I've been heating my home for the last 10 years using an outdoor wood boiler feeding my radiant baseboards. It's proven to be very economical as I have access to all the firewood I could ever want. That came to an abrupt end this season when my boilers water jacket finally burst beyond repair due to years of corrosion. Now I'm faced with decisions. I ruled out replacing the boiler, mostly because of the 10 year lifespan of the first one and the idea of spending my falls in the woods hunting is more appealing than cutting firewood. The other option is to use my 25 year old propane fueled Weil McLain boiler and hope that propane doesn't rise too much in cost which I don't foresee being likely. So as I've lurked around these forums and spoke with friends about different options, I've began to lean toward installing a pellet stove but have some concerns. Our home is a 25 year old ranch and pretty well insulated but at 2,000 square feet I fear it might not be an effective source of heat. The stove that I'm considering is the Harman Allure. One reason is the styling(my wife doesn't like the traditional styles) but the others are the 52,000btu output, 92lb hopper and Harmans reputation for quality. Is it realistic to expect this stove to be able to heat the majority if not all of my home? I know it's kind of a loaded question but the fact is at $5,000 installed plus pellet costs, I fear I may be looking at 10 years for this thing to pay for itself. Currently I'm using about 5 gallons of propane per day to heat the house and our water but our winter has been a lot more like spring this year. I would imagine during a typical winter, we'd use much more. I'm just wondering what your thoughts are in regard to my situation and some opinions on the Allure? I also attached a layout of my house with a red x where I'd like to do a corner install of the stove if we decide to go that route. Thank you for any advise you may have
New to pellets... Thinking Harman Allure
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alternativeheat
Minister of Fire
Have you considered a pellet boiler ? It can be installed tandem with your gas boiler and then you can heat with either or. Much more even heat using baseboards than you can ever get from a stove.
Heating system antifreeze/conditioner would probably have increased your outdoor boilers life 2x.
Heating system antifreeze/conditioner would probably have increased your outdoor boilers life 2x.
I have considered the pellet boiler. The main draw back that I could see was the need to carry pellets into my basement. The other is the actual utility room in the basement doesn't have the room to add one without removing an appliance or a wall. But it's certainly something I probobaly should look into some more. I do think both my wife and I would like the ambiance of a stove though.
alternativeheat
Minister of Fire
The best of both worlds is the ambiance of a stove and run the boiler to pick up the cold areas a bit. It doesn't use much fuel to do that and your heat only cycles a few times in 24 hours. To go straight stove you will have cool areas in your house and of course the warmest near the stove. In the real cold of winter I will sometimes do this ( oil boiler here) and it works well. I used to do it with a coal stove too. You burn a little fuel but less pellets so it's a wash.
This house would do well with two stoves, one basement stove and one living room. I've done that with coal too LOL ! Again you don't use much more fuel because one stove offsets the other.
This house would do well with two stoves, one basement stove and one living room. I've done that with coal too LOL ! Again you don't use much more fuel because one stove offsets the other.
Thanks althea, that's kind of my plan. We do have two zones that run off the boiler, so in theory we could supplement the bedroom end of the house with the radiant baseboard if we have trouble getting heat to that end. Honestly assuming the temp difference in the ends of the house vs the center was only 65 degrees vs 72ish degrees, I would be very happy.
Can anyone using the Allure chime in and let me know what they do and don't like about them? Is there a comparable stove with simalar styling I should consider? Brand wise, I would consider just about anything. Dealers are few and far between in my area, most are an hour and a half drive unless I wanted to go box store route which I don't.
I have been heating my 2,350 SQ FT two story home with one Harman P68. I mainly bought it for the shoulder or warmer parts of the heating season hoping to save some wood and my wife and I were tired of wood humping. Especially her after she slipped in ice one morning and busted her butt.
I have and used for years a Woodmaster 5500 OWB that will do multiple buildings and up to 10,000 SQ FT. It loves eating LOTSA WOOD... I have not used it since I installed my P68. I honestly thought the new P68 would not heat my place during long extended brutally cold snaps. I was wrong and pleasantly surprised. So yes you can heat an entire home all winter with one pellet stove but each home, layout, and heating demands vary.
I do not know much about the newer Euro looking Allure but imagine it just has a different cabinet outside and the inner workings etc; are all about the same. Keep in mind the P68 is 68 K BTUs and also the P Series throws a lot of radiant heat from the stove itself besides the warm air the distribution blowers slings.
I suggest you read up and I would also possibly entertain a pellet boiler as a definite option as suggested by Alternative. Not saying that is the way to go but may be a good option. I am pretty sure a P68 will warm you right up. Really my Woodmaster produced more heat than I could ever use and I did my water heater, garages, a shop, and the entire house which is altogether 4,000 to 4,200 SQ FT. We do not use another area here currently.
What I love about the pellet stove inside is you have a nice cozy fire much like a wood stove. The 40 pound bags are way easier and cleaner. And no more slaving on firewood because that gets old. It can be enjoyable but as you mentioned I can think of many other more enjoyable things to do with my free time.
I am very happy I decided on a good quality pellet stove. It was out of necessity also because I was working out of town in the winters and the wife was pissed dealing with the wood even as easy as I made that for her. Three kids to get off to school and she has a career also so it was a one woman show. She was talking condo.......... Nope! I like my land.
I have and used for years a Woodmaster 5500 OWB that will do multiple buildings and up to 10,000 SQ FT. It loves eating LOTSA WOOD... I have not used it since I installed my P68. I honestly thought the new P68 would not heat my place during long extended brutally cold snaps. I was wrong and pleasantly surprised. So yes you can heat an entire home all winter with one pellet stove but each home, layout, and heating demands vary.
I do not know much about the newer Euro looking Allure but imagine it just has a different cabinet outside and the inner workings etc; are all about the same. Keep in mind the P68 is 68 K BTUs and also the P Series throws a lot of radiant heat from the stove itself besides the warm air the distribution blowers slings.
I suggest you read up and I would also possibly entertain a pellet boiler as a definite option as suggested by Alternative. Not saying that is the way to go but may be a good option. I am pretty sure a P68 will warm you right up. Really my Woodmaster produced more heat than I could ever use and I did my water heater, garages, a shop, and the entire house which is altogether 4,000 to 4,200 SQ FT. We do not use another area here currently.
What I love about the pellet stove inside is you have a nice cozy fire much like a wood stove. The 40 pound bags are way easier and cleaner. And no more slaving on firewood because that gets old. It can be enjoyable but as you mentioned I can think of many other more enjoyable things to do with my free time.
I am very happy I decided on a good quality pellet stove. It was out of necessity also because I was working out of town in the winters and the wife was pissed dealing with the wood even as easy as I made that for her. Three kids to get off to school and she has a career also so it was a one woman show. She was talking condo.......... Nope! I like my land.
Doing 2,000 SQ FT with an Allure might be a stretch though. I'd say at least a P61 but get the extra umph and spend a few hundred more on the P68.
Another good option would be two smaller pellet stoves if you could work that out. Maybe two Castle Serenity that can be had new sometimes for $700 - $1,000 depending on sales etc; There are other decent more reasonably priced stoves than Harmans but Harman stoves are very, very hard to beat for simple robust designs, set it and forget it dependability, ease of use, cleaning, etc; They are bullet proof for the most part.
You could start with one and always add another at a later date if that is the route you decide. Or set up using your existing plumbing from your OWB. One my OWB dies I'm done with it but it is still good and works very well when I do use it. I have always treated and used anti-freeze in mine from day one. I installed it new the winter of 2004-2005. It was all I used until Oct. 18th of 2014 when I bought and installed my P68.
Another good option would be two smaller pellet stoves if you could work that out. Maybe two Castle Serenity that can be had new sometimes for $700 - $1,000 depending on sales etc; There are other decent more reasonably priced stoves than Harmans but Harman stoves are very, very hard to beat for simple robust designs, set it and forget it dependability, ease of use, cleaning, etc; They are bullet proof for the most part.
You could start with one and always add another at a later date if that is the route you decide. Or set up using your existing plumbing from your OWB. One my OWB dies I'm done with it but it is still good and works very well when I do use it. I have always treated and used anti-freeze in mine from day one. I installed it new the winter of 2004-2005. It was all I used until Oct. 18th of 2014 when I bought and installed my P68.
Thank you bags. I too was heating with a Woodmaster(4400). Its hard to ignore the saving of burning wood but I am just over it. Seemed like when it was working, it didn't perform the best it could and the constant battle with keeping fires lit while at work drove me nutty. I'd get home late so discover my fire had gone out and would spend the next hour trying to make sure it wasn't going to go back out. The idea of electric ignition and greater than 12 hour fuel loads is quite appealing. Honestly, I'd have either and pellet stove or boiler by now but I'm only paying 1.29 per gal for propane and I'm using about 160 gallons per month. That being said, I don't see propane staying this cheap forever and we wont have winters this mild forever. I've never liked the idea of these pellet burners but the more I research, the more I like them. I am now thinking that maybe I'd do a Central Boiler Maxim outdoor boiler, but I don't see much online in regard to them. It would literally drop into the place of my woodmaster and do everything it did for me(heat the entire home via radiant baseboards and heat out water as well) but I would like to hear from others who have used one first.
I never had any issue keeping the Woodmaster going. There was always enough coals to rake around then throw more wood in and off it went. I always had 12 hour minimum burn times and longer depending on outside temps. I just stayed in the habit of loading up in the morning before I left for work and then throw more in when I got home or definitely before I went to bed.
One thing I did not like was running back outside before bed to throw some wood in after I had been home and warm awhile if that was the case. A plus there is all the mess was outside except dragging snowy boots back in again but those were dropped off at the door.
An inside pellet stove has worked out nice here the last few years. Glad I've gone the route I had. I will still keep the Woodmaster in service because pellet prices could get goofy like last year when they jacked them up but then a mild winter slammed them on their price bumps. Suddenly they are back where they should be. It's best to pre-buy before the season or stock up when you can and save some money there.
The propane is a good way to heat now but as we know that is playing Russian roulette because I've seen that get very silly price wise also. Here I try to keep as many options as possible. Woodmaster, pellet stoves, heat pump (which will always cost more), and some wood stoves and kerosene heaters for emergency back up heat when all else fails.
One thing I did not like was running back outside before bed to throw some wood in after I had been home and warm awhile if that was the case. A plus there is all the mess was outside except dragging snowy boots back in again but those were dropped off at the door.
An inside pellet stove has worked out nice here the last few years. Glad I've gone the route I had. I will still keep the Woodmaster in service because pellet prices could get goofy like last year when they jacked them up but then a mild winter slammed them on their price bumps. Suddenly they are back where they should be. It's best to pre-buy before the season or stock up when you can and save some money there.
The propane is a good way to heat now but as we know that is playing Russian roulette because I've seen that get very silly price wise also. Here I try to keep as many options as possible. Woodmaster, pellet stoves, heat pump (which will always cost more), and some wood stoves and kerosene heaters for emergency back up heat when all else fails.
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