running cold to producing steam

[debtfarm]

sorry for taking so long to reply about the problems i was having #1 was it had the wrong thermostat in it 170 insteaqd of 140 degree and the fan on the draft motor was on backwards both not my doing. now that i can produce heat i have another problem. i made steam for the first time today (was not the plan) is there a way to make the pump add more water to the boiler when the it is getting close to max temp and the tanks still got 40 degrees to go to reach its tempature

 

[Singed Eyebrows]

sorry for taking so long to reply about the problems i was having #1 was it had the wrong thermostat in it 170 insteaqd of 140 degree and the fan on the draft motor was on backwards both not my doing. now that i can produce heat i have another problem. i made steam for the first time today (was not the plan) is there a way to make the pump add more water to the boiler when the it is getting close to max temp and the tanks still got 40 degrees to go to reach its tempature

Are you using a loading unit(Lado/Termovar)? Could we get some more piping info., Randy

 

[taxidermist]

sorry for taking so long to reply about the problems i was having #1 was it had the wrong thermostat in it 170 insteaqd of 140 degree and the fan on the draft motor was on backwards both not my doing. now that i can produce heat i have another problem. i made steam for the first time today (was not the plan) is there a way to make the pump add more water to the boiler when the it is getting close to max temp and the tanks still got 40 degrees to go to reach its tempature

Gate your bypass closed more. Less water circulating around your bypass loop more heading to storage. I had the same problem when I first got my boiler. I went into idle mode and my tanks were no where near temp. Closed the ball valve and it came out of idle and started charging storge more.

Rob

 

[debtfarm]

i close the valve and it puts out more water for a short time i try to get the most flow i can at all times. i have to change the position of the ball valve depending on the return water temp. the colder the return the more i have to return. it all works great if i am returning 140 the thermestat is open and it has great flow.. its when the tank is below 140 i have problems with flow and i make steam

 

[debtfarm]

Here are the pictures of the system

 

[Singed Eyebrows]

Here are the pictures of the system

Is that mixer rated for the power of that big boiler? It looks like it is 1" pipe. I know a Laddomat 21G is only good to about 40KW & that has 1 1/4" fittings, Randy

 

[ewdudley]

Here are the pictures of the system

I'm sure you already have done it, but be sure to verify that the guts of the EBSE aren't upside down or something, if that's even possible.

(If that's plain old black poly pipe it's possible the situation could get a bit dodgy up over 65 degC / 150 degF.)

Here are the pictures of the system

Is that mixer rated for the power of that big boiler? It looks like it is 1" pipe. I know a Laddomat 21G is only good to about 40KW & that has 1 1/4" fittings, Randy

I think it's 2.0 inch coming out of the boiler and everything else is 1.5 inch. He says it's a Danfoss and at 1.5" the EBSE has a monster Cv of 20.0. Should be good for 100 kW even with that little pump.

--ewd

 

[Singed Eyebrows]

Can you verify that there is a large non restricted opening from the balancing valve port to the pump flange at low temps. It seems the pump inlet is being restricted at low temps. As EWD says check the inside of the mixer, & again verify that the 90 degree is unrestricted at low temps. I'm sure if a T was put in place of the mixer there wouldn't be a problem with steam so something seems wrong there, Randy

 

[Singed Eyebrows]

That pump can't be in backwards can it? Arrow points toward boiler, Randy

 

[ewdudley]

That pump can't be in backwards can it? Randy

Out-of-the-box the pump would flow from down to up as you read the plate, or left to right in the picture.

Also, if the cartridge had been rotated 180 degrees from out-of-the-box then there would be some protrusion of the discharge passage housing into the exit passage casting in the upper left just at the apex of the cable entering the pump motor peckerhead.

 

[woodsmaster]

Is it ok to use plastic pipe ? Never seen anyone use it before.

 

[kabbott]

Is it ok to use plastic pipe ? Never seen anyone use it before.

In a word...NO
If that is poly, and it sure looks like it, with screw clamps and making steam... Sounds like a good way to get your name in the paper.
I wouldn't touch it with a ten foot pole.

 

[flyingcow]

Is it ok to use plastic pipe ? Never seen anyone use it before.

In a word...NO
If that is poly, and it sure looks like it, with screw clamps and making steam... Sounds like a good way to get your name in the paper.
I wouldn't touch it with a ten foot pole.

Thats what jumped out at me also. Black piping, as in well piping? Can't be. Can it?

 

[Singed Eyebrows]

That pump can't be in backwards can it? Randy

Out-of-the-box the pump would flow from down to up as you read the plate, or left to right in the picture.

Also, if the cartridge had been rotated 180 degrees from out-of-the-box then there would be some protrusion of the discharge passage housing into the exit passage casting in the upper left just at the apex of the cable entering the pump motor peckerhead.

Hopefully peckerhead is a hydronics term Dudly, My question was just that, a question, Randy

 

[leaddog]

I'm not sure how that valve works but it sounds like you may have it hooked up backwards. You need the hot side hooked to the hot from the boiler, the cold side in the return side and the mixed side going into the boiler. It sounds to me like you have the hot and the cold side backwards and that is why it doesn't flow when the water is cold. Just a thought
leaddog

 

[Singed Eyebrows]

I'm not sure how that valve works but it sounds like you may have it hooked up backwards. You need the hot side hooked to the hot from the boiler, the cold side in the return side and the mixed side going into the boiler. It sounds to me like you have the hot and the cold side backwards and that is why it doesn't flow when the water is cold. Just a thought
leaddog

Yes, somehow that pump inlet is restricted. If the mixer has a 20CV as EWD says that should be pretty close to a 1 1/4" full bore ball valve & the boiler would not steam provided there is no pump issue. I'm hoping the thread starter will look inside the mixer & find out what is happening there, Randy

 

[tom in maine]

It is black poly and hose clamps.
Yikes!

 

[ewdudley]

That pump can't be in backwards can it? Randy

Out-of-the-box the pump would flow from down to up as you read the plate, or left to right in the picture.

Also, if the cartridge had been rotated 180 degrees from out-of-the-box then there would be some protrusion of the discharge passage housing into the exit passage casting in the upper left just at the apex of the cable entering the pump motor peckerhead.

Hopefully peckerhead is a hydronics term Dudly, My question was just that, a question, Randy

And of course a reasonable question I would say. I was wondering the same thing until I noticed that there is a slight difference in the casting on the discharge side that would be visible if the pump was reversed.

Sorry, couldn't resist the opportunity to use the vernacular term for motor junction box.

As a few have also concluded it sure sounds like the ports on the valve are mis-connected somehow, but the photo appears to be a normally situated Danfoss EBSE, cold from the left, hot from the top side, and mixed to the right. How about a close-up photo?

Cheers --ewd

 

[flyingcow]

It is black poly and hose clamps.
Yikes!

+1

 

[Fred61]

My Danfoss was assembled backwards when I received it. A good way to tell if is assembled correctly is to remove the plate and look to see if the bypass water is set up to flow on to the thermostat's sensing side. That would be the side that has the protrusion with a spring on it. On start-up or any other reason for cold return it's the bypass water that actuates the thermostat. That's why the manual bypass valve should never be completely closed.

 

[Fred61]

Oh! and by the way when the boiler does get up to temperature you will be able to draw that poly pipe into poly thread and you'll be able to knit yourself some poly underwear.

 

[henfruit]

Fred, i am looking at a dafoss instlation form and it shoes the spring towards the wood boiler. the could be on wrong confusing the situation.

 

[Fred61]

Fred, i am looking at a dafoss instlation form and it shoes the spring towards the wood boiler. the could be on wrong confusing the situation.

That's right, the spring should be toward the boiler. The reason I used the bypass example was to remove any confusion on the orientation. If I remember correctly it could be assembled backwards. The bypass must not have anything that restricts the flow. Remove the plate and make sure the flow from the bypass is unrestricted and flows over the sensor on the thermostat. This might be a little difficult for you since I didn't see a ball valve on the boiler side of the Danfoss. I couldn't tell if your circulator flanges were equipped with a valve.

 

[henfruit]

Fred mine is still a box. soon to be installed.that is a good idea for ball valves at all the spots where you may need to replace a pump or other componet that could fail.