Kuuma Installation Question

[DaveH]

I am seeking some opinions about a Kuuma VF 100 install. Putting it in this corner would be necessary to get it next to the hot water and hook up the H2O coil. I've read the unit does not radiate too much heat, but that is my verizon service line and the direct tv cables on the wall. I intend on cleaning them up before install, but does anyone think it would be too close to the heat? The chimney will likely be exiting the house to the right, along the same wall as the door. The yellow line is also my propane, I think that is far enough away. Worst case would be I put the furnace along the wall by those outlets and move the HW tank into the corner next to it.

 

[brenndatomu]

If you respect the clearances that Kuuma recommends you should be fine.
What's the plan for a chimney, class A out through the wall?

 

[DaveH]

If you respect the clearances that Kuuma recommends you should be fine.
What's the plan for a chimney, class A out through the wall?

Yes, class A through the wall to the right.

 

[STIHLY DAN]

You will have no issues at all putting it anywhere in the corner. However I would suggest getting a cheap electric water heater and use it as a tempering tank to your heater. You will get much more hot water from your wood. And if you raise it, that would be even better.

 

[velvetfoot]

Hi Dave, fellow Rensselaer Countyite!
I don't have any experience with forced air but I find it interesting nonetheless so I'll chime in anyway.
I'd think you want to make sure you have a nice short tie in to a chimney that's in a good place on the outside of the house (it's going to be a new chimney, right?) The chimney seems to drive a lot of other stuff.
There's also integrating the duct work into the existing system-short too?
You want to leave room for maintenance-the work flow involving the wood and ash removal, cleaning the unit as well as the venting.
I'm sure the manual has stuff to say about all this too.
I have no idea about water tank location, but I'd think if a circ pump was involved there'd be no problem in locating it where you want.

 

[cityboy172]

Replace the pressure relief valve on you water heater before you have a problem.

 

[DaveH]

Hi Dave, fellow Rensselaer Countyite!
I don't have any experience with forced air but I find it interesting nonetheless so I'll chime in anyway.
I'd think you want to make sure you have a nice short tie in to a chimney that's in a good place on the outside of the house (it's going to be a new chimney, right?) The chimney seems to drive a lot of other stuff.
There's also integrating the duct work into the existing system-short too?
You want to leave room for maintenance-the work flow involving the wood and ash removal, cleaning the unit as well as the venting.
I'm sure the manual has stuff to say about all this too.
I have no idea about water tank location, but I'd think if a circ pump was involved there'd be no problem in locating it where you want.

It will be a new chimney and the furnace will be as close as i can get it to the wall. I got a quote from Matchless for the chimney plus install, not cheap, but it was about what I was expecting. The furnace is coming in the next week or two, and it looks like all this snow will start melting finally. I might end up waiting for mud season to end in order to get the unit from the garage to basement, so I have time to make the last minute plans.

 

[DaveH]

Replace the pressure relief valve on you water heater before you have a problem.

Because of the wet floor or the build up? I grabbed some water out of it before the picture was taken, thats why the floor is wet.

 

[cityboy172]

Because of the wet floor or the build up? I grabbed some water out of it before the picture was taken, thats why the floor is wet.

The build up causes the issues. You'll get build up under that seat, and it won't reseal. Thats also a pretty bad / dangerous habit to be manipulating a T/P valve.

 

[velvetfoot]

It will be a new chimney and the furnace will be as close as i can get it to the wall. I got a quote from Matchless for the chimney plus install, not cheap, but it was about what I was expecting. The furnace is coming in the next week or two, and it looks like all this snow will start melting finally. I might end up waiting for mud season to end in order to get the unit from the garage to basement, so I have time to make the last minute plans.

Yeah, my general impression is that Matchless is not cheap but good. They do duct work too, I guess?
I hired a guy with a biggish skid steer with tracks and forks to move the boiler from the garage to the basement-it made some impressions in the lawn that seem to have gone away, but it was June. Are you responsible for moving into the basement? I wonder if you could do something while the ground is still hard, albeit snow-covered?
I'm sure they're professionals, but I, myself, drilled a couple of 4" holes for a relocated oil tank through the concrete wall with a rented core drill and it turned out great, so I assume they're going to drill a hole too.

 

[DaveH]

Yeah, my general impression is that Matchless is not cheap but good. They do duct work too, I guess?
I hired a guy with a biggish skid steer with tracks and forks to move the boiler from the garage to the basement-it made some impressions in the lawn that seem to have gone away, but it was June. Are you responsible for moving into the basement? I wonder if you could do something while the ground is still hard, albeit snow-covered?
I'm sure they're professionals, but I, myself, drilled a couple of 4" holes for a relocated oil tank through the concrete wall with a rented core drill and it turned out great, so I assume they're going to drill a hole too.

My neighbor has a HVAC company, so I'll talk to him about the duct work. I haven't spoken to the shipping company yet directly, but I assume they will dump it in the driveway and I am responsible for the rest. If I can get the furnace to the basement while the ground is still frozen I will. I will probably get a skid steer over here to move it but I'm traveling the next couple weeks so I'll have to see what the weather does. I have a bit of a grade down to the basement so I don't wanna see my investment go sliding down the hill.

They would drill through the wall. It doesn't seem worth it to rush the install this year, hopefully the worst of it is over, so im gonna keep shopping and recruit friends to help with the install. The insurance company prefers a professional so that might force my hand. The price for parts estimated by Matchless was cheaper that what I looked at online, on build your own websites. The $1100 install fee was tough to swallow.

 

[STIHLY DAN]

And a Prefab chimney is easy to install. Start to finish mine was 3 hours.

 

[velvetfoot]

Here's a picture of last June. It will get warm and sunny again.

 

[brenndatomu]

You can get Selkirk Supervent at Menards, everything you'd need to build a class A chimney for $821 (plus shipping since there are no big green Ms around you) and like Stihly says, it's easy to install. Agree with VF, rent a core drill, perfect hole through the foundation in no time!
Chimney parts...
http://www.menards.com/main/store/2...rod_Tech_Spec/combinedBuyersGuidetechdata.pdf
1. Through the wall/support kit, $291.09
2. 6" x 36" (x 6 for 18' chimney) $449.94
3. Wall bands (x 3) $44.25
4. Lock bands (x 6) $35.94
-------------------------------------------------------
Total $821.22, at regular store prices (+ tax)

If you have snow on the ground right now I'd get that bad boy in there before it melts. It will minimize damage to the yard, especially if the ground is froze too. I had to dig up someones yard to repair a leaking water line last week. The yard was a swamp from the leak but I was able to get the hoe close enough to dig and still stay on snow/frozen ground. I piled the dirt (slop!) on the snow and was able to swipe it back in the hole with the hoe bucket when done without ever exposing the grass. It started snowing shortly after and in a couple hours you couldn't even tell anything had been done except for the backhoe tracks in the snow. If that leak had been in the springtime it would have required some serious landscaping afterwards!
Another idea is to use the snow to your advantage, make a sled. Sheet of plywood or steel roofing, you'd might be surprised how easily it will move that way!
Like mentioned above, mount your tempering tank (or water heater, whatever you use) as high as possible, it will make the gravity flow work better.
My 2 cents...

 

[brenndatomu]

Oh, and try to keep the placement of the furnace such that you can use 45* elbows on the stove pipe over to the chimney connector instead of 90s, it will greatly improve draft and much less (probably none) smoke rollout when you open the loading door

 

[DaveH]

Oh, and try to keep the placement of the furnace such that you can use 45* elbows on the stove pipe over to the chimney connector instead of 90s, it will greatly improve draft and much less (probably none) smoke rollout when you open the loading door

I was planning on this and was concerned it would make cutting the hole through the wall myself a little trickier. I guess I'd have to estimate the angle in order to have the pipe exiting the wall at the 45.

 

[velvetfoot]

He might have meant minimize the right angles, not go through the wall at a 45.

 

[DaveH]

got it

 

[Smoke Signals]

I am seeking some opinions about a Kuuma VF 100 install. Putting it in this corner would be necessary to get it next to the hot water and hook up the H2O coil.
View attachment 154942View attachment 154941

I didn't think a water loop was allowed in the fire box on the Kuuma? How do you plan to install the coil? in the duck work?

 

[DaveH]

They make a H2O coil option. Preheats water entering HW tank, or tempering tank. There isn't many pictures or detailed descriptions on the website. People here seemed happy with it on this site so I figured it was worth a shot.

 

[Smoke Signals]

Oh cool, is this new? I thought I asked about this one time and they told me they didn't have this option. Regardless, I'm glad to hear they do. A Kuuma is in my long term plan and I thought I was going to have to do with out DHW from wood. Guess not, good news!

 

[brenndatomu]

He might have meant minimize the right angles, not go through the wall at a 45.

Yes, this ^ ^ ^. Yeah, the chimney tee goes outside the wall and a 1' piece of class A pipe goes through the wall to the inside with a stove pipe adapter (or chimney connector) on the end. Which makes me realize that I forgot that part on my parts list earlier, I think the 1 footers are $45 or so.

 

[DaveH]

Kuuma has made it into the basement. Skidsteer got it in with no damage besides some ruts in the yard. The chimney is going in soon and now I have to get the hot water tank situated for the H2O coil. I like the sounds of the stone lined tanks but not the $1200 price tag. I have a 40 gallon electric water heater now that is 8 years old and I was thinking about getting a new one, spend maybe $500, and using the old one as the tempering tank. Anybody do anything different?

 

[STIHLY DAN]

If you get a new electric tank, seriously think about it being a heat pump water heater. save a ton of cash over the years.

 

[sloeffle]

If you get a new electric tank, seriously think about it being a heat pump water heater. save a ton of cash over the years.

I couldn't agree with you more. My HPHW costs me about one-fourth of what it cost me to run my Marathon.

I like the sounds of the stone lined tanks but not the $1200 price tag. I have a 40 gallon electric water heater now that is 8 years old and I was thinking about getting a new one, spend maybe $500, and using the old one as the tempering tank. Anybody do anything different?

Have you looked at Marathon ? They are plastic and have a lifetime tank warranty.