Increased ethanol in gas - Stihl web-newsletter - warning + warrantee issue

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NH_Wood

NH_Wood

Minister of Fire
Hearth Supporter
Dec 24, 2009
2,602
southern NH
Hello everyone - just received this e-mail from Stihl. Gist is new regs on increasing ethanol to 15% at the pump. Stihl indicates that not only we shouldn't use 15% in our saws, etc., but that doing so may void warrantee - thought the last part was interesting, but not sure how they would know what % ethanol you were running if you drained tank, etc. I'll have to starting watching at the pump more closely - not sure what the distribution is like for 15% ETOH. Cheers!

http://links.clippings.stihldealer....=NjIzMzkyMzE2MDcS1&j=MjUxNjA0ODY3S0&mt=1&rt=0
 
Seen that myself. Things are going to get interesting for us small engine owners if they totally switch to E-15 thus eliminating E-10. Thats why we're seeing more and more premixed bottled fuel out there whether it from Stihl, Husqvarna, Tru-Fuel, VP, Jonsered and so on.

I'm part of thread on another website that is discussing the bottled premix fuels. One suggestion made was to buy a 5 gallon can of 94 Octane ethanol free gas from VP Racing Fuels and make up your own mix with your oil of choice. Your get the same kind of fuel/gas used in the premix bottles but much cheaper, relatively speaking anyway.
 
I thought that I had heard that using higher octane fuels was also bad for small 2-stroke engines. Any truth to that? I think that even E-10 is terrible for a saw engine but I didn't realize that you could buy ethanol free gas anywhere.
 
Heres a link to the gas I mentioned above.

(broken link removed to http://www.magicracing.com/VP-T4-Racing-Fuel-5-Gallon-Can-93-OctaneUnLeaded_p_115904.html#.UtrgfKX0B68)
 
Halligan said:
Heres a link to the gas I mentioned above.

(broken link removed to http://www.magicracing.com/VP-T4-Racing-Fuel-5-Gallon-Can-93-OctaneUnLeaded_p_115904.html#.UtrgfKX0B68)
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Jeez, I don't think my saw will see that fuel! I don't like ethanol but don't like $10/gal gas even more. Are there any places that sell off road fuel at the pump without ethanol in it?
 
Figure $70-$75 total for 5 gallons once you add the 2 cycle oil of your choice. At $75 for 5 gallons your paying $15 a gallon vs. about $30 a gallon using the 1 quart cans of premix.
 
AK13 said:
I thought that I had heard that using higher octane fuels was also bad for small 2-stroke engines. Any truth to that? I think that even E-10 is terrible for a saw engine but I didn't realize that you could buy ethanol free gas anywhere.
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Page 26 of my Husqvarna 365 manual states that I should run a fuel with a minimum of 90 octane in my saw. Most stations up here have 91 octane NO E fuel at the pump still. My understanding (limited) is that the higher the octane the cooler the engine runs.
 
  • This is from page 18 of my Husky 365 X-torq manual;

    "Use good quality unleaded gasoline.

  • CAUTION! Engines equipped with catalytic converters must be run on unleaded fuel mixtures.

  • Leaded gasoline will destroy the catalytic converter and it will no longer serve its purpose. The green fuel cap on saws fitted with catalytic converters means that only unleaded gasoline can be used.

  • The lowest recommended octane grade is 87 ((RON+MON)/2). If you run the engine on a lower octane grade than 87 so-called knocking can occur. This gives rise to a high engine temperature and increased bearing load, which can result in serious engine damage.

  • When working with continuous high revs (e.g. limbing) a higher octane is recommended. "

    In New Jersey, there are no E-free stations, and pumps do not have to be marked. Wow!
 
I always run hi-octane gas in all my small engines but the last time I was in the Stihl dealer, he said I should add some gas additive in addition to that in the chainsaw and Honda gen. I was told to use hi-octane to run more efficiently and also the gas in small engines often sits in it for months and gas will lose octane after a month. All the stations in our area are 10% ethanol but it's great to see this thread so I can watch out for it.
 
mikey517 said:
In New Jersey, there are no E-free stations, and pumps do not have to be marked. Wow!
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I had no idea. That's crazy! Locally the pumps are labeled. Typically 87=10%E, 89=5%E and 91=0%E

Disclaimer: My saw was purchased in 1998 and manucactured in 1997. Looks like the manual has changed since then!
 
You guys in Ontario are fortunate to have easy access to non-ethanol gas. Only a few stations in my area carry it. I make it a point when I'm going their way to bring the 5 gal can and fill it with non-ethanol 90 octane. Been using it in all the small engines for the past few years. Seems to make a difference. Hadn't used my Poulan saw for more than a month. Started on the 3rd pull and ran great this morning. If any gas in the 5 gal can has sat for awhile, I put it in the car and start over.
 
If you don't know where to find E-free gas try looking here:

http://www.buyrealgas.com/

This website will tell you where it has been reported that ethanol free gas is available. Buying the right gas can be just as important as getting the right automobile insurance or using the right parts for your motorcycle, boat, or antique car. Most of the links here have a phone number; you may want to call them and confirm that they still sell ethanol free gas before planning a stop. If you don't find a station near you, check again later because we add new places daily.
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I have two options for ethanol free gas relatively close to me. Aviation fuel is sold at a small airport 10 minutes away. The AV fuel has lead in it, so I'm not crazy about that, so I more regularly use my second option--unleaded, ethanol free marine gas from a marina about a half hour away. Either way, no ethanol! My Stihl dealer also sells the AV fuel for an extra buck a gallon. The price for either ranges between $4-5, so not that much more than the stuff at the gas station.
 
UncleJoe said:
If you don't know where to find E-free gas try looking here:

http://www.buyrealgas.com/
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A couple of years ago I tried using that site to find ethanol free gas in Maryland. Yep, Maryland still sucks. Wish I had remembered this site when I drove down to Florida last month because it appears that a station next to my in-laws sells it. Maryland is frustrating to say the least.
 
I own a convenience store/gas station and we sell 90 octane no ethanol pure gas. A lot of the lawn services use our gas. My store was closed for 3 yrs before I opened it back up. I asked the company that was putting in new pumps if I needed to have tanks cleaned and he said if you are selling ethanol that it would clean tanks better than anything they had. Ethanol is hard on small engines, especially if it is just sitting in tank.
 
I remember the E-15 proposal, perhaps 2 years back, and some of the auto manufacturers releasing statements that the use of E-15 would void the warranty on your car. I haven't seen E-15 stickers on any of our local pumps yet, so I never followed up on that story, but figured it would only be a matter of time.

Any suggestions on how to go about finding ethanol-free? I'm not loving the idea of buying Stihl (or other) E-free premix at $9/quart.
 
There is a website that will help you find ethanol free gas not sure what it is. Several people traveling have said it told them about our store.
 
The web site should be www.pure-gas.org . Lists US and Canada, unfortunately not much ethanol free gas in the northeast. Bought some up in the Tug Hill area of NY.
 
I have 3 stations within 10 minutes that carry it. Non ethanol goes in everything except the Massey... I set her up to run on the ethanol fuels, damn machine is just too thirsty for $4.70/gal fuel. My father refuses to use the non ethanol, and has killed most of his small engines in the past two years as a result.
 
Non ethanol gas seems to be easier to find than it was 2 years ago.

Marinas often still carry non ethanol gas. Ethanol had a reputation for melting fiberglass gas tanks, cleaning so much sediment out of the non fiberglass, and absorbing so much water that that people were getting stuck on the water. Ask for marine gas.
 
EatenByLimestone said:
Non ethanol gas seems to be easier to find than it was 2 years ago.

Marinas often still carry non ethanol gas. Ethanol had a reputation for melting fiberglass gas tanks, cleaning so much sediment out of the non fiberglass, and absorbing so much water that that people were getting stuck on the water. Ask for marine gas.
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Ahhh.....this is an idea - marina 5 min away which has a pump - never thought to ask what they carry - otherwise, at least 2 h drive for me to get non ETOH gas here. Cheers!
 
In my area even marinas are running E-10.
 
Rock Crusher said:
The web site should be www.pure-gas.org . Lists US and Canada, unfortunately not much ethanol free gas in the northeast.
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This shows no ethanol free in NH, but also seems to indicate that Irving stations sell ethanol free gas. I can't find any verification of this online though.

My google searching indicated that NH has been working on legislation to ban ethanol, but that it won't do any good unless 2 other states sign on because our market is too small for producers to make a special blend.
 
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