RSF Woodburning Fireplace vs. Jotul Woodburning Stove

[ClubbyG]

Hello All!

Just wanted to say what a fantastic site and forum this is I already have learned so much. I just got the 'price protection sheet' from our oil company--NO WAY I'm paying that much, so I'm definitely in the market along with tons of others, I'm sure. We have been in our house (which had most remodeling done in the 70's) for 8 years and it has a heatilator that we use whenever we can, but I'm sure it is close to outliving its useful life and we have to keep it fed every few hours.

The heatilator is I guess what you would call a zero-clearnace fireplace with metal chimney pipe enclosed within a 3-sided wall that extends to ceiling. I went to a local stove dealer and he suggested I go with an RSF Opel wood burning fireplace and pop that in where the heatilator now is and redo the chimney behind the wall which would save me from having to tear out sheetrock, plaster, and some old hand-hewn posts. I would only need to frame for new opening size.

I am, however, drooling over the Jotul woodstoves and just like the look and the idea of heat radiating all over...it seems like a woodstove would give off more heat overall, but the local dealer said they are pretty much apples and oranges (perhaps because of the included blower on the fireplaces?)

My wife does not like the idea of me tearing everything up, so wondering if anyone could comment on which might do a better job blowing out tons of heat. The living room is cathedral ceiling, exposed beam with ceiling fan with somewhat of an open floor plan to other rooms. (The existing heatilator and ceiling fan do a so so job of getting heat to other rooms.)

Thanks so much in advance.

 

[savageactor7]

You'll absolutely get more heat from a free standing stove...any dealer will tell ya that to. Inserts are more appealing to the eye though...the whole charm of a fire place and all. But if you want heat...then start looking at free standing stoves.

 

[Todd]

An insert would be cheaper than tearing out the whole fireplace and installing a new class A chimney and hearth for a free standing stove or new fireplace. But it all depends on what you like the looks of best. I like the looks and radiant heat of stoves. Both will pay for themselves eventually.

 

[begreen]

The pros here really like the RSF units. It sounds like you have been given a good recommendation. The difference between the current Heatilator and the Opel will be significant. A freestanding stove (say the large Jotul F600) will be of greater help if the power goes out because it won't depend on a blower and they are beautiful classic stoves, so it all depends on the look you are trying to achieve and the heating goals.

Another option might be putting in an insert in the current unit, but it sounds like you want a large heater.

As far as heat circulation, that could be another issue entirely, independent of the heating source. How big a house is this? How large is the room with the stove?

 

[ClubbyG]

Man...you guys rock. Thanks for the input.

The heating room is around 350-400 square feet...the house is around 2200 sq. ft. I dont mind if we get blown out of the room as long as some of the heat gets pushed to the other rooms. I guess in a nutshell, I want a unit that could (theoretically) provide 10-12 hrs burn time and provide a good amount of heat and am leaning toward Jotul F600 if we go the stove route......I think I would like to avoid ripping out the wall/chase. However, it seems that the ZC fireplaces depend heavily on the blowers to dissipate heat and be on same par as wood stove? (I guess it seems quite logical as there are less edges to radiate, but just wondering from others experiences).

Which leads me to another question. We closed off a loft adjoining the room and now enter it from the other side due to an addition we added a few years back. Would it be unsafe/against code to put some kind of register in the wall of the loft near the cathedral ceiling so that the heat flowed through the loft into the rest of our addition?

Please pardon the quick sketch, but hopefully it illustrates the setup:

I would probably avoid an insert as the heatilator unit itself seems quite old.

Thanks again, all!

 

[begreen]

There's no law that says you can't put a register there. After all, what if it was an open balcony? I would recommend possibly putting a window there instead to give light and privacy in the summer, yet openable for heat in the winter. A fan in the lower doorway blowing towards the stove will also help circulation.

 

[ClubbyG]

Many thanks BeGreen and everyone for all the replies!

I guess I'll have to decide between ripping out the chase or not. Seems that at the very least, a newer unit--whether fireplace or stove--will give me plenty more heat and longer burn times which is my main goal. I'll certainly post my experiences, and keep up the good work everyone!

I'd love to hear more thoughts on wood burning fireplaces vs stoves, if anyone has any input...

Viva renewable energy!

 

[begreen]

If you choose that route, the chase can be out in a matter of hours. Tent the area first to contain the dust, then have at it. Leave the tent up until the sheetrock repair is completed. If you put in the F600, what kind of hearth would you put it on? That looks like the focal point of the room and could be done up quite nicely.

If you chose to go with the Opel it has the advantage of being ductable to other parts of the house if they aren't too far away.

 

[webbie]

I think both ideas (Jotul or RSF) are good ones...and decent built-ins like the RSF, Quad, BIS, etc....they can really crank out the heat.

So let your style, your mate and your budget be your guide!

 

[ClubbyG]

If you choose that route, the chase can be out in a matter of hours. Tent the area first to contain the dust, then have at it. Leave the tent up until the sheetrock repair is completed. If you put in the F600, what kind of hearth would you put it on? That looks like the focal point of the room and could be done up quite nicely.

If you chose to go with the Opel it has the advantage of being ductable to other parts of the house if they aren't too far away.

If F600, was thinking tile and cement board. Similar to what came with the house and the heatilator but different type of tile. I guess my other hesitation is our little guys with the woodstove. We can pretty much barricade them away from the fireplace at the moment...might be harder with the stove...

Maybe I'll do what I usually do with momentous decisions...pull out a nice shiny quarter and give it a flip!

 

[begreen]

Younguns learn pretty quickly about owee and hot! They seem to have a natural respect for stoves and fireplaces. Unless they're like my brother that gravitated towards flame like a moth. There are child guard cages if this is a concern.

One question - if you go with the Opel, can it reuse the Heatilator flue or does this have to be replaced anyway?

 

[ClubbyG]

I think both ideas (Jotul or RSF) are good ones...and decent built-ins like the RSF, Quad, BIS, etc....they can really crank out the heat.

So let your style, your mate and your budget be your guide!

Words to live by, Craig! A million thanks for launching this site...a fantastic resource!

--

I think Opel takes 7" pipe, so I'd have to switch out all the same...but the flue is quite old and needs to be replaced anyway. Very true about the child guard...

I do also like your idea about ducting the Opel. There are some nice options for venting and blowers from RSF. What do you think of the idea of trying to send some heat via blower back into our forced air setup underneath floor (unheated basement)? I could possibly try and wrap the duct work to insulate it. Maybe about a 16 ft run...you think insulated flexible heating duct would suffice?

 

[begreen]

A 16 ft run would not be too long and should make a big difference. Will that get the heat deep into the other space? If not, maybe extend the run further and plan on having the output (register grille) near a cold air source in that area like a perimeter outside door or large window. The duct will have to be well insulated. If the basement is unheated but well sealed, maybe consider dumping a little heat down there too. Warm floors are a nice thing and it may give water pipes protection from freezing.

 

[westview]

Just starting to do my homework. The local dealer recommends the RSF Opel. It looks great to me but I'd like to do the due diligence research. In the forum webmaster mentions other manufacturers. I've wandered the Internet aimlessly for enough hours now, can anyone point me to a "comprehensive" discussion of built-ins? I want heat but my wife doesn't want a stove in the room so I have her sold on a built in.
Thanks!

 

[FLASHMAN]

you could always go with a Jotul insert... They make some GORGEOUS inserts.... That said, I run a Jotul F600 and love it

 

[begreen]

There are many zero clearance stove discussions here. Do a search on either the brand you are interested in or on zero clearance. Here's a couple starters:

https://www.hearth.com/talk/threads/8074/
https://www.hearth.com/talk/threads/8357/

 

[jrousell]

I have owned an Opel for about 5 years now.. Have any specific questions about it that I can answer for you?

 

[eloise]

I have a question about the opel 2. It is a cosmetic question. The two I have seen in stores have very rough looking bolts holdiong the door onto the hinge. it looks very unfinished to me. It is not the look I would like in the living room. Does your stove have these silve metal nuts and bolts or is the hardware more finished looking? It is one of the reasons i keep looking for other stoves like the Heatilator or Heat n glo. But so far, the technical part of the RSF seems to be the best for what I need.
Thank you.

 

[Rob From Wisconsin]

We are also interested in purchasing an RSF unit. We have also owned several Jotuls.
The way I understand it, an RSF fireplace is a total woodburning experience. You get
the full visual benefits of an ordinary fireplace, while also getting the whole-house
heating capabiilites of a wood furnace/stove. But, buyer be forwarned, RSF units are
rather expensive ($4000-$5000 installed w/ pipe & hearth). But, as I was told, it is a
well-spent investment. I'm looking forward to purchasing the smaller "Chamelon" unit.

Check my thread on "Worth the Trip to Canada" - are you close enough to the border to save
some money????

P.S. - Jotuls have become rather expensive this year also vs. previous years..........

 

[jrousell]

I have an Opel model made about 2002, not teh opel"2" that they sell today - so I am not sure that I cna answer your question.


honestly - on mine.. it is such a small part you would have to get up close to even see it. and on mine it doesn;t appear out of the ordinary in my opinion. nobody in the world will ever see that other than you really. Heck if I took teh 10 seconds to paint them black I coudln;t even see the adjustment nuts. If it bothered you even after being painted black to match teh rest of teh flat surface, you could cover it with a fancier nut or cap or whatever....

Mine has adjustments so that you cna adjust teh door to amke sure it closese just right. without those adjustments- I think you would be missing the tweakability you migth need...

here is a full size picture
http://i278.photobucket.com/albums/kk87/jrousell/Home/RSF_Opel.jpg?t=1224851354

 

[by2447]

adkdadto4;

We are looking into the opel 3 to install this spring.
Since you have had one for 5 years, would you share some of your thoughts and take some specific questions via email or pm?

Thanks
by2447

 

[LLigetfa]

I wanted to install the Opel in my former home for its larger firebox but it was an alcove install and I didn't have the clearance for it so settled on the smaller Onyx. I had installed the central heat centrifugal blower and ducting so it heated the entire house.

I sold the house after 5 years and built the one I'm in now. This time I could design in the clearance I'd need for the Opel but the wife decided the Onyx was adequate and didn't want the arched door look of the Opel. The only thing I did differently was that I reversed the fan. Rather than suck hot air out the top, I blow cold air in the bottom. The blower is below the floor drawing cooler air up and across the firebox. This allowed me to put a furnace filter inline.

The Onyx easily heats the entire 2200 sq ft house but the overnight burns are short with only coals left in the morning with little heat. I like the look of the Opel3. Too bad it wasn't available ten years ago when I bought my second Onyx.

 

[jrousell]

adkdadto4;

We are looking into the opel 3 to install this spring.
Since you have had one for 5 years, would you share some of your thoughts and take some specific questions via email or pm?

Thanks
by2447

If it is a question that you think others mirth benefit from.. ask it through the forums, otherwise just send me a PM..