I Thought I Was Good at Sharpening

[WarmGuy]

I've been carefully hand-sharpening my chain for years. I watched videos, did the guides as well as the blades.

I bought a new chain the other day, and it the cuts are much faster. Perhaps 70% faster.

 

[velvetfoot]

And yet, when they're sharpened by the chainsaw shop guy, they cut great!

 

[DougA]

Even though there are posts from people who say they can get better performance after they sharpen a chain with X method, I have never, ever found that sharpening by any method will ever get a chain as good as it was brand new. I've got files, file guides, electric sharpener, rotary sharpener, everything except a Timberline, which I think is way overpriced. I've taken my chains to the best shops to sharpen and it's no better than I can do myself.

70% is a pretty subjective number. I can get close to original but it won't stay as sharp for as long as a new chain will. How many times have you used the same file? I buy Stihl files and I can use one file to sharpen 3 or 4 times and the file loses it's bite. Just wondering if you are using a dull file. Then it become an exercise in futility.

I also find that if you hit anything other than wood with your chainsaw, a hand file is really hard work to bring the chain back to sharp and you really need an electric wheel or rotary.

 

[blades]

Do not drag your file back towards you in the cut. That dulls out the teeth- they only cut on the away stroke, use chalk or bar soap to load the gullets of the file so chips do not get stuck there whch is another reason a file seems to go bad quickly. do use a file card to clean your file every so often of stuck chips ( even loading it before hand still will let some stick)

 

[CountryBoy19]

Do not drag your file back towards you in the cut. That dulls out the teeth- they only cut on the away stroke, use chalk or bar soap to load the gullets of the file so chips do not get stuck there whch is another reason a file seems to go bad quickly. do use a file card to clean your file every so often of stuck chips ( even loading it before hand still will let some stick)

File cards are generally recognized by machinists as somewhat damaging to a file (the same way back-dragging is). The best method of cleaning flat files is to clamp a block of hardwood into a vice with the end grain up and run the file across it so that the cuts in the file are in the same direction as the motion. IE, the wood fibers act as a series of small splinters that jab into the valley between the teeth and runs along it to clean the gunk out. I have adapted that to clean my round files as well (although it's not as easy to doing it to a flat file).

Does that process make sense to you?

 

[claydogg84]

Even though there are posts from people who say they can get better performance after they sharpen a chain with X method, I have never, ever found that sharpening by any method will ever get a chain as good as it was brand new.

It is possible with a hand file. It's not possible to really explain how it's done, but it involves running the file both downwards and upwards and creating a larger gullet. It also requires the user to take more material off the tooth than they normally would. I was shown how to file sharpen by someone who has been doing it for 20 years and it took me quite a few sharpenings before I could accomplish what he could.

 

[Mag Craft]

I would say my chains cut just as fast as a brand new chain after I sharpen them.
The ones I have converted to square ground cut even faster.
I use an Oregon 511a for round ground and a CBN wheel that nevers needs dressed and always holds the exact shape from cutter to cutter. I also like the finish it leaves.
The other part of the equation are the rakers.

 

[Seanm]

Heres a question for you guys. Does it make sense to count how many passes you make, say 10 per tooth? is it a big deal to do say 10 as an average and then file 15 on a damaged tooth? Is it a big deal to have some teeth filed down more than others? Im just wondering if there is a noticeable performance issue with teeth that are filed down to different levels on the same chain. For what its worth I agree that a new chain is like a Christmas present, you see it cut like butter and realize how much better it is than the ones youve been hand sharpening after many, many cords.

 

[CTYank]

Revelation to me, way back when, was using a precision file guide, from Granberg. That same guide can keep cutters like razors with a stroke or two every couple of fill-ups,

Leaves a brand-new chain noticeably sharper, with rare exception. Grinder is only for post-rocking, IMO, or "quickies" for buds who dig ditches.

 

[claydogg84]

Heres a question for you guys. Does it make sense to count how many passes you make, say 10 per tooth? is it a big deal to do say 10 as an average and then file 15 on a damaged tooth? Is it a big deal to have some teeth filed down more than others? Im just wondering if there is a noticeable performance issue with teeth that are filed down to different levels on the same chain. For what its worth I agree that a new chain is like a Christmas present, you see it cut like butter and realize how much better it is than the ones youve been hand sharpening after many, many cords.

I don't count but make the teeth as close to the same as possible. If one or 2 have been hit pretty good I sometimes just take them down but if you get into big wood you may notice the saw trying to cut around a corner. I initially tried counting strokes but found it ineffective most of the time.

 

[Oldman47]

Heres a question for you guys. Does it make sense to count how many passes you make, say 10 per tooth? is it a big deal to do say 10 as an average and then file 15 on a damaged tooth? Is it a big deal to have some teeth filed down more than others? Im just wondering if there is a noticeable performance issue with teeth that are filed down to different levels on the same chain. For what its worth I agree that a new chain is like a Christmas present, you see it cut like butter and realize how much better it is than the ones youve been hand sharpening after many, many cords.

Your teeth need to be well matched with each other and with properly sized rakers. The Granberg that CTYank refers to is the tool to do that and give you very consistent teeth.

 

[Michael Golden]

You may think the Timberline is over priced, as I did when I ordered one. That sharpening though gets the chain as sharp as new and very consistent at doing it! I sharpen my fil and BIL chains and they are always impressed. Well worth it!

 

[Seanm]

Thanks guys. Ive never noticed a difference in pulling one way or another and also touch up my rakers when needed.

 

[Wildo]

Revelation to me, way back when, was using a precision file guide, from Granberg. That same guide can keep cutters like razors with a stroke or two every couple of fill-ups,

Leaves a brand-new chain noticeably sharper, with rare exception. Grinder is only for post-rocking, IMO, or "quickies" for buds who dig ditches.

Bullseye! right there. A couple strokes on a new chain makes a huge difference, way better than factory edge.

If your file is clogged with metal grit rinse it with a squirt of saw gas from your fuel can. Point the file tip at the ground and 1/2 oz is plenty.

 

[Giles]

I would say my chains cut just as fast as a brand new chain after I sharpen them.
The ones I have converted to square ground cut even faster.
I use an Oregon 511a for round ground and a CBN wheel that nevers needs dressed and always holds the exact shape from cutter to cutter. I also like the finish it leaves.
The other part of the equation are the rakers.

I to use an Oregon 511a.
I had a logger friend bring his chainsaw over to have a couple of chains sharpened, on his way to a job. After I sharpened his two dull chains he had installed a new chain on one of his saws. He went over to a 24" log and made two cuts.
He then asked me if it would make me mad if he tested one I had sharpened.
I didn't mind and was curious myself. So he removed the new chain and installed a sharpened one.
I asked him for a truthful opinion. He said he couldn't tell any difference and that's why he had me sharpen his chains.
I have watched a lot guys sharpen chains and have watched a lot of videos and haven't seen anyone that does it the same way I do.
Sparks really flying and some don't bother to dress/clean wheel. They all seem to be in a hurry and never press down and back on the link before clamping.
Being a retired Tool&Die Maker, my way just makes more sense to me.

 

[Osagebndr]

I hand sharpen my chains also . I generally will turn my file in the frame I have for it about every third use and then use a wire brush to clean the metal shavings out after several uses .
I also have noticed that when I rip-split a lot the heat tends to effect the hardness of the chain and it gets dull quicker and harder to sharpen

 

[blades]

File cards are generally recognized by machinists as somewhat damaging to a file (the same way back-dragging is). The best method of cleaning flat files is to clamp a block of hardwood into a vice with the end grain up and run the file across it so that the cuts in the file are in the same direction as the motion. IE, the wood fibers act as a series of small splinters that jab into the valley between the teeth and runs along it to clean the gunk out. I have adapted that to clean my round files as well (although it's not as easy to doing it to a flat file).

Does that process make sense to you?

Sure , and I have used that many times along with a pick for the extra stubborn chips- file card just simpler for most. kinda like bar soap vs chalk most every one has some bar soap around chalk not so much.

 

[Redbarn]

You may think the Timberline is over priced, as I did when I ordered one. That sharpening though gets the chain as sharp as new and very consistent at doing it. Well worth it!

I'm a Timberline fan too. Very easy and consistent.
Last weekend, we were cutting out in the woods and my son hit a rock with his chain.
Used the Timberline and had his chain back to usable in 10 mins or so.

 

[Knots]

Revelation to me, way back when, was using a precision file guide, from Granberg. That same guide can keep cutters like razors with a stroke or two every couple of fill-ups,

Leaves a brand-new chain noticeably sharper, with rare exception. Grinder is only for post-rocking, IMO, or "quickies" for buds who dig ditches.

Is this the one you use?

http://www.amazon.com/Granberg-Bar-Mount-Chain-Sharpener-G-106B/dp/B0002ZY1WG

 

[Giles]

Heres a question for you guys. Does it make sense to count how many passes you make, say 10 per tooth? is it a big deal to do say 10 as an average and then file 15 on a damaged tooth? Is it a big deal to have some teeth filed down more than others? Im just wondering if there is a noticeable performance issue with teeth that are filed down to different levels on the same chain. For what its worth I agree that a new chain is like a Christmas present, you see it cut like butter and realize how much better it is than the ones youve been hand sharpening after many, many cords.

Whenever I hand file a chain. I would always count the strokes. I don't think it is critical to get all exactly the same, and feel it is nearly impossible to do so by hand. 90% of my sharpening is with a machine. IMO no human being alive can sharpen as good as a quality grinder, with a qualified operator.
I sharpen all the cutters on the left side of chain first and then back off the adjustment slightly to do the right side. I then use a caliper to check the length of the left sharpened link and adjust for the right side. Usually .005--.010 is close enough.
I only grind enough off to get it sharp and many times I will have to grind again. Most people, with a grinder, just take off way too much and heat the chain link to eliminate having to go back and sharpen again.
I have seen nearly new chains that had not been rocked, ground four times with an electric grinder and they were virtually used up!

 

[Mag Craft]

Whenever I hand file a chain. I would always count the strokes. I don't think it is critical to get all exactly the same, and feel it is nearly impossible to do so by hand. 90% of my sharpening is with a machine. IMO no human being alive can sharpen as good as a quality grinder, with a qualified operator.
I sharpen all the cutters on the left side of chain first and then back off the adjustment slightly to do the right side. I then use a caliper to check the length of the left sharpened link and adjust for the right side. Usually .005--.010 is close enough.
I only grind enough off to get it sharp and many times I will have to grind again. Most people, with a grinder, just take off way too much and heat the chain link to eliminate having to go back and sharpen again.
I have seen nearly new chains that had not been rocked, ground four times with an electric grinder and they were virtually used up!

+1

 

[Seanm]

Whenever I hand file a chain. I would always count the strokes. I don't think it is critical to get all exactly the same, and feel it is nearly impossible to do so by hand. 90% of my sharpening is with a machine. IMO no human being alive can sharpen as good as a quality grinder, with a qualified operator.
I sharpen all the cutters on the left side of chain first and then back off the adjustment slightly to do the right side. I then use a caliper to check the length of the left sharpened link and adjust for the right side. Usually .005--.010 is close enough.
I only grind enough off to get it sharp and many times I will have to grind again. Most people, with a grinder, just take off way too much and heat the chain link to eliminate having to go back and sharpen again.
I have seen nearly new chains that had not been rocked, ground four times with an electric grinder and they were virtually used up!

I bet you see a big difference with a machine compared to how I do it by hand especially being good at it. I remember years ago when i adopted my grandfathers husky it came with a clamp on guide for filing (not sure what they are called) I used it for awhile and found it to be clunky so I never used it again. I dropped and bucked three larch trees today and since I hadnt filed when I was done the last time I stopped after a bit and hand filed on the tailgate of my truck. I didnt touch up the rakers but hand filed in about 10 minutes and after that it cut great.

 

[Bigg_Redd]

IMO no human being alive can sharpen as good as a quality grinder,

That is a very interesting opinion.

 

[billb3]

When I don't think I'm getting the teeth as sharp as they were when they were new I buy a new file.

 

[Mag Craft]

That is a very interesting opinion.

There is an invitation but I will refrain because we all have our opinions.
Thanks anyways.