wood gasified boiler and radiant heat

[RedWingsfan]

Hello all,

I'm building a 2000sf house with a basement. I am looking at garn and froling gasified boilers and want to have radiant floor heat. I want to keep under 20k if that is at all possible. Can anyone direct me on the correct size unit and thoughts on this kind of setup? Also, would you have the boiler in a garage or basement? Thanks in advance, sorry new at this.

 

[GENECOP]

Welcome, The Garn (even the smallest ) might be a little big for 2000sft. Sizing is not simply answered by SQFt...other factors like Windows, insulation, room configuration, etc...check out Switzer, they do custom sizes and are every bit as good as Garn...2000 SQFt..many choices.

 

[GENECOP]

BTW, forget the basement UNLESS you have a walkout with good access, getting wood to the unit needs to be easy..

 

[GENECOP]

Radiant is the best delivery system, you could even go with something like SEDORE, set up with and indirect storage tank and you would be good to go, and well under 20,000.

 

[Woodfarmer1]

I have the garn Jr. Works great to heat my basement slab, I have in floor radiant in my main floor. If I could do it over again I would probably use gypcrete as I have high ceilings and have had to add a couple rads.

 

[RedWingsfan]

BTW, forget the basement UNLESS you have a walkout with good access, getting wood to the unit needs to be easy..

Genecop,

Thanks for all the info, if not located in the basement would the garage or separate out building be the best location?

 

[RedWingsfan]

I have the garn Jr. Works great to heat my basement slab, I have in floor radiant in my main floor. If I could do it over again I would probably use gypcrete as I have high ceilings and have had to add a couple rads.

Thank you Woodfarmer,

Is your main floor wood or concrete? I have read gypcrete has issues with cracking? Not saying I know, just what I have read in some articles. I will look into the garn jr as well.

 

[BoiledOver]

Firewood, where and how will you acquire it? Oakland County is Michcon? How about a mod/con gas fired boiler? Very efficient (90-95%)and way less work. Wood fired gasification boilers more in the range of (70-80%) efficient. If purchasing firewood, natural gas prices are equal or less in cost at this time. A newly constructed and well insulated home should not require a great deal to keep warm where you are located. Upfront cost will be less for the gas boiler unit also. If you are not fortunate enough to have NG available, wood fired will beat out the other fossil fuels. For a long life boiler, besides Garn, Lopper builds a real tank of a unit and utilizes lambda controls.

 

[RedWingsfan]

Firewood, where and how will you acquire it? Oakland County is Michcon? How about a mod/con gas fired boiler? Very efficient (90-95%)and way less work. Wood fired gasification boilers more in the range of (70-80%) efficient. If purchasing firewood, natural gas prices are equal or less in cost at this time. A newly constructed and well insulated home should not require a great deal to keep warm where you are located. Upfront cost will be less for the gas boiler unit also. If you are not fortunate enough to have NG available, wood fired will beat out the other fossil fuels. For a long life boiler, besides Garn, Lopper builds a real tank of a unit and utilizes lambda controls.

Boiled,

There is a lot of wood in the area and on property, but obviously I will need to supplement that. The prices I'm seeing for a face cord here runs from about 50 -100 dollars a face cord depending on all the factors. Not sure how fire wood prices compare to natural gas in burn rate. I really don't know about natural gas but I will definitely look at it. I guess my only worry is the volatility of natural gas or any type of fuel for that matter and being subject to the constant up and down prices. I get tired of these companies constantly jacking up our prices, hence the reason why I am trying to make myself a little more self sufficient. Thanks, I will definitely look at NG though.

 

[Bad LP]

I have no evidence of cracking in my poured gypcrete floor at 10 years. It was poured over 3/4 Advantec that sits on 2X12 TGI's on 16 inch centers that rest on triple 2X12 microlams. All designed by Boise. We told them we were using 24 inch square tiles.

Building it bullet proof the first time for a few extra dollars is the only way.

 

[RedWingsfan]

I have no evidence of cracking in my poured gypcrete floor at 10 years. It was poured over 3/4 Advantec that sits on 2X12 TGI's on 16 inch centers that rest on triple 2X12 microlams. All designed by Boise. We told them we were using 24 inch square tiles.

Building it bullet proof the first time for a few extra dollars is the only way.

That is good to know that you are not having issues with cracking. Thanks for the reply.

 

[Woodfarmer1]

My main floor is plywood with engineered hardwood hickory, installer thought to protect the hardwood, they would just run the pex in the floor joist space with pink insulation. Doesn't work that great. Washrooms are travertine, where you can feel the warmth. To understand the problems with my system you can do a search in your spare time.
The basement slab works great because you only need max 120* water. However the main floor I find requires a higher temperature which is more difficult to keep constant with the batch burn boilers.

 

[RedWingsfan]

My main floor is plywood with engineered hardwood hickory, installer thought to protect the hardwood, they would just run the pex in the floor joist space with pink insulation. Doesn't work that great. Washrooms are travertine, where you can feel the warmth. To understand the problems with my system you can do a search in your spare time.
The basement slab works great because you only need max 120* water. However the main floor I find requires a higher temperature which is more difficult to keep constant with the batch burn boilers.

well, if I'm going to go with the radiant heat sounds like putting the pex under the floor joists is not the way to go? Better to have concrete or gypcrete on the main floor I guess if its not keeping you warm with the wood flooring.

 

[ihookem]

I have 1,000 ft 1/2" pex and it works very good. I run the EKO 25 all winter and it never cools down though. If ya fire it up , let it cool and fire up again, that would not work well. A steady flow of 160 degree hot water makes my fluffy carpeted floor nice and toasty. No storage.

 

[Woodfarmer1]

My problem is half my house is 25x30 with 19' sidewall, a 12/12 pitch cathedral ceiling and lots of windows and doors.
I'm not sure if having a forced air system would have made much difference either.

 

[Woodfarmer1]

I have 1,000 ft 1/2" pex and it works very good. I run the EKO 25 all winter and it never cools down though. If ya fire it up , let it cool and fire up again, that would not work well. A steady flow of 160 degree hot water makes my fluffy carpeted floor nice and toasty. No storage.

That doesn't work to well when you go to work for 8 hours, I had an empyre 100 and it wouldn't do much.

 

[RedWingsfan]

I have 1,000 ft 1/2" pex and it works very good. I run the EKO 25 all winter and it never cools down though. If ya fire it up , let it cool and fire up again, that would not work well. A steady flow of 160 degree hot water makes my fluffy carpeted floor nice and toasty. No storage.

Would you buy the EKO 25 again if you had to do it all over?

 

[maple1]

If I was doing a new boiler RIGHT NOW, my first on the list would be the Tarm Bonus that is on sale right now. I would put storage in the basement. Whether you want the boiler there too, or in an outbuilding, is more of a personal preference & situation thing - that aspect could be debated on here for a long time, lol. Mine is in my basment, along with my winters wood.

Having said that, if I was building a new house right now, a boiler might not be my first pick. A clean slate energy efficiency wise, and what is out there today for that & heating choices, kind of questions the wisdom of a boiler setup. E.g., NG or mini-split heat pumps combined with a nice wood stove for supplemental heat.

 

[Bad LP]

If I was doing a new boiler RIGHT NOW, my first on the list would be the Tarm Bonus that is on sale right now. I would put storage in the basement. Whether you want the boiler there too, or in an outbuilding, is more of a personal preference & situation thing - that aspect could be debated on here for a long time, lol. Mine is in my basment, along with my winters wood.

Having said that, if I was building a new house right now, a boiler might not be my first pick. A clean slate energy efficiency wise, and what is out there today for that & heating choices, kind of questions the wisdom of a boiler setup. E.g., NG or mini-split heat pumps combined with a nice wood stove for supplemental heat.

Why would you choose the Tarm over the Varm you have?

 

[maple1]

I should have added a couple more words to that - first on the list to check out...

I can't say I would pick it over what I have now - for my situation & place, I am quite sure I would still get the Varm. But in the OPs situation, I would first check out the Tarm simply because of its current clearance pricing. I am not seeing any performance advantages, only pricing. Which likely won't last too awful long.

 

[Bad LP]

I should have added a couple more words to that - first on the list to check out...

I can't say I would pick it over what I have now - for my situation & place, I am quite sure I would still get the Varm. But in the OPs situation, I would first check out the Tarm simply because of its current clearance pricing. I am not seeing any performance advantages, only pricing. Which likely won't last too awful long.

The price is very attractive but the output is a little on the low side. I like the Varm due to the easy cleaning capabilities and if I get too old or unfit for burning cordwood it can be fed pellets.