Okie Gold Nugget

[Mr. Spock]

Went through a bag yesterday, damp and cold all day/night. Burned some Okies last season but never had clinkers. This years batch appears to be different. The Geneva would make turd looking clinkers once in a while but touch them and they fell apart. These clinkers are hard and takes a little force to crush them.

 

[jtakeman]

Regular Okies last season? The golds are Southern Yellow pine and Okies Platinum(red bag) are a BC SPF. BHH was Ponderosa pine.

The Southern Yellow Pine "might" have a higher chloride(salt) content which aides the clinker formation?

 

[Mr. Spock]

Hi jtakeman,
Good to see your still around. As usual your up with the industry.

Squire didn't offer the Platinum this season so I grabbed the Gold which was the same price. I didn't think much of it other than I had good results with the brand, good heat and much cleaner burns. Looks like the Gold may be an inferior pellet to the Platinum but it is just one bag burned so time will tell.

 

[jtakeman]

Good to see(hear-read) you too!

Been busy, But try! I have not tried the Golds yet and your the first I've seen burn them. I couldn't miss this one! Ol' Mr Warm's been bragging high on these. Supposed to have good test lab results, But the real world of burning in a stove is the true deal! I'm not sure I'd recommend them after seeing your burn results?

One pellet I have recommended the people I know that wanted Okies, But could not find them has been La Crete's. The La Crete's are IMHO the best I have seen from a BC softwood! If you see them in your travels, You might want to try them.

 

[kramerica72]

LaCretes are actually from Alberta, not BC. But agreed--they burn great!

 

[jtakeman]

LaCretes are actually from Alberta, not BC. But agreed--they burn great!

I should have said Canadian. I've only burned a few bags. But what I burned was exceptional.

Thanks for the correction. See @Harman Lover 007 I'm not always right!

 

[Mr. Spock]

When I burn through a few bags I will update the thread. Not fair to judge one bag me thinks. It doesn't look promising though. Note the burn box looks dirty too. Typically I get a nice fine white ash that coats the area behind the burn. It looks quite nice and the stove ran full on yesterday all day. I hope it's a fluke cause I got 4 tons.

Who is Mr. Warm? His he affiliated with Okanagan?

If I see some Le Crete's I will give em a go. Maybe I will need them to clean the stove?

 

[Gaddy]

I hope you're wrong about the Gold. I ordered 4 ton. 2 Douglas Fur and 2 Gold. Last year I burned 4 ton Geneva-- while they were hot they were dirty/ashy. I had to clean my stove every 2 days or so. Hoping better from the Okanagan.

 

[Mr. Spock]

Not really judging yet just my initial observations. Never had hard clinkers before. That I am sure of. However it was just one bag so far. The boss is working on burning another right now.

I found the Geneva to be ashy but not dirty. Usually they leave a fine white powdery ash on the heat exchanger. But a lot of ash in the ash pan.

 

[jtakeman]

I ordered 4 ton. 2 Douglas Fur

No worries there. Best pellet I have seen in New England. Cleanest pellet I have ever tested. And thats a very long list. Pricey though!

Not fair to judge one bag me thinks. It doesn't look promising though.

Understood, To be fair, We'll let ya burn some more. But keep us posted!

Who is Mr. Warm? His he affiliated with Okanagan?

Yes, He(Douglas Middleton) is the North American managing director for Viridis Energy. The company that is marketing the Okanagan pellet line. If you need his contact info? Let me know!

 

[Harman Lover 007]

See @Harman Lover 007 I'm not always right!

Whoa, wait, stop the presses! What did you say???

 

[jtakeman]

Whoa, wait, stop the presses! What did you say???

Hey it ain't often, But it happens.

ME made a boo boo! Whoopsie! I'd do a lil more homework fur I open my yap again!

Off to find out where North Country are made!

 

[Mr. Spock]

Cleaned the fire box down to bare metal.
Waited for the boss to go to bed last night and ran another bag through.
Stove Temp 7 , Feed Rate 4 and Blower High. I never run the stove this way but figured it would be a good test. Long hot burn.

Two fans in the bay window so I didn't cook our pooch.

Made some more gold nuggets...



When I put my hands in the pot to search for clinkers I noticed the ash feels like a scotch brite pad. Prickly and rough.

 

[jtakeman]

Darn things look like the clinkers I was getting with the Lake Region and the grass pellets we burnt. Might have some mineral like silica in them?

 

[Mr. Spock]

I have not found a good explanation of exactly what makes up a clinker. I have read silica and other minerals (no explanation to what they are) in the wood melt and fuse with the ash.

::edit :: I have also read that sodium can lower the melting point of said minerals making clinker formation more likely.

 

[ScotL]

The melting point they are referring to is the Ash Fusion Temperature. There's an expensive test that can be done to determine a pellet's ash fusion temperature. It's expensive because of the extreme heat. It's not done very often because it is not a requirement for determining fuel quality.

The lab will give results for a reducing atmosphere and for an oxidizing atmosphere. I don't know why since we have an oxidizing atmosphere in the real world. It's like when they give you the moisture and ash free calorific value (BTU/lb) which is a pet-peeve of mine. It's a useless number. The only values that matter are the ones achievable in normal use. Sometimes you'll see the moisture and ash free results reported, as if that's what the pellets will produce in your stove. If you're seeing 8900 to 9000 BTU/lb, that's usually the moisture and ash free result. If you see 8250 to 8600 BTU/lb, that's probably "as received". It annoys me when anything but the "as received" result is reported because that's just lying to the customer. I'm not saying this particular pellet does that. I'm just getting off on a tangent on a topic that annoys me.

Anyway, the higher the temperature results, the less the ash will fuse together. The labs give 4 temperatures: when the ash starts to deform, then when it softens, then when it forms a hemispherical ball in the test chamber, then when it turns to fluid.

For example, an Initial Deforming Temperature at 2410F, Softening at 2440F, Hemispherical at 2480F, and Fluid at 2550F is not likely to form clinkers. It would be difficult to get ash that hot in a stove. The melting point of steel is typically 2500F.

Ash fusion is heavily dependent on mineral content and species.

 

[Mr. Spock]

I don't think the fire in the burn pot is getting anywhere near the temp numbers you have stated. But still, clinkers are there.

 

[jtakeman]

The lab will give results for a reducing atmosphere and for an oxidizing atmosphere. I don't know why since we have an oxidizing atmosphere in the real world. It's like when they give you the moisture and ash free calorific value (BTU/lb) which is a pet-peeve of mine. It's a useless number. The only values that matter are the ones achievable in normal use. Sometimes you'll see the moisture and ash free results reported, as if that's what the pellets will produce in your stove. If you're seeing 8900 to 9000 BTU/lb, that's usually the moisture and ash free result. If you see 8250 to 8600 BTU/lb, that's probably "as received". It annoys me when anything but the "as received" result is reported because that's just lying to the customer. I'm not saying this particular pellet does that. I'm just getting off on a tangent on a topic that annoys me.

I don't know why they even list these moisture/ash free values. I agree only "as received" should be all anyone looks at. The others will never be seen in the real world. More like a fairy tail IMHO. I have heard a few pellet dealers using them and Got odd looks when I said we'd never see them.

Ash fusion is heavily dependent on mineral content and species.

Sodium or salt from what I have heard is one of the key factors of clinker formation. Something about how is becomes a binder for heavier minerals that are also in the ash. Similar to the starches or sugar in corn which clinkers in lower temps. Interesting how they form and how certain things can effect whether or not they do form.

When I think southern, I think of a tree grown in a high salinity. But I suppose that could happen in any region. I'm not sure I'd pick a tree grown in a tidal marsh for pellet production. But then again, I hear some mills soak the trees in a salt bath to help remove the bark. I would think the salt/sodium content of a southern grown tree would be higher than one that was grown in the north.

 

[ScotL]

New York state published a large study on wood fuels.
www.nyserda.ny.gov/-/media/Files/Publications/Research/Biomass-Solar-Wind/elemental-analysis-wood-fuel.pdf
Ash fusion is around page 22.

 

[jtakeman]

I did a little searching and came up with nada on how minerals can effect the formation. Or whether or not a particular mineral might like the silica in grass. When grass is made into pellets the silica forms clinkers very easily.

Interesting topic, Just not a lot out there besides temp studies.

 

[Steve76]

I picked up a few bags of Okie Gold and they seem to burn very well, with very little ash.

That said, I haven't burned them at high settings yet. I will try that when the weather calls for it. So far, I haven't seen anything like mentioned above. I will post up, if I find anything bad about these pellets.

So far, so good......

 

[Mr. Spock]

@Gaddy did you get around to burning some of those Okies?

 

[The Grintch]

I've burned about 2 bags so far and haven't found a clinker yet, but I will keep my feelers out!

Thank for the heads up.

 

[Cleetussnow]

I picked up 10 bags to try yesterday. I want to set my stove up for softies since I am getting several tons of clean fires.

And I cannot get these pellets to burn. Just very little flame and very low heat. And I set the stove up with my magnahelic.

Needless to say I am surprised. And disappointed.

 

[Mr. Spock]

I would try some other pellets just to be sure. It could be that you have a draft issue.