Whitfield Auger Jam

[Miss Bailey]

i have an old Whitfield advantage 1 pellet stove. Started get'n a metal on metal sound from the auger so I removed the motor and end plate. The brass bushing, usually look like a hat, but the rim was completely worn (gone) and only the side remained.

Plus the auger shaft deformed the hole and made it sorta oblong. The metal on metal ground away part of the end plate. So I replaced the end plate and brass bushing. Put everything back together, spun the auger no problem whatsoever.

After reconnecting the motor and throwing about a quarter hopper full of pellets, it immediately jammed. So I emptied the hopper, disconnected the motor, and cleaned out the auger. Reinstalled ever thing again but not the motor. I did install the auger collar so I could grab it to turn the auger by hand. Again no problem it. I was able to spin it with one finger.

So this time I threw in just a small handful of pellets and turned it by hand. Well I wasn't able to cuz it jammed. Like the pellets were all wedged and my hand turning (using vice grips for additional torque) was extremely difficult. Sometimes I had to turn it backwards then forward again just to be able to apply enough force to make a rotation.

No way should it take this much force to turn the auger. No motor can crank the amount of force I was applying. So I took off the plate/removed the auger again to remove all/any pellets remaining. Again it spun with no effort whatsoever. So I dropped in like ten pellets. Immediately it binds and it's all at the bottom near the lower bushing/end plate.

When inserting the auger it takes a minute to locate the upper bushing, but once in I'm able to put the end plate/bushing back on. So with it back in place I tried to jiggle it from inside the empty hopper and there's little to no slack/looseness.

So I'm totally at a loss. Definitely need help. I read a post exactly the same as mine from back in 2010 but they never resolved it. So I don't know what they did or if they ever were able to fix it.

Appreciate any suggestions/help if you've had this same issue. The auger shaft is in excellent condition but for some reason the pellets are wedging and breaking into small bits.

Thank you

 

[Miss Bailey]

Ok so I reread that same post, same title, that was posted by R hatch7205 back in 2010.

He said after burning out several auger motors he got so fed up without being able to figure out what was causing it......he junked the stove and bought a new one.

Come on, there should be a solution, and the other guy who said he had the same exact same issue, well I guess he never figured it out either. Or should I say he didn't post anything as to it being solved. Neither of them have been on the forum since 2011 or so. Guess I won't find out what he ended up doing to resolve it.

So to give you an idea as to how much force it takes to turn the auger by hand, well I took a ratchet and locked it into the collar. Let me tell you it took tremendous force, like removing a lug nut, to spin that auger until the hand full of pellets went into the burn pot. Still plenty of small pieces remain on the auger bottom, next to the end plate/bushing, they start to go up then fall back down along the sides of the auger tube/canal and grind into smaller pieces. So the more pellets I crank thru, the more debris buildup and making even harder to turn.

So if you had this happen let me know.
Thanks


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[MButkus]

I have an Advantage II. I would look at the auger and the top end and the area it contact the brass bushing. Is the bottom contact smooth or all worn ? Something is wrong and should be a simple fix. Is there anything that is jamming the auger making it hit the pellets rather then pushing them up ? There is some play (up and down) when the auger is in place.
Are the pellets you are using good, not expanded and getting caught on the side of the auger.
Is the auger straight ? There are used one for sale on E-bay.

 

[Miss Bailey]

I have an Advantage II. I would look at the auger and the top end and the area it contact the brass bushing. Is the bottom contact smooth or all worn ? Something is wrong and should be a simple fix. Is there anything that is jamming the auger making it hit the pellets rather then pushing them up ? There is some play (up and down) when the auger is in place.
Are the pellets you are using good, not expanded and getting caught on the side of the auger.
Is the auger straight ? There are used one for sale on E-bay.

The auger seems to be in very good condition other than the top is a little discolored from the heat. It also looks straight. I've laid it on a flat surface and can't see any issue.

A little bit of up/down play, quarter to half inch, but seems normal as well. The pellets are good quality.

I'll stop by a shop Tuesday and see if I can talk to one of the techs plus I'll bring everything with me such as the auger, end plate with brass bushing, collar and motor.

It seems like the jamming is at the very bottom, lots of small pieces and debris. I got a message from the shop Saturday, missed the call, and he said the motor, aftermarket, probably isn't strong enough. I know that's not the issue. It takes serious force turning it using a ratchet. Wish I had a torque wrench just to see exactly how much force I'm applying. I'm sure it's way more than what the motor does.

Lastly, the same titled thread the OP got fed up burning up motors he junked it and bought a new pellet stove. Pretty drastic when it seems like it should be an easy fix. But how much money do you sink into it, he reached his breaking point after several motors. And they ain't cheap to boot, especially if you're buying OEM motors.

p.s. I did message both guys, one from Maine and I think the other guy is from central Mass, to see if they ever figured out what the problem was. Haven't heard anything back, both profiles show last time on the site was 2011.

And thanks for your input. If I remember right one of the guys had the advantage II stove.

I just can't figure it out and can't see or think of a logical reason it should be jamming like it is, especially since it was working fine prior to get'n the new bushing. Which it definitely needed since it was completely worn out and the auger had become metal on metal.

Thanks


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[Miss Bailey]

So I thought about it and took a good look at the end plate and noticed that ever so slight the auger was digging in on one area of the plate.

From that I guessed that the end plate hole elongated as the auger shaft moved further and further in that direction. So I assumed that the auger shaft was bending the upper bushing so it was no longer dead center and a little more to the right. I noticed when cranking the auger with a ratchet that some pieces of pellets were sliding back down to the bottom.

I took a long ratchet with a socket (outer edge) that was just slightly larger than the top of the auger and slide it into the upper bushing. Since it was a very snug fit I was able to bend/move the upper bushing to the left.

Tried a handful of pellets and it was much easier to turn the auger. So I reconnected the motor and gave it a try. Turned on the auger/feeder and sure enough it was turning!

Well turning for five minutes or so. Every minute or so I would reach for the collar and make sure it was indeed turning. Sure enough it was turning and at around the five minute mark of it turning without a jam......it Jammed.

Not only did it jam but there was a bright flash of light and everything went dead. I removed the motor and connected it directly to an outlet and sure enough it is still working.

So the flash I think came from the control panel. Now the stove no longer working at all. Not sure if there's a fuse or reset/breaker I could try.

25 years of use I guess was/is the limit. So now this thread is over cuz I have no plans to keep pouring money into it. Actually the only monies I won't be able to recoup is the door rope/gasket I replaced. The end plate & bushing as well as the motor I can return.

But throwing more money into it seems useless. Control board gonna be 3 or 4 hundred, and that wouldn't resolve the initial auger issue.

So looks like I'm gonna have to start a new thread "What kinda pellet stove should I buy". Like to keep it under 4K

Got any stove recommendations let me know. I'm gonna look at Harmon pellet stoves tomorrow.

 

[Miss Bailey]

Today I really took it apart, removed the upper bushing, which every tech told me was not possible, but I did get it out. It was very difficult to do and took some persuasion.

So I went to get a new bushing and fuse, like $10, and came home to put everything back together. Inserted the ratchet into the auger before trying it with the motor, and it felt like it was still difficult to crank.

So I figured why not try it with the motor, hit the start button on the control board, everything lit up like it should, pressed the auger start button.

When I checked the auger I noticed the motor was running continual so I tried lowering and increasing the auger speed on the control board with no success.

So from that I concluded that now after the short which blew the fuse, the control board is not longer functioning properly. It turns on the auger regardless, it's on as soon as you hit start. Not shouldn't come on until you press the auger button and you can set the auger speed 1 - 5 setting. But unfortunately the power is on continuously whether you start the auger or not.

So now I'd have t buy a new control board, $300 - $400 and I'd still have the jamming problem. As the motor was running continuously it of course JAMMED and the motor stopped turning.

Oh, forgot to mention that when I looked at the control board, there is a fuse on the bottom, so I stuck a piece of wire in it to see if it would turn on, which it did.

I should be able to return everything I purchased except the door rope gasket and get a refund. So now it looks like I've got parts!

If you have a Whitfield Advantage I and need a part from mine let me know. The fire bricks are in very good shape, and it does have the larger burn pot, also in decent shape. Of course the blower and ect. If you're in the Plymouth, Mass area you can take the whole thing!

Now I've gotta start shopping for a new stove. Can't complain, got around 25 years out of this one!

 

[Miss Bailey]

Lots of choices out there. I googled Best Pellet Stoves and it seems like all/only the ones sold on Amazon are listed in every list if I found. Be it Top Ten, Best Six or Five......

Not a Harman on those lists. And also noticed that they were all priced around $1,000 - $2,000. Comfort Bilt, Castle, Englander, and Ashley Hearth had good reviews but none were long term.

All the reviews seemed to be one year or at most two seasons of use. I did find a Harman P61 review that mentioned reliability going in to a decade plus with little issues.

Of course price wise a Harman doubles to $4 - 5K installed. Price isn't an issue I just want a good reliable stove!

Oh and I'm thinking of putting the Whitfield on Craigslist. Somebody could always use it for parts.

 

[Miss Bailey]

Forgot to mention that somebody had messaged me asking what I wanted for the stove to which I responded back "make me an offer" but I never heard anything back. So I waited a couple days and now I'll try Craigslist.

 

[Jim Cooper]

Today I really took it apart, removed the upper bushing, which every tech told me was not possible, but I did get it out. It was very difficult to do and took some persuasion.




How did you remove the bushing? I can see the top with the side panel off. I tried pushing on it but it seems like it was pressed in. I can see a tool in my head that expands behind the bushing like a "molly bolt" that attaches to a slide hammer. Not much extra room above it. Maybe a rod with a big fender washer and a slim nut?

Jim Cooper