Wood boiler advice Glenwood/Woodgun/Portage&Main/..?

[rrwoods]

Hi!

New member here

I have owned many wood stoves, love the idea of turning my large wood supply into usable heat instead of shoving it on big piles and burning it out in the open.
At the same time I got tired of tracking dirt, dust, smoke, scorpions, ants and the whole works into the house. So I've been looking into the wood boilers with a hydronic heat system.

I was primarily looking at these brands:
1. Glenwood - currently at the top of the list because their multi fuel boilers (7030M) can automatically switch over to a waste motor oil burner. The downside is that the multifuel boilers are not gasification systems.
2. Alternative heating systems / woodgun. They also have a model WOC40 that can use waste oil as a backup however it seems less sophisticated, manual switch over instead of automatic. They also have a gasification system including one that's stainless steel that's supposedly more resistant against corrosion from the gases in case you use wood that's too wet or run it too cold and get buildup.
3. Portage and main - they don't have any oil backup option but their burners seem to be well liked, so if I decide not to use a backup heat option then PM seems like a good reliable choice.

Does anyone have experience with the Glenwood boilers?

I have not found much information about them except one guy on youtube who goes on and on for hours about everything he dislikes about them. But they've been in business for a long time so I have a hard time believing that they would be THAT bad..

I'm also trying to decide between the gasification systems which seem cleaner and more efficient, but also finicky, vs a traditional (multi fuel) burner which will take anything that burns and is very flexible at the expense of being more efficient. I don't mind to keep my wood under a roof for the summer months , but a lot of them say it also needs to be split and whatnot. I want a boiler that's big enough so that I don't need to be splitting wood.

Thanks!
Rodney

 

[E Yoder]

How critical is having the oil backup? Is there an existing heating system (boiler, forced air) in the house?

 

[maple1]

I want a boiler that's big enough so that I don't need to be splitting wood.

That will be limiting the return on what you are going to spend.

Gasifiers need dry wood, and wood doesn't dry without splitting it. And all boilers work much better with dry wood, not just gasifiers.

If I wanted an OWB, I would first look at the Heatmaster G series. But it is a gasifier, and needs dry wood.

How big of a heat load are we talking? Thinking not very big, in Central Texas? That might lead to a situation where an OWB won't work very well at all, no matter what you get - it might end up spending most of its time smoldering in idle mode.

I would also not get a dual fuel one - most always, dual fuel boilers end up being a compromise somewhere. I would go one unit for each fuel source.

 

[Fred61]

If you're getting into wood burning with the attitude that you will pick up wood anywhere, anytime without processing, stacking and allowing sufficient time for proper drying, now's the time to quit before you've invested your money. It will be an expensive and disappointing journey.

The Wood Gun isn't constructed of stainless for you to burn wet wood in it. It's stainless because there was corrosion problems on the steel units. The corrosive soup that rots out these things is produced by the combustion process. Water is a by-product of combustion whether the wood is wet or dry. As maple1 stated, "Wet wood doesn't burn well in any of these units". Several years back when I had my Wood Gun I threw a wet piece of hemlock in the firebox one night along with a full load of dry wood. The next morning when I opened the door I saw a lonely piece of hemlock only charred, Filled the firebox for the day's run and when I returned at 6 pm the wood had burned out except for the lonely piece of hemlock. This went on for the next 2.5 days until it finely dried out enough to disappear.

I also suggest not buying a dual fuel unit.

 

[rrwoods]

Heat load: I have 4 separate buildings, one is 900 sqft and 3 that are about 750 sqft, so total about 3000 sqft. The heat load is probably bigger than a normal 3000 sqft house since these are smaller buildings so they have a larger exterior wall surface. The winters in Texas vary a lot, sometimes (like this year) it's mild and you don't need to heat much. Sometimes we have a cold winter. Never as cold and for as long as up north of course.

Existing heat: They are portable buildings that came from the oil industry. They have air conditioning and heat built in. The heat is resistive electric. I had thought of putting in propane but actually electricity is cheap here - we pay about 7c/kWh , when you compare that to propane at $2/gal it is about the same price, so it doesn't make sense to convert. Resistive electric is zero maintenance.

This is where the idea of a wood boiler came from - we can have one boiler to serve all four buildings and supply domestic hot water. And we have a lot of wood. I have several cords cut and stacked and many more ready to be cut, but I don't have a wood stove. I would put a hydronic coil in front of the existing forced air system.

The Glenwood dual fuel stove has two separate burn chambers with an electrically operated door - you normally burn wood in the main chamber. When the wood fire goes out and the water starts to cool down, the thermostat will open the door to the oil burner and then the oil burner will keep the water at a base temperature. I thought this would work well for our mild days since, as y'all point out, the wood stoves don't do well with a light heat load.

The Woodgun has a model that's meant to do a batch burn system. Whenever the water cools down you fill it up and light it and it will burn full throttle until it runs out of fuel. I think you can do this with any of the gasifiers. Re-lighting the fire semi-daily may be a hassle though. If you take a 1000 gallon water storage tank and wrap it with say, R50 insulation, would that store the heat effectively?

I've run regular wood stoves for most of my life so I'm used to the stacking and cutting. Most of the wood I've cut was less than 12-14" diameter so not big enough diameter to require splitting.


I will look at the Heatmaster.

 

[rrwoods]

Since the buildings all have resistive electric heat , this can serve as a backup in lieu of the waste oil burner.

 

[maple1]

Yes, 1000 gallons of storage would do wonders. The problem with trying to burn without storage especially with a light heat load is it won't burn until it runs out of fuel - it runs out of load for the heat to go to then shuts down or smolders like crazy.

I know nothing about Glenwood - but what info you say you found about them I think would steer me away.

Can you put up another building, to put boiler & storage in? That would open up the possibilities to indoor units also. Wouldn't need to be all that big. You'd gain another heated space from standby heat loss.

Good underground piping (and you only want to use the good stuff) is in the area of $10-20/foot - if you hadn't checked that far yet & it might make a difference.

 

[rrwoods]

Underground piping: Yes I already had my "you better sit down" moment on the insulated pipe pricing.

I need to redo some of the underground wiring and plumbing anyway which is one of the reasons I try to come up with a plan. Opening trenches back up because you changed your plans is a very pitiful activity.

I'm also building a large workshop (about 8400 sqft enclosed space) but I figured it's too far away to make it feasible, and since it's so much bigger than the house and I will only be there in the weekends, it will be impossible to size a boiler. I will probably just go with a hot air wood furnace for that.

Outbuilding: Yes my plan was to put up a small building so you can keep your supplies in there. Well basically like a carport. My thought was to make the roof out of solar panels and use the Pika inverter to make a partially solar powered electrical circuit with battery backup. That would help keep the heat and a/c running also in case of a power outage (which are quite infrequent here though)

Wood storage and drying: I dismantled an old travel trailer and basically built a wood shed on it. For the bottom and one side I'm using goat wire panels, the other side will be enclosed. That way I can drag my wood shed with me around the property so anything I cut, I can throw it straight in there where it can dry. When heating season starts you drag the trailer in front of the wood burner and throw it in there. The key with firewood is to have it in your hands as few times as possible.

Outdoor vs indoor units: Yes actually I had already decided that an indoor unit in a shed is probably a better setup than an outdoor unit . The price difference pays for the building , and then you can keep all your supplies, wood, plumbing and wiring etc all inside as well. It will be annoying to be refilling the boiler in the pouring rain. -- The Glenwood is an indoor unit as well, and I think so is the Portage & Main,

Glenwood: I only saw one negative review on the Glenwood. Their main multifuel burner has been in production since the mid 90's and the company has existed since about 1980, that's why I took that review with a grain of salt.

 

[Fred61]

If electricity were .07 kwh here you wouldn't see me investing 10 - 15 K in a boiler, splitting wood, stoking, cleaning, dragging wood around. You get the picture. I would install a mini split in each structure and take the rest of the day off. Free wood isn't free if you have to take minutes out of your life to handle it.

 

[rrwoods]

Yeah time is a concern. Last year I was clearing about a 300x400' area with the track loader for my work shop.. It only took me 2-3 days to shove probably 100 trees on piles and burn them. Well I decided to save a couple of big meaty trees for firewood so I spent half a day just dealing with sawing up , moving and stacking the lumber from just those two trees. It's a lot of work.

Then again I have an office job and I see people going to the gym .. where people pay money to do work.. I keep thinking, just swing on by and I'll get you a shovel , you can help me with my trenching.

 

[rrwoods]

I see in your footer that you have an EKO 25. I see that it's discontinued but I see some old stock units for half price. How do you like your EKO?

 

[Fred61]

I see in your footer that you have an EKO 25. I see that it's discontinued but I see some old stock units for half price. How do you like your EKO?

A great boiler. Simple, no bells and whistles, low maintenance. Unfortunately, due to health reasons I've had to remove it from service this year due to health reasons. It is 10 times the boiler that the Wood Gun was. Staying busy trying to sell most all of my non essential stuff. Motor home, rental property, tools, boiler, jeep, etc.