Switching to a Boiler

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Medic21

Medic21

Minister of Fire
Feb 26, 2017
1,163
Northern Indiana
the Shelter is going to be regulated to shop duties this year. Not putting that much effort into heating the house. It works efficient but is too labor intensive.

I’m looking at a couple different boilers right now but, I have zero experience with them.

How big of a pump for a 50-100 foot run for heat exchanged, water to water heater, and a air handler for the garage?

How deep should I figure on digging in the lines?

Is the wrap insulation sufficient? I’ve seen so much both ways.

1600 sq ft living space with unfinished basement. I am looking at two brands. The EZ-Boiler larger unit since I eventually would like to heat with floor heat in the new shop is my first choice pending the trip to inspect one soon. Looks like a solid unit. Of course I’m also looking at a Central Boiler unit too. I want to look at one up close since I have had the fun of a cheaper unit with this shelter.

Any and all feedback of pitfalls to avoid and suggestions would be wonderful.
 
My .02, hope it helps.

How big of a pump for a 50-100 foot run for heat exchanged, water to water heater, and a air handler for the garage?

Pump size would depend on heat load. The size of air handlers, coil sizes. I use use an NRF-22 or NRF-25 for most small-medium houses using 1" pex. Is the garage coming off the house loop or a separate one?

How deep should I figure on digging in the lines?
If they're insulated well 18-24" should work well. It's not a well line. Deeper has more water issues.
Is the wrap insulation sufficient? I’ve seen so much both ways.
If you have standing water in the spring thaw I'd lean toward foam pipe, further south I haven't seen as many issues with wrapped.

1600 sq ft living space with unfinished basement. I am looking at two brands. The EZ-Boiler larger unit since I eventually would like to heat with floor heat in the new shop is my first choice pending the trip to inspect one soon. Looks like a solid unit. Of course I’m also looking at a Central Boiler unit too. I want to look at one up close since I have had the fun of a cheaper unit with this shelter.
I'd suggest looking at online reviews like furnacecompare.com. I think EZboiler was connected with Ridgewood at one time. There are several other brands out there. Heatmaster (which I install), Crown Royal, Polar, P&M, Hardy, Heatmor, etc.


Any and all feedback of pitfalls to avoid and suggestions would be wonderful.
A local dealer with a genuine concern for his customers is huge if you ever get in a bind.
 
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I had 75 feet of thermopex foam insulated pipe at my house in Maine .
It can be run above ground if you put iN the system after the ground freezes.
I buried mine at 12" per manufacturer spec.
The ground stayed frozen, and the snow over it never melted.
Manufacturer rated to loose 1 degree every 100 ft.
I never noticed any temperature loss.
Put your money into the pipe , heating the ground is a huge waste of your time and money.
Everything I've seen about the wrap stuff is bad news
 
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You should start with coming up with a ballpark heat load/loss figure for all your loads then go from there - size your circ & piping based on being able to efficiently move the needed number of BTUs/hr. There are some online calculators although haven't used one myself.

Stay away (well away) from the wrapped pipe IMO.

Is an indoor boiler in the basement out of the question?

Lots of homework ahead. :)
 
maple1 said:
Lots of homework ahead.
Click to expand...
When I looked at installing a boiler system a few years back, it didn't take me too long to figure out that project would be biting off more than I wanted to chew...so that was the end of it for me.
 
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Do you have an existing heating system other than the Shelter? A model #, btu rating would be helpful. It may not be exact but can be a ballpark # to aim at.
More details..
 
E Yoder said:
Do you have an existing heating system other than the Shelter? A model #, btu rating would be helpful. It may not be exact but can be a ballpark # to aim at.
More details..
Click to expand...

Yes I added a propane furnace and CA system last summer and dumped the electric baseboard heat. My gas furnace is 60,000 btu and does a wonderful job. I’m looking at the EZ Boiler EZ-Pro. No btu rating I have found but supposed to heat 7,000 total square feet. I want to add a loop to heat the shop later so the bigger unit is a must.

My furnace guy is fabbing up a holder for the heat exchanger in the return side.
 
Thanks to the wonderful EPA and IDEM I cannot get the Central Boiler unit I want. CL5036 is not allowed to be sold in Indiana.

EZ Boiler will have to do.
 
Never heard of EZ boiler before...looks to be an old school smoke dragon unit...which I though were banned as of about a year ago...but must not be?
Unless you have already made up your mind, I'd look at Portage and Main and also Polar boilers...hear a lot good about both...and they won't smoke your neighbors out...
http://polarfurnace.com/
http://portageandmainboilers.com/
 
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brenndatomu said:
Never heard of EZ boiler before...looks to be an old school smoke dragon unit...which I though were banned as of about a year ago...but must not be?
Unless you have already made up your mind, I'd look at Portage and Main and also Polar boilers...hear a lot good about both...and they won't smoke your neighbors out...
Click to expand...
I think the CB CL5036 is on equal footing as far as being legal. The EPA's lack of enforcement has really muddied the waters.
Anyway, a smaller circulator, like an NRF-22 with 1" pex loop would do your domestic water and heat with that load.
 
brenndatomu said:
Never heard of EZ boiler before...looks to be an old school smoke dragon unit...which I though were banned as of about a year ago...but must not be?
Unless you have already made up your mind, I'd look at Portage and Main and also Polar boilers...hear a lot good about both...and they won't smoke your neighbors out...
Click to expand...

It’s not banned under the epa. Lovely Indiana Department of Enviromental Management has put the 5036, one of the most popular burners around here, on the states banned list.

I wanted to stay away from gasification, way too picky with wood, and go with a good ole natural draft.

http://www.ezboilers.com/

I’m going with the EZ-Pro model. Driving up and picking it up to save a little more. I’ll need to get the insulated pex line going to the house. I have not talked to one person that would recommend not going with the foam filled. Will go with 1 1/4 to lower friction loss. Everything else will be copper in the house.
 
You mentioned having the coil in the return. I do that fairly often but usually stop the flow through the coil when the fan isn't running using a secondary loop for two reasons:
1. Heat can convect up the cold air return and make a hot area by the return grill.
2. Some gas furnaces can trip the fan on because of the hot air going across it, making it run after the thermostat stops calling for heat. Yours may not do that.
Just a couple things to keep an eye out for.

I wonder how EZboiler is exempt?
 
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Medic21 said:
I don’t have neighbors...
Click to expand...
OK...so you won't smoke out the people over in Ohio that get to breath the air after y'all done with it ::-) ;lol
 
E Yoder said:
You mentioned having the coil in the return. I do that fairly often but usually stop the flow through the coil when the fan isn't running using a secondary loop for two reasons:
1. Heat can convect up the cold air return and make a hot area by the return grill.
2. Some gas furnaces can trip the fan on because of the hot air going across it, making it run after the thermostat stops calling for heat. Yours may not do that.
Just a couple things to keep an eye out for.

I wonder how EZboiler is exempt?
Click to expand...

Ok, spoke with the guy I bought my furnace off of. He said the model I got will give me problems with the limits if it is in the return. So I’m going to raise the A Coil and put it under that. That is what Goodman recommends.

Thank you, something I never would have thought about.
 
This is just a guess-
I don't know how your duct is configured but if it's above the A coil where the air is spread out the air flow might go through the coil more evenly and heat better.
I've put coils down tight on the outlet of the air handler and it only blows through the middle of the coil.
As far as the limits go, if you stop the water flow through the coil with the thermostat then if the limit trips, when the water flow stops with a thermostat it would cool off and shut the fan off. But putting it on the other side eliminates it anyway. I'm sure he knows his equipment better than me.
 
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