Vertical Storage of Splitter With Extended Ram?

[velvetfoot]

I didn't think about it when I put the splitter away a pretty long time ago, but the ram has extended and has been that way for a long while.
It's inside a dry garage. Should I go through the trouble of trying to jack it back up? Maybe just recoat the ram with oil, though it's still pretty oily. I REALLY don't feel like putting gas in the engine, blah blah?

 

[smokinj]

I didn't think about it when I put the splitter away a pretty long time ago, but the ram has extended and has been that way for a long while.
It's inside a dry garage. Should I go through the trouble of trying to jack it back up? Maybe just recoat the ram with oil, though it's still pretty oily. I REALLY don't feel like putting gas in the engine, blah blah?

just put a little gas in it and run it back out mabe 4 oz.

 

[velvetfoot]

Yeah, I guess. Then put a block of wood underneath I guess.

 

[Dill]

Will it really make a difference? I don't think I've ever taken the time to compress hydraulic clyinders for storage.
Some only get used for a couple of weeks a year.

 

[Gator eye]

If you store the ram out you take the chance of it getting pitted and rusty.

A rusty cylinder is a junk cylinder.

 

[kevin j]

If it is inside, I'd just sprayit with chain lube, or wipe it down with EP90 gear oil, or bar lube, something tacky to prefvent rust. Farm equipment sits out side all year, but I would just grease up the rod and let it go.

k

 

[Corey]

Any hydraulic cylinder I've ever seen had a chrome plated rod. Even the most well maintained rod would get small corrosion pits and tear up seals big time if it weren't for the chrome plating.

 

[struggle]

I store mine in the vertical position and it has never dropped down before on its own. Is that what yours did? It would just make sense to draw it back in. It just makes sense that it will pit over time that way. If the cylinder drops on its own then maybe chain it so it won't do that again.

 

[velvetfoot]

I think it dropped down. I think I put it away up. I'll bite the bullet and do it soon. I'm just lazy.

 

[JustWood]

Draw it in ASAP. It doesn't take much to gouge the rod. Kids messing around or just accidently dropping a wrench or hammer on it .Once it is gouged you'll never keep seals in it again.

 

[Gooserider]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but if the cylinder is dropping, is that a sign of internal seal leakage, or is there some other problem?

Gooserider

 

[JustWood]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but if the cylinder is dropping, is that a sign of internal seal leakage, or is there some other problem?

Gooserider

Yes, it's not a big deal but will be over time as your splitter will lose power. These seals are pretty easy to change if you have some large wrenches and a vice to hold the rod.We have done many dump truck and rolloff cyclinders. The hardest part is man handling them out of the truck.

 

[billb3]

The pistons on my backhoe creep. One will creep halfway down overnite and the other will take a week to creep an inch.

I've seen where some wil split a pvc pipe to cover the piston so it doesn't get dinged.

Wiping it with hydraulic oil houldn't hurt it.

 

[kevin j]

might be the cylinder seals, but also could be the spool valve. They are not internally sealed, just metal to metal tight clearances from spool to bore, and a slight leakage would not be unusual. Could also be a thermal expansion issue, the cylinder will go in a rod extend direction. That is also normal.
If you want to retract it, I'd just tie or block it up, not do anything with the cylinder until there is known to be a problem. Granted not much load on this application, it should not leak down, but I don't think there is an issue. I would test it before needed for next season but I would not assume there is any problem worth putting money into.

k

 

[JustWood]

might be the cylinder seals, but also could be the spool valve. They are not internally sealed, just metal to metal tight clearances from spool to bore, and a slight leakage would not be unusual. Could also be a thermal expansion issue, the cylinder will go in a rod extend direction. That is also normal.
If you want to retract it, I'd just tie or block it up, not do anything with the cylinder until there is known to be a problem. Granted not much load on this application, it should not leak down, but I don't think there is an issue. I would test it before needed for next season but I would not assume there is any problem worth putting money into.

k

Agreed. Don't do anything to splitter until you notice power loss.

 

[velvetfoot]

I hope I didn't do anything bad:
I didn't want to start the engine-maybe I should have.
I managed to retract the piston by prying on it in a horizontal position with a series of wood splits and moving the control lever.
I got it retracted, but it pressurized the reservoir, which I found out when I unscrewed the filler plug (by accident!).
Now it seems that there is too much oil in the tank than there was in there last summer.
I say 'seems', cause it does seem to be level-it might have been a bit off level when I was using it and I had to add some fluid to make things work right.
Where could the extra oil have come from, if indeed there is any?
There is oil in the parts that should have oil (eg, pump), and something isn't dry and subject to corrosion now, right? I hope so. I don't see why, but...

The wedge is resting on a block of wood now.

I have no idea how long it took to leak down. I wasn't paying attention and it's been like that for a while.

 

[kevin j]

not to worry. By moving the spool valve you sent oil out of the closed end back to tank as you pushed the rod up. But nothing was going into the rod side since the pump was not turning. YOu just cavitated the rod side, i.e. created a space full of oil vapors. Won't hurt, but may slowly pull the rod back due to the vacuum. Or unlikely but possibly draw some air in the seals. no worries, justmove it slow if you start the engine.

another way to accomplish, albeit SLOW, is to remove the engine spark plug, tie the spool valve handle to extend, or move into detent in retract, then pull the engine over and over by recoil rope. Every few turns you are turning the pump and moving oil. Roughly 1 to 1.5 cubic inches per revolution. Since a gallon is 231 inches3, it would take maybe 50-75 engine revs per quart of oil moved. that could mean 10 to 30 pulls of the rope, but it will move slowly. Pump efficinecy is low at low rpm, but there is essentially no load either.
Note that won't work with a vane pump as they don't really work until a minimum rpm maybe 200 to 500 rpm. Gear pumps shold be just fine.

k

 

[Gooserider]

Presumably you didn't do anything to horrible... At worst you might have gotten some air into the system if your seals are leaking.

In theory, the entire hydraulic system should be full of fluid, including both sides of the cylinder. Except for the cylinder, everything else is fixed volume. The cylinder changes it's total volume depending on the piston position and the rod diameter - because the outside cylinder diameter is constant, the volume of the cylinder when retracted is less than the volume of the cylinder when extended, by the volume of the rod itself. Thus if you checked the fluid level in the resevoir, it should be slightly higher with the piston retracted...

(BTW, this is not a bad thing in operation, as it means the retract stroke should be faster than the extension stroke, although you get less pressure when pulling (not that it matters much)

Either way, your piston is better protected when retracted, and at worst, you will get some rough operation when starting up next as the air gets purged out of the system. (I would say to run the piston up and down a few cycles before trying to split...)

Gooserider

 

[velvetfoot]

Thanks guys.
I might start it up this weekend anyway with a little bit of fuel to make sure.
Maybe start up the generator too, see if that works.
Supposed to rain on Saturday anyway.

PS: I had to move that spare cylinder that HF sent me: Man is that heavy.

Here is what the manual says about bleeding:

Bleeding the Hydraulic System
If the Log Splitter begins to lose power or splitting efficiency, it may be a result of air becoming trapped
in the hydraulic system. Follow the steps below to bleed air from the system.
1. Loosen the Oil Plug (37) and make sure the o-ring is out of the way to expose the air hole in the
Oil Plug (37).
2. Remove the spark plug from the engine (see engine manual) to keep the engine from starting
during this process.
3. Push the Directional Valve (58) forward, toward the front of the Cylinder (1) (see FIGURE 1).
4. Pull the engine starter cord 10-15 times until the hydraulic cylinder piston moves forward.
CAUTION: Keep everything away from the splitting edge during this process.
5. Tighten the Oil Plug (37).
6. Replace the spark plug.
7. Test the Log Splitter to make sure it is operating properly. If not, repeat the above process.

 

[Gooserider]

That sounds more like the drill you should follow with ANY splitter to prime the hydraulic pump before initial startup - running the pump dry will cause damage that can lead to premature failure, so they want you to hand crank the engine over enough times that you have pulled oil into the pump and filled it - proven by getting enough oil into the cylinder to move the piston.

Air in the system might cause a power loss, but what I'd expect to see more is "jumpy" piston movement as the air gets compressed enough to overcome whatever resistance it encounters, then re-expands driving the piston extra fast as the resistance drops. (This of course assumes that the fluid level isn't so low the pump is sucking air, and isn't cavitating or otherwise behaving abnormally...)

As a method of bleeding air out of the system, I suppose it would work, but I would have expected doing a simple back and forth cycling of the ram a few times (without trying to do any splitting) would do a better job, just by making sure the fluid is moving fast enough that any bubbles get pushed out rather than having enough time to float back to the top of wherever they are at... (Sort of why power bleeding an automotive brake system is better than manual bleeding sometimes...)

Gooserider