Pellet stove meter: prototype needed

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smwilliamson

smwilliamson

The Stove Guy
Hearth Supporter
Dec 28, 2009
4,532
Southcoast, MA
www.pellet-stove-parts-4less.com
I need some help from my friends here. I need to make an electronic meter that can record RPM's of an auger, room temps and exhaust temps and store the information inside of a chip that can be uploaded to a database, ultimately WiFi...anyone here know how to do that?
 
You could probably use an arduino and some specific addons.

Would require a little programming. What's the interface for gathering the data from the stove? Off the digital control board?
 
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earl764 said:
You could probably use an arduino and some specific addons.

Would require a little programming. What's the interface for gathering the data from the stove? Off the digital control board?
Click to expand...


That arduino would be a nice custom job and probably work very well, good for a SkunkWorks project. LOL I would just spend the big bucks for commercial grade equipment. I worked on older equipment like that with the IEEE bus and the RS232 interface but the new stuff has USB interface bus so it is easy peasy! As far as the WiFi DB goes I would use an IBM/Lotus Web Server and DB just because I have one connected to my iPhone5 but if you want to go a little cheaper then go for a nice Apache / Tomcat web server / database and then don't forget to get an ISP that does not block incoming port 80. Comcast does but there are ways around it. LOL
 
X10 has temper sensors and thermostats. I'm sure you can find something that counts rotations also. It could be as simple as a sensor picking up each time that a point comes around on the shaft.
 
I guess one important question is what stove? Generic or one in particular? We have to assume that a modern stove w/ a digital control board is getting this data back from the components and reacting to it.

Do stove manufacturers use similar boards or is each one unique to a given company?(I'm assuming each is unique).

Would need to take say 5 manufacturers as an example pool. Harman, Englander, Travis and Quad. Get the spec sheets for their control boards and see if they list the pin outs. They probably have their own troubleshooting tools they sell to their dealers that connect to an interface on the board. They're most likely using serial interfaces to connect, but in a custom pinout.

This will probably end up needing a special device for each vendor. It would be like trying to do the same on cars, but without the ODBII interface.
 
earl764 said:
I guess one important question is what stove? Generic or one in particular? We have to assume that a modern stove w/ a digital control board is getting this data back from the components and reacting to it.

Do stove manufacturers use similar boards or is each one unique to a given company?(I'm assuming each is unique).

Would need to take say 5 manufacturers as an example pool. Harman, Englander, Travis and Quad. Get the spec sheets for their control boards and see if they list the pin outs. They probably have their own troubleshooting tools they sell to their dealers that connect to an interface on the board. They're most likely using serial interfaces to connect, but in a custom pinout.

This will probably end up needing a special device for each vendor. It would be like trying to do the same on cars, but without the ODBII interface.
Click to expand...


Yes, an API would be needed here. That is an Application Programming Interface and even if it does exist, the type of data available may be limited. :-)
 
The 2 most accurate meters for rpm I use are either non contact(optical) or Contact(mechanical-measure at the shaft). I know you like graingers so here are some links.

Temps can be recorded with data loggers. I dig to see if I can find a data logger for rpm.

(broken link removed)
(broken link removed)


(broken link removed)

Data loggers,

(broken link removed)
 
smwilliamson said:
Yeah, it will need an API. Don, can you make this thing? Just need a generic prototype that can be adapted to different stoves.
Click to expand...


An API is not something by itself. An API is usually built in to a product like a control board then an API toolkit would be needed to access and customize the data. My suggestion above is one of the best ways to do it. The arduino might be more fun.
 
jtakeman said:
The 2 most accurate meters for rpm I use are either non contact(optical) or Contact(mechanical-measure at the shaft). I know you like graingers so here are some links.

Temps can be recorded with data loggers. I dig to see if I can find a data logger for rpm.

(broken link removed)
(broken link removed)


(broken link removed)

Data loggers,

(broken link removed)
Click to expand...


You are on the right track Jay with this gear using the USB interface. The key here is the ability to program the test gear for the desired data and data calculations to be uploaded to the database for charting and reporting.
 
smwilliamson said:
So here's the application...states will cut us back rebate checks if we can monitor the usage of biomass thermal heating in useful BTU's
Click to expand...


Cut checks for who? The home owner?
 
If auger motors are fixed RPM, why ya gotta count'em? You just need to know when they are energized and when they are not. Time X rated RPM.
 
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BrotherBart said:
If auger motors are fixed RPM, why ya gotta count'em? You just need to know when they are energized and when they are not. Time X rated RPM.
Click to expand...


X2, what is the calculation Scott to save money? You said some time of fuel monitoring and BTU output?

If a stove is rated at 45 BTUs per hour then what are the checks for money based on?
 
Hello

My oil forced hot water system is rated at 109,000 BTUs per hour but my previous wood pellet stove heated the same space was 45,000 BTUs per hour. Heating water and running it through copper fin baseboard is alot different than heating air with a wood pellet stove. How would you calculate the offset here?

Are you talking about Carbon Offsetting? How is that calculated here?
 
If you just need btu cant you forgo rpm. I would think inlet air temp outlet air temp and flow rate via a air velocity meter gives you btu into the room. Do the same for exhaust can calculate waste energy.
 
Don2222 said:
Hello

My oil forced hot water system is rated at 109,000 BTUs per hour but my previous wood pellet stove heated the same space was 45,000 BTUs per hour. Heating water and running it through copper fin baseboard is alot different than heating air with a wood pellet stove. How would you calculate the offset here?
Click to expand...


Its been argued that the space requires X amount of btu's no matter the source used. Your furnace used 109K to heat the space and the pellet stove only used 45K. He's the tickler. The pellet stove ran longer than the furnace generally speaking. Where you saved was on fuel cost for the most part......
 
I guess I would n3ed to see how it is written. If you want to know how many btu you are producing all you need is temps and air flow. But if you need mass of pellet that is another story. Moter revs can be tricky because density of pellets through auger varies. I could see small pellets vs large pellets delivering different masses for same revs. Motor revs would only work if you were pushing a solid like a liquid.
 
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