your question about flue damper setting; Factors will change that all the time, but you can get an idea of how much draft you have when doors are open for loading. If you have a spark screen open doors and install screen. Otherwise, open to load and close damper slowly while watching smoke at the top collect and start to roll in. Open a bit to prevent roll in. That is the adjustment for proper draft at that given time with doors open. I think that gives you a starting point when closed, but it's just a guess. If you close doors and temp drops excessively, obviously you have to open it more. Trial and error. I go by time and how much creosote is formed. Every stove has a recommended pressure at flue collar (the lowest pressure area) which gives the correct flow through fire. It is more critical with coal stoves and should be set using an adjustable barometric damper that responds to flue temperature as well as atmospheric pressures. It's not as critical with a wood stove since the fire won't die if not correct.

Remember these two things;
1) Your damper is to slow an over drafting chimney.
2) Your damper slows the velocity going up the chimney.
Looking at your installation your only resistance to flow is the straight pipe (very little resistance) and spark screen at top. The damper is a variable resistance.
Closing it gives the smoke particles more dwell time in the flue to stick, and slows the stove by slowing the incoming air. With a stable stack temp, try closing it 1/4 and give it time to respond. You should see temp drop. This is hard to judge since the fire is constantly changing as fuel is consumed. The warmer it is outside, the more it needs to be open. When a low pressure area moves over you, be prepared to run damper wide open since you have less air pressure to work with pushing oxygen into the stove. That's when the stove will act sluggish and you'll wonder what you're doing wrong. As the air pressure rises it will take off like a 4 cylinder cresting a hill and you'll feel like your stove is back. Err on the side of keeping it more open until you know how much you form. If you had a masonry uninsulated flue, I'd tell you to keep it wide open.
There is a science with tables for resistance, height, temperature, pressure, altitude, but it doesn't do much good with all the changing factors.

 

[jatoxico]

Glad you posted the pics. Your situation is one that can sometimes be a little trouble (see attached). The pic is showing how positive pressure can build affecting draft.



Sounds like it can be overcome but knowing the issue you can take steps to avoid spillage into the house. Try to maintain a somewhat hotter flue to promote good draft. Give a little more time to heat the flue on startup and reload since chimney will have cooled at the end of a load. Open the door slowly when reloading. If it becomes a nuisance a couple more feet of chimney could help too. Experience will tell you what to do.

 

[coaly]

Thanks for that diagram jatoxico ! Prevailing wind direction has a lot to do with it. The stack effect rising away from the stove adds to the outdoor issues and can even make it stall on a calm day if there is a stairwell nearby. It will rather rise up the stairs than up the chimney in certain circumstances. If his winds are from the opposite direction, he'll end up with lower pressure at the stack top, but it can also slip up and over the house swirling downward at the stack which is worse........ Chimney cap style can become the cure too. I had a customer with a vented gas stove with the same scenario. Installed by dealer to installation specs, went through warranty issues, then gas company when they couldn't keep it lit. I was an independent propane service company on a referral basis for a couple suppliers that didn't want to get into technical or time consuming installs, so became the troubleshooter when all else failed. I found on certain days enough exhaust was spilling out the divertor (an air intake at bottom of exhaust vent) where it has a spillage switch that senses temperature. When the spillage switch heats up due to exhaust spillage into room, it shuts down the pilot safety, shutting unit down. Extra height of B-vent cured it getting the top out of the high pressure zone. I don't have much faith in dealers or gas companies around here.

As far as ash accumulation; You're not burning hot enough yet or a long enough duration of fires to get the internal firebox temperature high enough. This time of year starting and stopping fires will do that. Ash is the material in the fuel that doesn't burn. More specifically it is the material that requires higher temperatures to burn. So the hotter the firebed, the more will burn off and the less ash you have left. a lot actually flakes off the wood and is caught in the turbulence and rises out the stack as fly ash. Only what doesn't leave the stove is what you have that settles. As you use larger piece it will tend to pack under it and become hard chunks. The hotter it gets, the finer the particles which is why you have a lot now which is larger particles.
Different wood types leave different amounts of ash residue. Most wood types vary from 0.1 to 3 percent. Ash content depends on age of tree, branches vs. trunk and how much bark is being burned. Total ash residue can be different than ash content since the finer the particles the more is released as fly ash.

If you can find "The Wood Burner's Encyclopedia" by Jay Shelton on eBay the book covers all these things in detail and much more. You can make a science out of burning, but there are so many changing factors it's hard to document results. The back covers of all Fisher manuals give a few books as good resources and the Encyclopedia is by far the most technical. It is not set up in alphabetical sequence like you would think. It does use footnotes where information comes from and an Appendix for each chapter in the back for further study. You can find them cheap or even in lots on eBay with other wood burning books.

 

[HunterDan]

Wow thank you all for all of your input!

I haven't burned since that last time it's warmed up a little bit. The last time I burned I got up about 3 am and loaded the box again, it was about out just hot coals left, flue temp was about 150 ish. I a few logs in and opened the caps about 4-5 turns, to let things get going again. Well it took off and I started to smell smoke again looked and could see the single wall starting to smoke, glanced at the flue temp and it was 500 and climbing. Spun the caps down to 1 turn and things calmed down. Since that's about as hot as its been, I'd say your right about the paint curing on the pipe.



A few final questions.

After I reloaded that night, I left the caps at about 3/4 open and everything was great. Woke up in the morning and it was 91 in my living room! (where the stove is). Bedroom and kitchen were still quiet comfortable. My question is, is there any good way to control the temperature in that room at all? Or should I just open a window (or is that defeating the purpose of even burning)

Ive heard of some Guys purposely burn the stove very hot every so often to burn off any creosote? Would you reccomend doing that, or do you think I should just clean it every month?

 

[begreen]

To even out the heat take a basic table (or box) fan and put it in an adjacent cooler room or hallway, on the floor, pointed toward the opening of the stove room. Run it on low speed. The fan will push cooler, dense air down low toward the stove which will be replaced with warm air from the stove room, higher up.

 

[jatoxico]

Well much could be said as you get into the nuances but mainly I would say to burn hot and clean at all times. If you don't need much heat build a small airy but hot fire and let it go out rather than a smolder a big fire since smouldering a non-EPA stove is a recipe for creosote.

The idea of burning an older like yours stove hot every now and then to burn things off is dated in my mind. Burning an EPA stove, especially a CAT stove hot now and then is different as they are good at low and slow without emitting much in the way of particulates or fouling the chimney while running low.

 

[coaly]

4 to 5 turns is a little much. It should take off with 2, then close back to 1 1/2 as it gets hotter. When the thermometer is about 300 throttle it back. It will probably rise to 350 - 400. More than that is waste. Closed down to 1/2 turn you may see 250 -300. Depending on wood you may only have to crack them. Too many variables to give you an exact setting, but you learn that in time. Only check creosote build up monthly and if there is no accumulation it's fine. My guess at 250 to 300 being 500 to 600 internal temp is going to stay above creosote formation in your insulated flue. Burning as hot as you are it probably won't need cleaning until the end of season. 1/2 turn probably would have been ok with less fuel load at the warmer temperatures outside. Like begreen suggests, move cooler air into that room at floor level. I find about 10* difference from my stove area to the farthest bedroom away. But my layout was built open for heating the way I do.
Burning hot once a day is recommend when people close the intake down too far and burn too cool overnight. You're stack temps are already in that once a day hot zone. You don't burn cool enough to need that. The object now is cutting back the air to lengthen fire duration and lower stack temp. Let enough heat up to prevent creosote, but anymore than necessary is wasting heat and fuel. When you dial that in, you'll have plenty of coals in the morning. That takes more than a couple fires to learn. The paint on your pipe will be turning gray to white if you continue to burn it off. (This is normal with soft woods out west) Are you slowing the draft with damper when the stack is that hot? Since I rarely go above 400, mine would smell at 500 too.
You need a baffle plate to direct that heat forward instead of up the stack. You won't get those temp spikes up the flue with one.